SkyWest Crj-900 orders

[House_X]

A few problems with the brazil trash, first they burn more fuel, they are brand new so MX will be an issue untill the bugs are out, and jet blue has like the next 100 off the line. The CRJ is a very well built airplane and will last longer, and the last thing pax care about when buying tix on travelocity is aircraft type, by the way no one knows the diff between a crj and a Md80 anyhow. Some F/As eaven have probelms with this. bottom line is the CRJ works good and last long time, and you can get delivery in a few months instead of in 5-6 years.

You forgot that RAH has 25 190's on order...RAH can get them anytime as well. And your wrong about the fuel burn for the E190.

 

[EMB170Pilot]

Its not about what the pax say, its about what they'll pay for. When they are buying their $30 ticket online they don't have clue what airplane they are buying a ticket on. They can comment all they want, but until they show the airlines with their money that they don't like the "little jets" then the airlines won't care how comfortable they are.

yeah..true.... good point

 

[General Lee]

Everyone is well aware of mainline's desire to shed costly domestic flying to the regionals. Unfortunately, Delta Management will go with the lowest bidder for 90-100 seat flying....Managements at other airlines already took note of the MDA deal, so they won't try that again...Delta and NWA is going to try and crush the scope...anything is possible in CH11 and no contract is safe...

Incorrect. We will not allow that. NW and DL pilots will stand strong on scope. Have you been reading any of the articles or watching the news lately? I guess not.

And, you must have forgotten about what our BK judge said about Delta's ridiculous request for free scope changes? She said no way, and that we would have to get credit from that original $325 million request. Now that we have agreed (by 58%) to the TA, we also will get credit for any pension dumpings (we owe $10.6 BILLION), and that would go towards that $325 million a year in savings (ALPA came up with $180-220 MILLION a year in savings for our part of the pensions). Add that to the 14% pay cut, ($152 million a year), and there ain't much more room to go. If they want to ask for more, they will have to go up to Prudence Beatty, and she probably ain't in the mood. She is still incharge and will have to sign off on the final documents.

And to top that off, management already is trying to negotiate a 100 seat rate very close to Jetblue's, and has requested 200 79 seaters. There is little chance ALPA would allow that request. Scope has become the non-negotiable item for this round, for both DL and NW.



Bye Bye--General Lee

 

[House_X]

Incorrect. We will not allow that. NW and DL pilots will stand strong on scope. Have you been reading any of the articles or watching the news lately? I guess not.

And, you must have forgotten about what our BK judge said about Delta's ridiculous request for free scope changes? She said no way, and that we would have to get credit from that original $325 million request. Now that we have agreed (by 58%) to the TA, we also will get credit for any pension dumpings (we owe $10.6 BILLION), and that would go towards that $325 million a year in savings (ALPA came up with $180-220 MILLION a year in savings for our part of the pensions). Add that to the 14% pay cut, ($152 million a year), and there ain't much more room to go. If they want to ask for more, they will have to go up to Prudence Beatty, and she probably ain't in the mood. She is still incharge and will have to sign off on the final documents.


Bye Bye--General Lee

Talk to me in 6 months...

 

[General Lee]

Talk to me in 6 months...

Wow, that confident, eh? Riiight. If it doesn't go our way, we will both be working at Wendy's.


Bye Bye--General Lee

 

[House_X]

Wow, that confident, eh? Riiight. If it doesn't go our way, we will both be working at Wendy's.


Bye Bye--General Lee

C'mon....General...you know how much this industry stinks, why fight it...just give in and accept the pain...it will be much easier. I'm going to White Castle.....home every night, a pay raise, and free "Sliders"...plus, upgrades to crew chief are running 6 months!!!!

 

[michael707767]

This industry stinks anyway....I'll be at White Castle...home every night, a pay raise, and free "Sliders"...

ooh, love White Castle. Great place for post alchohol munchies...........

 

[enuffalready]

" NW and DL pilots will stand strong on scope." Have you been reading any of the articles or watching the news lately? I guess not.

"And to top that off, management already is trying to negotiate a 100 seat rate very close to Jetblue's,"

"Bye Bye--General Lee"

BY standing strong on scope I guess you mean, allowing the creation of NewCO which is going to have pay rate on par with what Regionals have now, but with everything else from gates to FA's to rampers on a new pay scale as seperate companies......... No, no what you you mean by " very close to JetBLue" you must be referring to rates imposed on a pilot group who knew that NOT A SINGLE PILOT on the seniority list at the time would ever set foot in one except to non-rev, thus no reason to object......then you are right....

Keep up the good fight! GREAT JOB!! STAND PROUD....and you wonder why management types LOVE YOU and your rhetoric of running around proclaiming victory over "close to jet blue rates"


On that notion... I guess I can keep up the good fight at ASA by suggesting we start skywestatlanta, inc and agree to fly anything with a turbine engine at 1/2 mesa wages... just to keep them on the property!! yeah, that makes sense... then i wont have to worry about scope...Until those unified DL and NW guys come swooping in and agree to fly anything with 70+ seats ( NO 50 seaters per Newco) at 1/2 of 1/2 of 1/2 of Jetblue rates they can Keep em on property! GREEEAT STRATEGY THERE!!! Now yer thinkin like a Deltoid!!!

