Southwest CEO: 'I'd rather have a customer than a bag fee'

[Candide]

A few weeks ago, I confronted Scope Out RJs with the challenge below. Apparently, I need to extend the invitation to johnsonrod, MaxPowers, and General Lee.

I completely agree that as a profession, we need to discourage the practice of pilots paying employers for the right of employment (i.e. PFT). But, if you guys are going to deride fellow pilots for simply investing in their career to bolster their resume, you better not have:

1. Attended a civilian flight school or aviation college. By definition, they cost money. Quite a bit of money, in fact.
2. Paid any money pursuing your CFI, Commercial, MEL, ATP, FEw. etc. These are "ratings", just like a 737 type is a rating; ink on a license.
3. Worked at an airline for which first year pay was significantly lower than second year pay (this is a mechanism for subsidizing training costs).

So, without further ado, here's your challenge:

So...Scope out RJ's, as a SWA pilot, I challenge you to a little duel. I've listed below every expenditure I've ever made to advance my career (flight school, CFI, Comm, Multi, ATP, type ratings, etc.). I challenge you to do the same.

If my expenditures exceed your expenditures, you may continue to insult my job Southwest as being "PFT" without regard to the statement's accuracy. But: If you've spent more to get your job at Delta than I've spent to get my job at Southwest, I will reserve the right to call you out for being a PFT'er after every post you make.

In your rather odd world, virtue is defined by not investing in one's career. So, how do you compare?

Me:
Flight school: $0
Comm: $100 for Mil Equivalency prep/exam
ATP written: $120 for test prep, exam
ATP flight: $0 (flown in military aircraft w/FAA examiner)
737 type: $0
=$220 total

You: ?

BTW, Scope Out RJs did not take the challenge. Instead, he descended into a series of increasingly profane and irrational rants, most of which were deleted by a moderator.

 

[B727Driver]

BTW, Scope Out RJs did not take the challenge. Instead, he descended into a series of increasingly profane and irrational rants, most of which were deleted by a moderator.

At least he is consistent. Moderator, it’s about time.

 

[dicko]

Who paid for your training?

Let me guess........your 747 capt. daddy?

Who's your Daddy Rod ?

 

[johnsonrod]

Who's your Daddy Rod ?

He's retired now, and spends Winters at his condo skiing Steamboat, and Summers in Minnesota on a lake. I hope to do the same eventually.

 

[johnsonrod]

A few weeks ago, I confronted Scope Out RJs with the challenge below. Apparently, I need to extend the invitation to johnsonrod, MaxPowers, and General Lee.

I completely agree that as a profession, we need to discourage the practice of pilots paying employers for the right of employment (i.e. PFT). But, if you guys are going to deride fellow pilots for simply investing in their career to bolster their resume, you better not have:

1. Attended a civilian flight school or aviation college. By definition, they cost money. Quite a bit of money, in fact.
2. Paid any money pursuing your CFI, Commercial, MEL, ATP, FEw. etc. These are "ratings", just like a 737 type is a rating; ink on a license.
3. Worked at an airline for which first year pay was significantly lower than second year pay (this is a mechanism for subsidizing training costs



So, without further ado, here's your challenge:


BTW, Scope Out RJs did not take the challenge. Instead, he descended into a series of increasingly profane and irrational rants, most of which were deleted by a moderator.

I finished my ratings as I finished college, and then moved from crappy aviation job to small cargo, to my current company. I will not pay even more to further my career because I think by now I've paid enough through HARD WORK and experience. I shouldn't have to pay even more, that just isn't right.

 

[Candide]

I shouldn't have to pay even more, that just isn't right.

A few observations:

1. First and foremost, you're a fellow airline pilot, therefore I have a great deal of respect for you and wish the absolute best for your future. I hope you do get on with Delta and that Delta returns to inflation adjusted Contract2000 +. I sincerely do. This profession has been in a tailspin; I want the other majors to get at least our wages and work rules for narrowbody, and exceed our rates for widebody.

