Skywest taking ASA planes (non-union-taking union work)

[scarlet]

ALPA is planning a big push for Skywest pilots to join. Skywest is offering their pilots alot of growth and a raise !!

Alot of Skywest pilots say they are not voting in favor of ALPA, but will fly ASA planes and routes !!

 

[Going2Baja]

What has ALPA ever done for a commuter? Especially when they represent the commuters partners. SkyW should talk to the Teamsters....Look what they have done for the fractionals.

As for flying ASA a/c...What are you talking about? Who do you think owns your a/c? SkyW will use their as they choose. Be smart Scarlet and get out now before you are the last one standing at the dance.

Good luck...Baja.

 

[KeroseneSnorter]

Gotta agree Scarlet. You have to look no farther than CCAir to see ASA's future.

Mesa bought CCAir and when negotiation time came around and CCAir told them to stuff the lousy pay rates, Mesa simply shut down CCAir and that was that. BOTH of those companies were ALPA. All CCAir pilots were transferred to the Mesa side on the Mesa contract.(In many cases their bases moved across the country and many took downgrades from what I was told. Many more simply were left jobless when they refused.)

I suspect that is ASA's future. Shut down and brought over to Skywests work agreement, or lack of one so to speak. I know a few guys at Skywest. I cannot see ALPA getting much of a vote over there from what I am told.

Maybe I have been furloughed a few too many times, but I would not be buying anything expensive right now if I were you.

 

[climb2slow]

do we really need two threads on the majors board for this?

 

[airtime42]

skywest pilots are scabs

 

[airtime42]

or will be soon

 

[capt. megadeth]

skywest pilots are scabs

Ok whatever dude

 

[Going2Baja]

skywest pilots are scabs

What ever Airtime - keep thinking that when you are sitting in an interview with SkyW trying to stay employed!

Baja.

 

[Widow's Son]

>>skywest pilots are scabs<<

That kind of talk needs to stop right now. Scabs are the lowest form of life and it is a status that lasts forever.
The best thing that can happen to true scabs is to have the community dilute and cloud the true meaning of the term. Once that happens the heinous stigma abates as does the deterrent effect of a scab declaration.

Crossing the line to becoming a scab is an act that individual workers do. It is an issue between worker groups that has nothing directly to do with managment.

What is going on between ASA and SkyWest is a management issue. It has nothing to do with with the two work groups being against each other.

Even if SkyWest ends up with all the ASA aircraft, which they own, the pilots will be doing nothing more than flying their own carrier's aircraft, passengers, and routes.

If one pilot group flying aircraft and routes obtained from another carrier means scabbing, then every AMR pilot has scabbed against AirCAL, TWA, and RenoAir. Every Delta pilot has scabbed against PanAM. Every NWA pilot has scabbed against Republic, Every SWA pilot has scabbed against Morris, Every FedEX pilot has scabbed against Flying Tigers, et-cetera et-cetera, and the various unions were cheering those manuevers all along when it meant more growth for the home team.
It is a rough and tumble world out there. You eat or you get eaten. Management plays the games and the pilots fly the planes. Until a legitimately established picket line is crossed, there are no scabs.
The best way to give the label "scab" the most power and impact is to use it only when it properly applies and then vigorously condemn and reject those who ultimately earn it.

 

[JohnQ]

>>skywest pilots are scabs<<

That kind of talk needs to stop right now. Scabs are the lowest form of life and it is a status that lasts forever.
The best thing that can happen to true scabs is to have the community dilute and cloud the true meaning of the term. Once that happens the heinous stigma abates as does the deterrent effect of a scab declaration.

Crossing the line to becoming a scab is an act that individual workers do. It is an issue between worker groups that has nothing directly to do with managment.

What is going on between ASA and SkyWest is a management issue. It has nothing to do with with the two work groups being against each other.

Even if SkyWest ends up with all the ASA aircraft, which they own, the pilots will be doing nothing more than flying their own carrier's aircraft, passengers, and routes.

If one pilot group flying aircraft and routes obtained from another carrier means scabbing, then every AMR pilot has scabbed against AirCAL, TWA, and RenoAir. Every Delta pilot has scabbed against PanAM. Every NWA pilot has scabbed against Republic, Every SWA pilot has scabbed against Morris, Every FedEX pilot has scabbed against Flying Tigers, et-cetera et-cetera, and the various unions were cheering those manuevers all along when it meant more growth for the home team.
It is a rough and tumble world out there. You eat or you get eaten. Management plays the games and the pilots fly the planes. Until a legitimately established picket line is crossed, there are no scabs.
The best way to give the label "scab" the most power and impact is to use it only when it properly applies and then vigorously condemn and reject those who ultimately earn it.

Totally 100% correct.

A SCAB is one entity and one only--someone who performs "struck work" (almost always crossing a picket line) that has been legally declared by a union's leadership.

- flying for a non-union carrier does not make one a scab
- flying for LCCs does not make you a scab
- flying OT with guys on furlough does not make you a scab
- agreeing to concessionary contracts does not make one a scab
- flying OT when some totalitarian Big-Brother-wannabees "they" say you shoudn't, such as when negotiations are going nowhere, does not make you a scab

PERFORMING UNION-DEFINED STRUCK WORK, AND NOTHING ELSE makes one a scab.

Save the vicious word SCAB for those who truly deserve it, and it will maintain the stigma that it should and must.

 

[Longhorn]

:angryfire
Airtime....knock it off. Calling a group of pilots scabs...who are not scabs will not be tolerated on this site. You need to go back and look up what a scab is before coming on here and expressing comments about what you obviously know nothing about. I don't get PO'd about much but calling others scabs when they are not is enough to upset many here...including myself.

lh

 

[Going2Baja]

Perfectly said Widow's Son!!!