 

[Tank Commander]

Now the regional biding war will be done with ex-mainline pilots from new-co's. This is may crapy job, stay out of it!

 

[slackass]

From the Bombardier website. Last updated Nov 05. Skywest 34 700's to come. Mesa 7 900's due yet.
http://bombardier.com/en/3_0/3_1/pdf/CRJ_november_30_05.pdf

 

[DoinTime]

Scope has become the non-negotiable item for this round, for both DL and NW.

Unfortunately for the NW pilots the Delta boys have already dropped their pants on 70 seat scope. I feel secure that the NW MEC will not allow the formation of NewCo but they won't have much leverage protecting some 70 seat outsourcing considering the numbers of these aircraft currently being outsourced at other carriers.

What I see being likely is that the NW pilots will give up what NW originally wanted from their scope. Seating capacity will be raised to 85 seats in the Avro's, another 30-40 70-seaters will be put into service, and the 50-seat restrictions will be lifted.

 

[General Lee]

Unfortunately for the NW pilots the Delta boys have already dropped their pants on 70 seat scope. I feel secure that the NW MEC will not allow the formation of NewCo but they won't have much leverage protecting some 70 seat outsourcing considering the numbers of these aircraft currently being outsourced at other carriers.

What I see being likely is that the NW pilots will give up what NW originally wanted from their scope. Seating capacity will be raised to 85 seats in the Avro's, another 30-40 70-seaters will be put into service, and the 50-seat restrictions will be lifted.

Yes, we $crewed up and allowed 70 seat flying, that doesn't mean we haven't learned from that. At DL most of our loyal, super senior, non-RJ caring pilots HAVE LEFT. We had 2300 retirements in 18 months. Guess what? We now have a younger workforce that actually knows something about RJs and their effects on manning. We barely passed our last TA (58%), and any more tinkering and it will go down---and both ALPA and the company know it. The huge Summer flying season is coming up, and to top that off---the judge (good ole Prudence---who is still incharge) told the company they would NOT get scope for free----nope. The company told the judge they really NEEDED the $325 million a year in savings, over and over again. The judge then stated we will get credit (in that $325 million) for any dumping of the pensions----and we owe $10.6 billion. Our savings there would be $180-220 million a year--just for the pilots. Add that to our recent pay cut, and you go over the $325 million THEY NEED---as they TOLD THE JUDGE. We have offered to fly any 79 seaters and 100 seaters, and for pretty competitive rates---USAir/AWA 100 seat rates are a tad bit higher than the Jetblue rates, but Jetblue goes time and a half over 70 hours. We will see how it goes......


Bye Bye--General Lee

 

[pipejockey]

Does Delta scope retain anything over 70 seats for mainline?
Part of the problem is how the mainliners caved in on scope and now the cats out of the bag. It would be nice to stand firm at 70 seaters. Even if it takes lousy regional pay rates pay rates for the EMB 190's-195's and the CRJ900's at least they will be at mainline and with a few years seniority you can put them behind you.

 

[hotwing]

HEADLINESChange Display [ hide $$ edit ] •Forbes Ranks SkyWest Among America's Best Big Companiesat Forbes.com (Tue, Jan 3)

 

[propjockey]

General,

I've been pondering something lately, and want your measured opinion. Do you think the RJ camel can ever be pushed all the way back out of the tent? (Let's face it -- the camel has been fully in the tent and eating your couscous for years). From all you say, it seems like we're on the same page, except that you're already at the major airline, and I'm at a regional (albeit one of the best) hoping that it won't turn into a lifetime career, or at least that if it does turn out to be my "career," it actually lasts long enough for me to retire. My position naturally leads me to a conflict of interest. Yes, I want the majors to grow and prosper -- but not at the expense of my here-and-now job.

From my perspective, mainline ALPA MECs really dropped the ball back in the early 90's when RJs first started to appear. Instead of holding out their fingers in the sign of the cross as if to ward off vampires, they should have welcomed the Barbie Jets with open arms as the new, entry-level mainline jets -- EVEN if first-year pay at the majors dropped quite a bit. I hope this isn't merely 20/20 hindsight. I'd like to think that at least some groups saw the RJ writing on the wall. Point is, I'd MUCH rather being flying a CRJ-700 at United [or insert your major airline of preference here] (even for the same money that I make now) than SkyWest!

Since this sounds basically like what you're advocating at Delta, I wonder if you think this is really possible. As the majors regain strength, what do you think is the probability that regionals as we now know them will begin to shrink, and smaller "mainline" jets will go to the majors?

To use another cliche, I don't think it's completely possible to put the genie back in the bottle, but I'd like to think that these EMB-190 size airplanes will go to the majors instead of the regionals. I think the CRJ-700s, 705s and 900s and the EMB-170s are a lost cause, even up to, but maybe not including, 90 seats.