2. If you feel like you don't want to invest any more money into your career and therefore won't apply to SWA since you don't have a 737 type rating, that's perfectly fine. But please realize that we all invest some money into our careers (your flight school expenses far exceed a type rating). And to castigate the group of your fellow pilots who are almost single-handedly preserving pilot wages in this forlorn industry is counterproductive as well as hypocritical.

3. You may want to reconsider your hobby of saturating this board with your views on how Airtran and Southwest should integrate their pilot groups. We're at the next level up. Some pilots at both airlines have been around almost as long as your dad. And we don't appreciate your oddly prolific and disquietingly extreme "viewpoint" added to our already contentious situation.

 

[johnsonrod]

A few observations:

1. First and foremost, you're a fellow airline pilot, therefore I have a great deal of respect for you and wish the absolute best for your future. I hope you do get on with Delta and that Delta returns to inflation adjusted Contract2000 +. I sincerely do. This profession has been in a tailspin; I want the other majors to get at least our wages and work rules for narrowbody, and exceed our rates for widebody.

2. If you feel like you don't want to invest any more money into your career and therefore won't apply to SWA since you don't have a 737 type rating, that's perfectly fine. But please realize that we all invest some money into our careers (your flight school expenses far exceed a type rating). And to castigate the group of your fellow pilots who are almost single-handedly preserving pilot wages in this forlorn industry is counterproductive as well as
hypocritical.

3. You may want to reconsider your hobby of saturating this board with your views on how Airtran and Southwest should integrate their pilot groups. We're at the next level up. Some pilots at both airlines have been around almost as long as your dad. And we don't appreciate your oddly prolific and disquietingly extreme "viewpoint" added to our already contentious situation.

First off, thanks for the good wishes, I do hope to get an interview with that certain airline, and move forward from there. As far as you doing what you needed to do to "further" your career, unfortunately you had to do it that way. It's hard to justify that with your extremely profitable company. Respect goes both ways. And guys like my dad would shake his head at guys like you who had to buy their way into a job. Also, I will continue to give my viewpoints when needed. I am impressed with this Delta guy FDJ2, he seems to have very good insight on the SLI process. I suggest you reread his posts.

 

[Candide]

First off, thanks for the good wishes, I do hope to get an interview with that certain airline, and move forward from there. As far as you doing what you needed to do to "further" your career, unfortunately you had to do it that way. It's hard to justify that with your extremely profitable company. Respect goes both ways. And guys like my dad would shake his head at guys like you who had to buy their way into a job. Also, I will continue to give my viewpoints when needed. I am impressed with this Delta guy FDJ2, he seems to have very good insight on the SLI process. I suggest you reread his posts.

Apparently you didn't notice the part about how I paid ABSOLUTELY NOTHING FOR ANY RATINGS. My 737 type rating cost me the $1.50 in gas it took to drive to the FSDO with my Navy log book and training jacket in hand. But, I realize that I was largely lucky in this regard; therefore, I don't criticize you for paying for the relatively extremely high cost of your flight training.

Please consider this exchange as a teaching point illustrating the importance of listening more and talking less.

 

[johnsonrod]

Apparently you didn't notice the part about how I paid ABSOLUTELY NOTHING FOR ANY RATINGS. My 737 type rating cost me the $1.50 in gas it took to drive to the FSDO with my Navy log book and training jacket in hand. But, I realize that I was largely lucky in this regard; therefore, I don't criticize you for paying for the relatively extremely high cost of your flight training.

Please consider this exchange as a teaching point illustrating the importance of listening more and talking less.

Talking less? You can hear me? If you didn't pay for your type, then Grrrrreat. The policy still stinks for everyone else who has to. You seem blind to that fact, even though the rest of us aren't. If you think it's ok, then it must be!

 

[Candide]

You seem blind to that fact, even though the rest of us aren't.

Since you feel comfortable speaking for the population of lurkers and posters here, what do you think their opinion is of an RJ guy posting with crazy frequency about an (inherently excruciating) SLI between two major airline pilot groups?

It's like a young, single guy loudly and incessantly opining about his uncle's divorce...the opinion is inappropriate, unappreciated, and sophomoric.