lowecur
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StarFish to based in Denver
- Thread starter lowecur
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Hose A. Jiminez
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General Lee
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F9 Driver
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I'd like to know how they intend to compete as a low COST carrier when their CASM for last quarter was 10.1 cents. That is operating at a competitive advantage, disregarding much of their debt, under chapter 11 protection.
Frontier's CASM for the same period was 8.13 cents, Southwest's was 7.46 cents, and Jet Blue's was 7.06 cents. We are already looking at average fares in the $105 range.
Frontier makes money at that level. Untied looses big bucks. So lets push it lower! They are trying to drive volume like a LCC and slitting their throats in the process.
Good idea Glenn
Frontier's CASM for the same period was 8.13 cents, Southwest's was 7.46 cents, and Jet Blue's was 7.06 cents. We are already looking at average fares in the $105 range.
Frontier makes money at that level. Untied looses big bucks. So lets push it lower! They are trying to drive volume like a LCC and slitting their throats in the process.
Good idea Glenn
bobbysamd
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United LCC
As a practical matter and as a Denver resident I'd like to see it succeed. But Frontier has really established itself as a dominant carrier and I think that United has left a bad taste in a lot of people's mouths.
Read this article and this series in the Denver Post if you want to see what I mean.
As a practical matter and as a Denver resident I'd like to see it succeed. But Frontier has really established itself as a dominant carrier and I think that United has left a bad taste in a lot of people's mouths.
Read this article and this series in the Denver Post if you want to see what I mean.
Starfish and United will rely on low-wage paying MESA to do a lot of the flying. Hmmmm, should I fly on a new Frontier A319 or a Mesa/UAL CRJ-700 for a 2+ hour flight? No question - Frontier. By the way, I saw a Frontier A318 for the first time a few days ago - neat little aircraft.... Looked like a fun airplane to fly.
Question realted to Starfish - will its pilots have to resign from UAL and stay permanently at Starfish? I thought that was the original plan....
Question realted to Starfish - will its pilots have to resign from UAL and stay permanently at Starfish? I thought that was the original plan....
Question realted to Starfish - will its pilots have to resign from UAL and stay permanently at Starfish? I thought that was the original plan....
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Song and Delta will rely on low-wage paying ASA to do a lot of the flying. Hmmmm, should I fly on a new Airtran 717 or an ASA/Delta CRJ-700 for a 2+ hour flight? No question - Airtran. By the way, I saw an Airtran 717 for the first time a few days ago - neat little aircraft.... Looked like a fun airplane to fly.
Question related to Song - will its pilots have to resign from Delta and stay permanently at Song? I thought that was the original plan....
---See what it sounds like when the facts get twisted?
General Lee
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Mugs,
Fred Reid said that Song's CASM was near 7.0, and that is with the high paid pilots. All the other savings come from separate flight attendants, gate agents, Delta's low fuel hedging, use of Delta Technologies logistic support, and the 199 seats on the 757. You are right about the numerous CRJs we have, but the rumor was out today that Delta management has already sent it's 100 seater request to purchasing--and they will make the deals. We will have those 100 seaters to compete with Jetblue and Airtran by 2006 (Jetblue doesn't get their EMB-190s for two more years anyways). We are going to compete and succeed. Good luck to you.
Bye Bye---General Lee
Fred Reid said that Song's CASM was near 7.0, and that is with the high paid pilots. All the other savings come from separate flight attendants, gate agents, Delta's low fuel hedging, use of Delta Technologies logistic support, and the 199 seats on the 757. You are right about the numerous CRJs we have, but the rumor was out today that Delta management has already sent it's 100 seater request to purchasing--and they will make the deals. We will have those 100 seaters to compete with Jetblue and Airtran by 2006 (Jetblue doesn't get their EMB-190s for two more years anyways). We are going to compete and succeed. Good luck to you.