Baja.

 

[accinelli]

ALPA is planning a big push for Skywest pilots to join. Skywest is offering their pilots alot of growth and a raise !!

Alot of Skywest pilots say they are not voting in favor of ALPA, but will fly ASA planes and routes !!

And your point is?

 

[wms]

It's not scab but it is A La Lorenzo. It's designed to try to break the union and possibly dissolve or absorb ASA. And since It's happening while we're in negotiations it may not be legal. Hopefully ALPA has put down the hotdogs and is looking onto this.

 

[COOPERVANE]

And do what? I'm so tired of ALPA inaction over, and over, and over

 

[sweptback]

And do what? I'm so tired of ALPA inaction over, and over, and over

Tell me what ALPA should do. Transferring airplanes is legal per our current contract.

We could file a lawsuit, but there's no guarantee it will go smoothly. There is some horrible case law here -- reference Pan Am mk. III/Boston Maine Airways. However I don't believe they were in Sec. 6 negotiations at the time and that may be a key difference.

 

[ASADriver]

Tell me what ALPA should do. Transferring airplanes is legal per our current contract.

We could file a lawsuit, but we will lose. There is some horrible case law here -- reference Pan Am mk. III/Boston Maine Airways.

Then why are ALPA reps. in the crew lounge telling pilots they will win this lawsuit and prevent Skywest from transferring airplanes? They told me that ALPA is filing a lawsuit to stop the transfer and that I don't need to worry about Skywest transferring airplanes. Was he lying?

 

[sweptback]

Then why are ALPA reps. in the crew lounge telling pilots they will win this lawsuit and prevent Skywest from transferring airplanes? They told me that ALPA is filing a lawsuit to stop the transfer and that I don't need to worry about Skywest transferring airplanes. Was he lying?

I edited my post above to make it a little clearer. There's always a chance that a favorable judge could grant an injunction. I am not a rep so they are obviously more privy to information about the case than I.

There have also been cases that have been won that are similar. For instance, I believe the Delta pilots were dinged not too long ago for refusing to pick up open time even though it is clearly optional to do so. Transferring airplanes could be construed as illegal self-help just as refusing to pick up open time was. All it takes are some fancy lawyers and a favorable judge.

Note that we have actually gained one airplane recently. As far as I know we have received 2 GECAS 200s since N701EV/N609SK left our fleet. Management may have their bases covered on this one if they keep giving us 200s as we lose 700s.

 

[Whataboutbob]

I was told that since ASA pilots have a contract with their management. And ASA airlines has a contract with Delta that can be cancelled at any time. ASA pilots go on strike against their contract with management, which causes Delta to cancel their contract with ASA , which means ASA doesn't have any more work. Hence no struck work to qualify those who pick it up as scabs.

 

[ASARJMan]

I was told that since ASA pilots have a contract with their management. And ASA airlines has a contract with Delta that can be cancelled at any time. ASA pilots go on strike against their contract with management, which causes Delta to cancel their contract with ASA , which means ASA doesn't have any more work. Hence no struck work to qualify those who pick it up as scabs.

Yeah, right.........geeezzzzzzz!

VOTED IN FAVOR!

 

[ASADriver]

I edited my post above to make it a little clearer. There's always a chance that a favorable judge could grant an injunction. I am not a rep so they are obviously more privy to information about the case than I.

There have also been cases that have been won that are similar. For instance, I believe the Delta pilots were dinged not too long ago for refusing to pick up open time even though it is clearly optional to do so. Transferring airplanes could be construed as illegal self-help just as refusing to pick up open time was. All it takes are some fancy lawyers and a favorable judge.

Note that we have actually gained one airplane recently. As far as I know we have received 2 GECAS 200s since N701EV/N609SK left our fleet. Management may have their bases covered on this one if they keep giving us 200s as we lose 700s.

You have a future with ALPA - changing your story. That's what I find most of the ALPA reps. do. This lawsuit will fail, our request for a release will fail, ALPA will talk tough, Jerry will transfer airplanes,etc. etc. etc. By the way 701 and 702 have left.

 

[MarineGrunt]

I was told that since ASA pilots have a contract with their management. And ASA airlines has a contract with Delta that can be cancelled at any time. ASA pilots go on strike against their contract with management, which causes Delta to cancel their contract with ASA , which means ASA doesn't have any more work. Hence no struck work to qualify those who pick it up as scabs.

Maybe, but I sort of doubt the rest of the industry would see it that way. I think we're in the same class, because I heard the same thing - I'm just trying to forget I ever heard it [fingers in ears] LA LA LA LA LA LA LA LA LA LA ...............

 

[BigPappa]

I would not wanna be a Skywest pilot applying at any ALPA majors (most of them); that is if ASA was to strike and Skywest was to fly their planes and routes.

 

[pilotlbs]

Better luck next time

skywest pilots are scabs

6 Months to reapply so relax.

 

[txpilot1974]

skywest pilots are scabs

Did the ATC 810 eat your lunch or did they not hire you because your an idiot?

 

[ASARJMan]

You have a future with ALPA - changing your story. That's what I find most of the ALPA reps. do. This lawsuit will fail, our request for a release will fail, ALPA will talk tough, Jerry will transfer airplanes,etc. etc. etc. By the way 701 and 702 have left.

Wah wah wah! The sky is falling, the sky is falling! Back to your management cubicle you rat!

VOTED IN FAVOR!

 

[Going2Baja]

I would not wanna be a Skywest pilot applying at any ALPA majors (most of them); that is if ASA was to strike and Skywest was to fly their planes and routes.

The last few Alaska classes were 1/2 SkyW or close to it....Any more comments smart guy?

Baja.