Southwest Airlines and DIA

[Skyrunner]

Howdy Ya'll,

I got a question? Why doesn't Southwest fly into DIA? Besides being cost prohibitive, is there anything else that may be or have been a factor in Southwest's decision not to fly into Denver? Any rumors of why?

Take care and fly safe,

SR - Livin' near Denver and wondering why.

 

[Iron Egale]

Southwest used to have service to Denver, but they quickly found out how hard it was for them to maintain a schedule due to extensive delays. In other words, the same reasons they don't fly into NYC, ATL, DFW, MSP, MIA or BOS.

 

[flx757]

There was some discussion on this subject on another thread some time ago.

Click here for this previous thread.

 

[Delta3]

Actually they do fly to ATL

 

[bobbysamd]

SWA in DEN

Southwest used to have service to Denver, but they quickly found out how hard it was for them to maintain a schedule due to extensive delays. In other words, the same reasons they don't fly into NYC, ATL, DFW, MSP, MIA or BOS.

A problem with their kind of schedule. I don't believe that delays at the new DIA are as bad as the old Stapleton, but the snow and ice in the winter can wreak havoc on Southwest's 20-minute turn structure.

 

[flx757]

Actually they do fly to ATL

Really?? Since when?

Here's a map of their cities.

 

[Delta3]

I used to work for DL there and I swear they had 2 gates on the C concourse.

Maybe they cancelled it.

 

[flint4xx]

NOT!

 

[enigma]

I recently asked this question of a good friend at SWA . He said that SWA goes by the old dictum, "dump on me once, shame on you; dump on my twice, shame on me." The company doesn't believe that the politicians/ beaurocrats in Denver treated SWA right the first time, and since SWA has no shortage of potential desitinations, they just don't care to go to DIA. This is in addition to the obvious reasons that have already been detailed here.

regards,
8N

 

[bobbysamd]

Denver politicos

I recently asked this question of a good friend at SWA . He said that SWA goes by the old dictum, "dump on me once, shame on you; dump on my twice, shame on me." The company doesn't believe that the politicians/ beaurocrats in Denver treated SWA right the first time, and since SWA has no shortage of potential desitinations, they just don't care to go to DIA. This is in addition to the obvious reasons that have already been detailed here.

I wasn't living in Denver at the time, but I know who was mayor. What you say does not surprise me in the least. Moreover, Denver has been United country for a great many years. Denver has hosted United's training center for years and United exerted great influence over DIA's design. I believe that United inspired the ill-fated automated baggage handling machinery. Now look at where United's headed. Ironic.

 

[Joseph II]

We would like SWA down in Colorado Springs! Forget Denver.

 

[IMBB]

One of the reasons why SWA does not go into Denver is because of competition. Look at where the "home" bases of the big major airlines are. With the exception of Houston (IAH) and Seattle (SEA), SWA stays clear of the big boys, choosing a site that is close to the hub of the big airlines but not on the same field. For example, SWA doesn't come to ATL, but the fly a lot into BHM. They go to MDW instead of ORD, etc. I recall a time at the MSP airport when 2 SWA 737's landed there, one after another. They taxied over to get some fuel and then departed. I believe that that was a HUGE signal to Northwest that SWA can go to MSP, they just choose not to.

Also, when SWA starts thinking about going into a new city, they want to eventually have about 13 flights per day in and out of that airport. If they don't think they can do that, or the market won't support it, they don't go.

Would it be smart for SWA to go to DEN, absolutely not! Should they think about COS? Absolutely!

IMBB

 

[IMBB]

In addition to my previous post, if SWA was concerned about snow and ice and their 20 minute turns, I doubt they'd be going to places like BDL, BUF, SLC, MDW, DTW, and BWI!

IMBB

 

[Snoopy58]

With the exception of Houston (IAH) and Seattle (SEA), SWA stays clear of the big boys, choosing a site that is close to the hub of the big airlines but not on the same field.

According to that theory, SWA wouldn't fly into LAX, DTW, or STL.

There are some very smart people in Schedule Planning at SWA who evaluate the opportunities out there, and I'm sure they've done extensive analysis on COS, DEN, and probably three dozen other airports out there, including at least a couple that wouldn't occur to most of us. They've chosen RIC as the next city, and I'm sure they could give some excellent reasons as to why RIC won out over COS (even though I haven't heard what they might be).

BHM doesn't really compete with ATL for much traffic -- they're a bit too far apart for that purpose.

The incident of 2 jets landing at MSP & departing shortly afterwards was probably a charter flight -- a sports team or somesuch. It accomplishes nothing to land a jet at some major airport so as to "prove" that SWA can land there... I can't imagine anybody with some sense of geography & a little familiarity with a 737 ever doubted that the airport was within range of the aircraft. The interesting questions about opening a city deal with completely separate issues from that.

 

[Sierra-Hotel]

In addition to my previous post, if SWA was concerned about snow and ice and their 20 minute turns, I doubt they'd be going to places like BDL, BUF, SLC, MDW, DTW, and BWI!

IMBB

Wait a minute......hold up.....back the truck up!

They know how to do 20 minute turns in BWI? Hogwash!

 

[Snoopy58]

They know how to do 20 minute turns in BWI? Hogwash!

Sure they know how to do 20 minute turns in BWI -- the only catch is that you either have to have >100 thru pax, or < 30 pax getting off AND coming on, or have 4 ops agents working the flight. If you have any of those conditions, even BWI can do 20 minute turns all day long!

MDW, on the other hand, can only do 20 minute turns as long as there aren't any wheelchairs coming on or off; those stoneage elevators in the gates delay things beyond belief in the old gates in Chicago!

It's all good, though -- just an excuse to request direct from every new controller!

 

[Sierra-Hotel]

Sorry to get off topic!

Sure they know how to do 20 minute turns in BWI -- the only catch is that you either have to have >100 thru pax, or < 30 pax getting off AND coming on, or have 4 ops agents working the flight. If you have any of those conditions, even BWI can do 20 minute turns all day long!

ROFLMAO!

Thank god somebody other than me sees there is a problem. BWI sucks completely.....I just Luv'ed watching them get a airplane 20 mins early and end up pushing it 20 mins late. Or taking a 15 min delay on a originator with 40 people on it.....my ops supe would have killed me for something like that.

I've really never had a problem with Midway....although the summertime groundstops every hour on the hour gets old. Also the equipment swaps issue was getting really old (just let me keep my -300.....no no NO....not another -700!)

Nashville rocks....they do great work down there

Orlando and Tampa do pretty good considering the issues(ya know....50 million preboards and wheelchairs galore!) they have.

Houston was killing me every night with the constant equipment swaps....but then again I'd rather them not send one of those ratty -200s up to the northeast.

Sorry for the rant, Back to your orginally scheduled topic!