Bye Bye---General Lee
Here is info on the United LCO operation posted today by the company:
"United today announced that Denver International Airport will serve as the launch hub for its new low-cost operation (LCO), an essential element within United's portfolio of products. The LCO will serve predominantly leisure markets and feature a simplified fare structure with low-cost business and leisure fare options. The LCO will launch in February 2004.
"The United low-cost operation and its attractiveness to leisure and business travelers perfectly complement our mainline and United Express operations, and those of our Star Alliance partners," says Sean Donohue, vice president-Low Cost Operation. "We've made significant reductions in our cost structure this year, allowing our low-cost operation to be competitive, profitable and sustainable. The LCO will be operated entirely by United employees and part of the strong brand and portfolio of products that our customers expect us to provide."
"Tickets will go on sale in November through all existing sales channels, including united.com, United Reservations, travel agents and on-line reservation systems, and later via sales channels unique to the LCO. The LCO branding, such as name and livery, will be unveiled later this year; the LCO will be a United-branded product.
"The LCO fleet will launch with four Airbus A320 aircraft in Denver, expanding to approximately 40 A320s by the end of 2004, 19 of which will be based in Denver. Each plane will be configured with 156 seats, including Economy Plus(R) seats with extra legroom. From Denver, the LCO will fly to Reno, Las Vegas, Phoenix, New Orleans, Tampa, Los Angeles (Ontario), and Orlando. Additional destinations will be announced at a later date.
"All seats will be pre-assigned, and food and beverage service will be available on board. United customers will earn Mileage Plus(R) miles on the LCO, and United's suite of Easy products, including EasyCheck-in(sm) and EasyUpdate(sm), will be available to LCO customers.
The LCO will complement United's mainline and United Express service from Denver, the company's second-largest hub, and will be fully integrated into the United and United Express network. LCO customers will enjoy seamless connections to United, United Express and Star Alliance flights, including baggage check-through.
"The LCO really underscores our long-term commitment to Denver, to Denver International Airport, and to our United and United Express employees in this community," says Pete McDonald, executive vice president-Operations. "It also signals our intent to offer consumers more choice, more flights, more destinations, and simplified, lower fares on the LCO routes."
----------------------------------------------------
Q and A
----------------------------------------------------
Q. How will United's LCO be different from other low-cost carriers?
A. United's LCO will be the only low-cost carrier that benefits from mainline connectivity -- not just cheaper point-to-point flights. Passengers will have seamless access to United's unparalleled global route network, United's suite of high-tech check-in and customer information offerings, including EasyCheck-in and EasyUpdate, as well as membership in United's Mileage Plus program, one of the highest-rated frequent flyer programs worldwide. United's LCO also will offer assigned seating and the Economy Plus section.
Q. Are LCO employees also United employees? Do they have different contracts from mainline employees? What are the terms?
A. Absolutely. Represented LCO employees are United employees, and they have the same contracts as United employees.
Q. How will this operation be different from United Shuttle?
A. We now have significant, long-term cost reductions that allow our LCO to be competitive, profitable and sustainable over the long term.
Q. Will the LCO drain customers from existing mainline flying?
A. The LCO will allow the company to provide distinct service in select leisure markets, supplementing our mainline flying. The LCO will add seats and frequencies in these markets, providing maximum value for its existing customer base and attracting new customers who might not have considered flying mainline United. The LCO will have its own route network, but there will be some routes served by both mainline and United's low-cost carrier.
Q. Do you plan on adding other destinations in the future?
A. Absolutely.
Q. Will Denver be the LCO's only hub?
A. No, the company will announce other hubs at a later date.
Q. Why is this plan different from the plan you originally announced for the LCO earlier in the year?
A. We were able to obtain significant cost reductions during our collective bargaining negotiations that precluded the need for separate agreements for the LCO. Coupled with other cost reductions, we now have a cost structure that makes us competitive with low-cost carriers across the board. The LCO offers a more competitive economic model in specific leisure markets, and we'll offer LCO flying in those markets. United's goal in the restructuring of our business model was to create an airline that is competitive across all market segments, and we believe we are succeeding.