I'd like to hear your guess.

I'll venture to say there's only a 25 - 30% chance that EMB-190 class aircraft will not appear at the regionals.

 

[enuffalready]

why??????

Why do you care what General thinks? He doesn't make decisons. He isn't going to make one list( why would you want him to) What is the point? He runs around screaming victory with regotiating rates close to Jet Blue 190 rates that were imposed on a group of pilots that will never fly them.

I log on here from time to time to see what is in store for regionals, ASA, skywest, etc. and am constantly laughing as all you guys asking Sir GL what he thinks...

The 705 or 70 seaters or whatever are never going to go to mainline and we all know it. Now, I realize that we(ASA) may never see them either as they will prob go to Mesa, etc the will NEVER go to Mainline.

Unless of course you mean an new company with furloughed delta guys making $40 an hour, no pension, crappy work rules, no duty/trip rigs, 10 days off, with new gate agents and new flight attendants as mainline.

 

[General Lee]

General,

I've been pondering something lately, and want your measured opinion. Do you think the RJ camel can ever be pushed all the way back out of the tent? (Let's face it -- the camel has been fully in the tent and eating your couscous for years). From all you say, it seems like we're on the same page, except that you're already at the major airline, and I'm at a regional (albeit one of the best) hoping that it won't turn into a lifetime career, or at least that if it does turn out to be my "career," it actually lasts long enough for me to retire. My position naturally leads me to a conflict of interest. Yes, I want the majors to grow and prosper -- but not at the expense of my here-and-now job.

From my perspective, mainline ALPA MECs really dropped the ball back in the early 90's when RJs first started to appear. Instead of holding out their fingers in the sign of the cross as if to ward off vampires, they should have welcomed the Barbie Jets with open arms as the new, entry-level mainline jets -- EVEN if first-year pay at the majors dropped quite a bit. I hope this isn't merely 20/20 hindsight. I'd like to think that at least some groups saw the RJ writing on the wall. Point is, I'd MUCH rather being flying a CRJ-700 at United [or insert your major airline of preference here] (even for the same money that I make now) than SkyWest!

Since this sounds basically like what you're advocating at Delta, I wonder if you think this is really possible. As the majors regain strength, what do you think is the probability that regionals as we now know them will begin to shrink, and smaller "mainline" jets will go to the majors?

To use another cliche, I don't think it's completely possible to put the genie back in the bottle, but I'd like to think that these EMB-190 size airplanes will go to the majors instead of the regionals. I think the CRJ-700s, 705s and 900s and the EMB-170s are a lost cause, even up to, but maybe not including, 90 seats.

I'd like to hear your guess.

I'll venture to say there's only a 25 - 30% chance that EMB-190 class aircraft will not appear at the regionals.

Well, we all know by now that we should have kept the jets starting at the 50 seater, and then just hired more people for them. We all know that now. Then, we lost the 70 seater when things were going great in the late 90s. I don't think we will cave again on that. A lot of what we want is to replace what we will lose----737-200s at DL and DC9s at NW. We would like to fly the replacements---and it looks like the E190 is about the right size. The E175 is flown by mainline at Air Canada, and so far no one else has it. The E170 is probably gone forever, but it really is nice and has the look and feel probably of a mini 737. So, we would like to keep the line there, and then just hire into the E175 or bigger. The CR9 at Mesa is interesting, and so is the CRJ-705. Jazz has the CRJ-705, and Mesa has the "rights" for up to 86 CR9s I believe. That, so far, is the only regional airline allowed 90 seaters in the USA, and no other major has (via the unions) allowed that other than USAir. I think the 50 seaters are on the way out, and maybe more 70 seaters will be allowed to replace them. I would think pilots would like the opportunity to eventually move up from an RJ to something bigger, and allowing larger planes at the regionals could prevent that.


Bye Bye--General Lee

 

[CFIT]

I would think pilots would like the opportunity to eventually move up from an RJ to something bigger, and allowing larger planes at the regionals could prevent that.


Bye Bye--General Lee

So we can act like a self absorbed coinbag pirate like yourself?

Face it, you and your dorkfest but-club have rolled over on every contract point management has asked for. Management has been teabagging you big time.

You hav'nt won one battle, not one, for over a year. So what, you only got less of a pay cut, it's still a pay cut.

 

[CFIT]

Well, we all know by now that we should have kept the jets starting at the 50 seater, and then just hired more people for them. We all know that now.
Bye Bye--General Lee

Remember when your over inflated ego's hated them? wadboy

 

[Halo_RJdriver]

Lmao

So we can act like a self absorbed coinbag pirate like yourself?

Face it, you and your dorkfest but-club have rolled over on every contract point management has asked for. Management has been teabagging you big time.

You hav'nt won one battle, not one, for over a year. So what, you only got less of a pay cut, it's still a pay cut.

LMAO...nice post!!!