Q. Have you determined a marketing budget for the LCO? How can you afford to launch a new product when you're still in Chapter 11 bankruptcy?
A. United will make appropriate investments in advertising and other marketing efforts to ensure the success of United's LCO. The exact timing and financial details of the campaign are proprietary information that would be inappropriate to disclose at this time. The low-cost airfare market cannot be ignored in today's highly competitive airline industry, and an entry into this arena has always been part of United's plans for restructuring our business. We have a formula for a successful entry into this market, and we believe our incremental ramp-up of the LCO is a logical and responsible approach to entering the LCO market successfully.
Skirt
"United today announced that Denver International Airport will serve as the launch hub for its new low-cost operation (LCO), an essential element within United's portfolio of products. The LCO will serve predominantly leisure markets and feature a simplified fare structure with low-cost business and leisure fare options. The LCO will launch in February 2004.
"The United low-cost operation and its attractiveness to leisure and business travelers perfectly complement our mainline and United Express operations, and those of our Star Alliance partners," says Sean Donohue, vice president-Low Cost Operation. "We've made significant reductions in our cost structure this year, allowing our low-cost operation to be competitive, profitable and sustainable. The LCO will be operated entirely by United employees and part of the strong brand and portfolio of products that our customers expect us to provide."
"Tickets will go on sale in November through all existing sales channels, including united.com, United Reservations, travel agents and on-line reservation systems, and later via sales channels unique to the LCO. The LCO branding, such as name and livery, will be unveiled later this year; the LCO will be a United-branded product.
"The LCO fleet will launch with four Airbus A320 aircraft in Denver, expanding to approximately 40 A320s by the end of 2004, 19 of which will be based in Denver. Each plane will be configured with 156 seats, including Economy Plus(R) seats with extra legroom. From Denver, the LCO will fly to Reno, Las Vegas, Phoenix, New Orleans, Tampa, Los Angeles (Ontario), and Orlando. Additional destinations will be announced at a later date.
"All seats will be pre-assigned, and food and beverage service will be available on board. United customers will earn Mileage Plus(R) miles on the LCO, and United's suite of Easy products, including EasyCheck-in(sm) and EasyUpdate(sm), will be available to LCO customers.
The LCO will complement United's mainline and United Express service from Denver, the company's second-largest hub, and will be fully integrated into the United and United Express network. LCO customers will enjoy seamless connections to United, United Express and Star Alliance flights, including baggage check-through.
"The LCO really underscores our long-term commitment to Denver, to Denver International Airport, and to our United and United Express employees in this community," says Pete McDonald, executive vice president-Operations. "It also signals our intent to offer consumers more choice, more flights, more destinations, and simplified, lower fares on the LCO routes."
----------------------------------------------------
Q and A
----------------------------------------------------
Q. How will United's LCO be different from other low-cost carriers?
A. United's LCO will be the only low-cost carrier that benefits from mainline connectivity -- not just cheaper point-to-point flights. Passengers will have seamless access to United's unparalleled global route network, United's suite of high-tech check-in and customer information offerings, including EasyCheck-in and EasyUpdate, as well as membership in United's Mileage Plus program, one of the highest-rated frequent flyer programs worldwide. United's LCO also will offer assigned seating and the Economy Plus section.
Q. Are LCO employees also United employees? Do they have different contracts from mainline employees? What are the terms?
A. Absolutely. Represented LCO employees are United employees, and they have the same contracts as United employees.
Q. How will this operation be different from United Shuttle?
A. We now have significant, long-term cost reductions that allow our LCO to be competitive, profitable and sustainable over the long term.
Q. Will the LCO drain customers from existing mainline flying?
A. The LCO will allow the company to provide distinct service in select leisure markets, supplementing our mainline flying. The LCO will add seats and frequencies in these markets, providing maximum value for its existing customer base and attracting new customers who might not have considered flying mainline United. The LCO will have its own route network, but there will be some routes served by both mainline and United's low-cost carrier.
Q. Do you plan on adding other destinations in the future?
A. Absolutely.
Q. Will Denver be the LCO's only hub?
A. No, the company will announce other hubs at a later date.
Q. Why is this plan different from the plan you originally announced for the LCO earlier in the year?
A. We were able to obtain significant cost reductions during our collective bargaining negotiations that precluded the need for separate agreements for the LCO. Coupled with other cost reductions, we now have a cost structure that makes us competitive with low-cost carriers across the board. The LCO offers a more competitive economic model in specific leisure markets, and we'll offer LCO flying in those markets. United's goal in the restructuring of our business model was to create an airline that is competitive across all market segments, and we believe we are succeeding.
Q. Have you determined a marketing budget for the LCO? How can you afford to launch a new product when you're still in Chapter 11 bankruptcy?
A. United will make appropriate investments in advertising and other marketing efforts to ensure the success of United's LCO. The exact timing and financial details of the campaign are proprietary information that would be inappropriate to disclose at this time. The low-cost airfare market cannot be ignored in today's highly competitive airline industry, and an entry into this arena has always been part of United's plans for restructuring our business. We have a formula for a successful entry into this market, and we believe our incremental ramp-up of the LCO is a logical and responsible approach to entering the LCO market successfully.
Skirt
F9 Driver
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Hey Muggs...
You have got that right! But I don't think, imo, that it'll be UAL. I'm afraid that if UAL goes away someone with a better idea of how to operate a successful airline (mostly an oxymoron anyway) will come in and make us work harder.
The company line is close to Boyd's quote. I'm not crazy about some of his stuff, but check out his website http://www.aviationplanning.com/
http://www.denverpost.com/Stories/0,1413,36~26385~1639001,00.html
Aviation consultant Mike Boyd said United is making a mistake by launching the discount operation.
"Frontier is probably on the floor laughing," said Boyd, president of Evergreen-based airline consulting firm the Boyd Group. "When you see your major competitor make mistakes, it's always comforting."
You have got that right! But I don't think, imo, that it'll be UAL. I'm afraid that if UAL goes away someone with a better idea of how to operate a successful airline (mostly an oxymoron anyway) will come in and make us work harder.
The company line is close to Boyd's quote. I'm not crazy about some of his stuff, but check out his website http://www.aviationplanning.com/
http://www.denverpost.com/Stories/0,1413,36~26385~1639001,00.html
Aviation consultant Mike Boyd said United is making a mistake by launching the discount operation.
"Frontier is probably on the floor laughing," said Boyd, president of Evergreen-based airline consulting firm the Boyd Group. "When you see your major competitor make mistakes, it's always comforting."
P3-Adub
Bye Bye !!!
- Joined
- Nov 28, 2001
- Posts
- 195
UAl Going Away ???
Afraid not, much to a lot of folks dissmay, United will be around for a long time to come. There will be plenty of pie to go around for everyone. Don't jump too quick, United is still in BK and the cards are not fully on the table. Remember the idiots that shelved the Shuttle did so at a time when it just becoming profitable. Should have expanded at that time rather than quit. May not be the darling new startup that everyone is so enamored with these days but it is activity that is somewhat proactive rather than hanging on to the same old business model that does not work anymore. Let the passengers speak for themselves as to what they will like and dislike. Too many self proclaimed aviation experts on these boards.
General Lee, you should work in marketing !!! Never seen anyone toot their own horn as much as you, nice to see you guys have something to talk about ! Song, who would have thought airlines would be called such goofy names only a few years ago? Starfish ??? Sure hope that is not what Tilton calls it, the name really stinks in my opinion. I suggest Shuttle by United, as before but with new management that is committed to making it work. Save a bunch on labeling and other startup costs. The Airbus makes some sense as we will be able to fly the longer routes and offer similar ammenities as our LCC competitors, please lets not be too trivial on detail, most pax don't really care that much as long as it is cheap.
LCCs are here to stay I am afraid. Low wages are here to stay as well I fear. Good thing we all love to fly and are such giving souls, otherwise airline management would have to pay decent salaries once again, remember those days ? Most of the commentators on these boards don't I see.
Afraid not, much to a lot of folks dissmay, United will be around for a long time to come. There will be plenty of pie to go around for everyone. Don't jump too quick, United is still in BK and the cards are not fully on the table. Remember the idiots that shelved the Shuttle did so at a time when it just becoming profitable. Should have expanded at that time rather than quit. May not be the darling new startup that everyone is so enamored with these days but it is activity that is somewhat proactive rather than hanging on to the same old business model that does not work anymore. Let the passengers speak for themselves as to what they will like and dislike. Too many self proclaimed aviation experts on these boards.
General Lee, you should work in marketing !!! Never seen anyone toot their own horn as much as you, nice to see you guys have something to talk about ! Song, who would have thought airlines would be called such goofy names only a few years ago? Starfish ??? Sure hope that is not what Tilton calls it, the name really stinks in my opinion. I suggest Shuttle by United, as before but with new management that is committed to making it work. Save a bunch on labeling and other startup costs. The Airbus makes some sense as we will be able to fly the longer routes and offer similar ammenities as our LCC competitors, please lets not be too trivial on detail, most pax don't really care that much as long as it is cheap.
LCCs are here to stay I am afraid. Low wages are here to stay as well I fear. Good thing we all love to fly and are such giving souls, otherwise airline management would have to pay decent salaries once again, remember those days ? Most of the commentators on these boards don't I see.
F9 Driver
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- 515
I love the idea about the projectors P-3
I'll forward that to marketing
My crystal ball is fuzzy too, but the ones saying UAL is on its' last legs aren't just self proclaimed know-it-alls. People getting paid for their opinions (professionals?) seem to vote no confidence whenever asked.
http://www.denverpost.com/Stories/0,1413,36~130~1641277,00.html
"What should we call the new low-cost carrier United Airlines unveiled Wednesday at Denver International Airport?
Branding is one of the steps that usually comes before the unveiling, but as far as anybody knows, United has only code-named this effort Starfish - a creature that is A) flightless and B) more or less blind.
Should we call it Frozen Mackerel? Or Flounder? Or Half-Baked Clam?
"You don't get up and announce a new airline and don't even know what you're going to call it," quips Evergreen-based aviation consultant Mike Boyd. "It clearly shows that they don't have any direction as they wind through bankruptcy." "
" "There is nothing inherently flawed about the logic of such an operation for United," says Lehman Brothers analyst Gary Chase. "But the carrier does face huge execution challenges in getting it right." And Joseph Schwieterman, a professor and transportation expert at DePaul University in Chicago, says the plan is disappointingly small, considering the threat United faces: "United needs to think more boldly about this competitive problem."
On the other hand, the plan - though possibly desperate and ill-conceived - may allow United to experiment with a segment of the market that it does not understand without putting a lot at risk.
Because odds may be against United succeeding in this arena, the airline is wise to start small.
For now, the plan is so small, nobody feels threatened, including United's unions and Denver's key low-cost carrier Frontier Airlines.
"The danger for Frontier is that they die of laughter," Boyd says.
Frontier spokesman Joe Hodas did, however, manage to answer the phone between gasps of air.
"It's fine for them to experiment," he says. "But they are in bankruptcy. They haven't even shown that they can lose less than $100 million in a month." "
I'll forward that to marketing
My crystal ball is fuzzy too, but the ones saying UAL is on its' last legs aren't just self proclaimed know-it-alls. People getting paid for their opinions (professionals?) seem to vote no confidence whenever asked.
http://www.denverpost.com/Stories/0,1413,36~130~1641277,00.html
"What should we call the new low-cost carrier United Airlines unveiled Wednesday at Denver International Airport?
Branding is one of the steps that usually comes before the unveiling, but as far as anybody knows, United has only code-named this effort Starfish - a creature that is A) flightless and B) more or less blind.
Should we call it Frozen Mackerel? Or Flounder? Or Half-Baked Clam?
"You don't get up and announce a new airline and don't even know what you're going to call it," quips Evergreen-based aviation consultant Mike Boyd. "It clearly shows that they don't have any direction as they wind through bankruptcy." "
" "There is nothing inherently flawed about the logic of such an operation for United," says Lehman Brothers analyst Gary Chase. "But the carrier does face huge execution challenges in getting it right." And Joseph Schwieterman, a professor and transportation expert at DePaul University in Chicago, says the plan is disappointingly small, considering the threat United faces: "United needs to think more boldly about this competitive problem."
On the other hand, the plan - though possibly desperate and ill-conceived - may allow United to experiment with a segment of the market that it does not understand without putting a lot at risk.
Because odds may be against United succeeding in this arena, the airline is wise to start small.
For now, the plan is so small, nobody feels threatened, including United's unions and Denver's key low-cost carrier Frontier Airlines.
"The danger for Frontier is that they die of laughter," Boyd says.
Frontier spokesman Joe Hodas did, however, manage to answer the phone between gasps of air.
"It's fine for them to experiment," he says. "But they are in bankruptcy. They haven't even shown that they can lose less than $100 million in a month." "
F9:
Isn't Al Lewis the aviation expert that wrote the article a few months ago about the pilot profession boiling down to nothing more than drinking coffee and having the skill to locate the autopilot button? If I recall, those were his exact thoughts on what pilots were really all about.
Reuters
United Needs Issues Solved Before Filing
Friday September 19, 7:16 pm ET
By Kathy Fieweger
CHICAGO (Reuters) - United Airlines needs to resolve four major issues before filing an updated business plan to the federal government seeking loan guarantees, an executive said on Friday.
Jake Brace, United's Chief Financial Officer, told Reuters after a court hearing here that there was no specific timetable by which United, the world's second largest airline and a unit of UAL Corp. (OTC BB:UALAQ.OB - News), planned to file the updated plan with the Air Transportation Stabilization Board in Washington.
The agency was charged with handing out up to $10 billion in government-backed loans to worthy airlines. United applied for such backing of a $2.0 billion loan in the summer of 2002 but was rejected late last year, prompting it to file for bankruptcy.
Brace said the four issues that need to be resolved center on pensions, a contractual agreement with Atlantic Coast Airlines Inc. (NasdaqNM:ACAI - News), municipal bond litigation and rejection of aircraft leases under what is known as section 1110 of the bankruptcy code.
Under the agency's mandate, the government can back 90 percent of the private sector loan but the airline must arrange the other 10 percent on its own.
Now, as the Chapter 11 process continues to unfold, United has begun its search for exit financing and intends to apply to the government for the loan guarantees to raise cash needed to get out of bankruptcy.
Brace also said United may seek to raise more than $2 billion in financing through other means, but declined to specify in what form or through what capital markets.
INDUSTRY REVENUE IMPROVING
After war in Iraq and the deadly Severe Acute Respiratory Syndrome pummeled airline revenues yet again earlier this year, Brace said the revenue environment has improved significantly, aiding United in updating its business plan as part of the Chapter 11 exit strategy.
"The revenue environment's turned around considerably," Brace said. "Bookings are good."
August unit revenue for United rose 15 percent, Brace said, well above the industry's 9-percent systemwide gain.
However, the pension issues alone are significant, and while the airline continues to lobby for legislative changes to cope with a massive underfunded pension obligation, it is unclear whether Washington will be willing to step in.
Both the Senate and House are working on pension funding bills that would give a break to U.S. companies, including airlines that are struggling to keep traditional pensions funded.
A Senate panel has already approved one version.
Isn't Al Lewis the aviation expert that wrote the article a few months ago about the pilot profession boiling down to nothing more than drinking coffee and having the skill to locate the autopilot button? If I recall, those were his exact thoughts on what pilots were really all about.
Reuters
United Needs Issues Solved Before Filing
Friday September 19, 7:16 pm ET
By Kathy Fieweger
CHICAGO (Reuters) - United Airlines needs to resolve four major issues before filing an updated business plan to the federal government seeking loan guarantees, an executive said on Friday.
Jake Brace, United's Chief Financial Officer, told Reuters after a court hearing here that there was no specific timetable by which United, the world's second largest airline and a unit of UAL Corp. (OTC BB:UALAQ.OB - News), planned to file the updated plan with the Air Transportation Stabilization Board in Washington.
The agency was charged with handing out up to $10 billion in government-backed loans to worthy airlines. United applied for such backing of a $2.0 billion loan in the summer of 2002 but was rejected late last year, prompting it to file for bankruptcy.
Brace said the four issues that need to be resolved center on pensions, a contractual agreement with Atlantic Coast Airlines Inc. (NasdaqNM:ACAI - News), municipal bond litigation and rejection of aircraft leases under what is known as section 1110 of the bankruptcy code.
Under the agency's mandate, the government can back 90 percent of the private sector loan but the airline must arrange the other 10 percent on its own.
Now, as the Chapter 11 process continues to unfold, United has begun its search for exit financing and intends to apply to the government for the loan guarantees to raise cash needed to get out of bankruptcy.
Brace also said United may seek to raise more than $2 billion in financing through other means, but declined to specify in what form or through what capital markets.
INDUSTRY REVENUE IMPROVING
After war in Iraq and the deadly Severe Acute Respiratory Syndrome pummeled airline revenues yet again earlier this year, Brace said the revenue environment has improved significantly, aiding United in updating its business plan as part of the Chapter 11 exit strategy.
"The revenue environment's turned around considerably," Brace said. "Bookings are good."
August unit revenue for United rose 15 percent, Brace said, well above the industry's 9-percent systemwide gain.
However, the pension issues alone are significant, and while the airline continues to lobby for legislative changes to cope with a massive underfunded pension obligation, it is unclear whether Washington will be willing to step in.
Both the Senate and House are working on pension funding bills that would give a break to U.S. companies, including airlines that are struggling to keep traditional pensions funded.
A Senate panel has already approved one version.
F9 Driver
Wear The Fox Hat
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- Dec 15, 2001
- Posts
- 515
I didn't know he was on my jumpseat
I didn't read that article, and don't think he calls himself an aviation expert. He's just a business writer I think. The fifth estate - go figure!
What ever happened to the deadline that the ATSB established for loan applications (about a year ago?) I guess that Tilton doesn't think it applies to him? Or am I missing something?
I didn't read that article, and don't think he calls himself an aviation expert. He's just a business writer I think. The fifth estate - go figure!
What ever happened to the deadline that the ATSB established for loan applications (about a year ago?) I guess that Tilton doesn't think it applies to him? Or am I missing something?
rightrudder
Well-known member
- Joined
- Jan 8, 2002
- Posts
- 505
You are missing something. UAL was told they could reapply later when they had their business plan reorganized. They did meet the initial deadline, so it will not be a new application, just an updated one.
By the way, why such hostility toward UAL? You guys at F9 are doing very well these days. Can't you be satisfied that your company is growing, thriving and that your own job is secure? You seem to take joy in UAL's problems.
By the way, why such hostility toward UAL? You guys at F9 are doing very well these days. Can't you be satisfied that your company is growing, thriving and that your own job is secure? You seem to take joy in UAL's problems.
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