Single-pilot jets?

[tdwnds1]

I think one of the subject that might be lost here is the Captain as mentor. A higher experienced Captain has the ability to impart his experience to his less experienced partner, even if both are PIC. I will say that much of what I learned about flying came from the much older captains that "took me under their wing" and taught me what they new. I still use many of their techniques in my everyday flying and Im extremely grateful for the opportunity to learn from them.

 

[ksu_aviator]

And um a$$clown, I'm looking 2-5 years down the road not the first year. I WILL have a co-pilot with a crapload of hours for the first year. Lets not make this personal huh sunny!!!

You aren't going to be ready in 2-5 years. I had nearly 3,000 hours in t-prop and jet aircraft before I flew them single pilot. Today I'm flying with that 300 hour wonder that thinks he knows everything and won't listen to me when I give him corrective instruction. You remind me of him. You aren't ready.

 

[fu69atacafyeah]

You aren't going to be ready in 2-5 years. I had nearly 3,000 hours in t-prop and jet aircraft before I flew them single pilot. Today I'm flying with that 300 hour wonder that thinks he knows everything and won't listen to me when I give him corrective instruction. You remind me of him. You aren't ready.

Amen to that!!!!

 

[paid4training]

My 7-month-old son is now asleep and I am not typing on my ipad so allow me to retort.

Yo old dudes, like whatever man!!! All I waz axing was an opion on an planz for some bling bling to make mo' money for all my baby momma's!! I aplogixs for offending youz if I did!!!

However, thank you for all the constructive responses along with the information, I will research your views and opinions to reach a decision.

Although it does not matter to anyone but those involved in the process, I am not a 300/500-hour wonder. I have over 3000 hours with 500 multi and 300-turbine time with ZERO accidents or incidents. The insurance company has approved my application for the past two years for the value of the airplane.

 

[paid4training]

Older, close to zero experience, and most shockingly demonstrative: little or no education to speak of. Your posts are seething with all-manner of grammatical and cognitive offenses.

You'd be well-advised to consider the opinions of those whom do this for a living, Brightspark.

You must be a peach to fly with!!!

 

[wingnutt]

Interesting thread, and a quick answer to the question...

• Phenom 300
• Citation CJ series
• Beech Premier

...and as for the associated hooplah, nothing inherently wrong with single pilot. Most (90%) of my total time has been single pilot. Crappy weather, bitchy passengers, screaming babies, puking dogs, missed approaches, icing airframes, and even the Teterboro vortex can all be handled fine SP. I have flown all of the above in both jet props and SP jets, and I will take the SP jet workload all day, any day in the same circumstances.

Explosive DC is not much of a factor since you are supposed to have your dam mask on anyways. High insurance premiums means you need either; a new broker, or a pilot with some dam experience.

To the naysayers...please note I am not implying SP is better, merely that it can be, and is done quite safely on a daily basis. I can honestly count on one hand the times I wished I had an SIC on board, the most recent was for an extra ear to interpret what the dam controller in Manzanillo was babbling about

 

[HalinTexas]

Work load is also dependent on A/P. If it's cumbersome to use, it will increase your workload. If you don't have one, well that's a whole other animal.

Insurance, insurance, insurance.

Your confidence level is also dependent on how often you'll fly it. Likewise, but inversely, with how long your days will be. Fatigue in SP ops. is stupid crazy.

 

[ditchpilot]

citation V is the best value in the single pilot jet market.
lots of positives very few negatives.
find a good shop outside of the cessna service center system and enjoy the ride

 

[BoilerUP]

Single-pilot jets require an operable autopilot for SP ops, otherwise you are required two qualified crewmembers.

Low-time pilots jump from Cirrus or Lancair into Eclipses, Mustangs, CJs and Phenoms pretty regularly...but those are purpose-built SP jets. A pilot with little multi and/or turbine experience isn't going to qualify for a 500-series Single Pilot Waiver.

To the naysayers...please note I am not implying SP is better, merely that it can be, and is done quite safely on a daily basis.

Also, this.

I'd almost always rather fly with a second crewmember (and do most of the time) but SP ops can be and often are perfectly safe.

That being said, IMO it is wise to ask why, in an airplane designed with multiple redundancies, an owner would voluntarily choose to have a single point of failure in a single pilot at the controls.

 

[imacdog]

My 7-month-old son is now asleep and I am not typing on my ipad so allow me to retort.

Yo old dudes, like whatever man!!! All I waz axing was an opion on an planz for some bling bling to make mo' money for all my baby momma's!! I aplogixs for offending youz if I did!!!

However, thank you for all the constructive responses along with the information, I will research your views and opinions to reach a decision.

Although it does not matter to anyone but those involved in the process, I am not a 300/500-hour wonder. I have over 3000 hours with 500 multi and 300-turbine time with ZERO accidents or incidents. The insurance company has approved my application for the past two years for the value of the airplane.

2500 hours of flying in the practice area does not prepare one to be a captain on a jet. 300 hours of turbine is about enough to not be dangerous as a copilot. You have a way to go yet before you're ready.

 

[Jetdriver69]

I flew a Cheyenne and Citation single pilot before my current Gulfstream job. All I can say is that it was a very interesting two years! I had a "crapload" of time before this gig and I still found there were days that were very challenging flying by my lonesome. I can't say the experience didn't make me a better pilot, but I can say I wasn't a safer pilot pilot without a second set of eyes and hopefully, a functioning brain from a copilot. To each his own and pay whatever the insurance man says, but a high performance single pilot jet CAN be too much of a handful for some pilots, super experienced or not. If you are deadset (no pun intended)on flying a jet SP, operate out of less congested airports. Like go to Manassas instead of Dulles or Peachtree instead of Hartsfield. I found this to be the greatest work load reducer, but a copilot works even better.

 

[ksu_aviator]

2500 hours of flying in the practice area does not prepare one to be a captain on a jet. 300 hours of turbine is about enough to not be dangerous as a copilot. You have a way to go yet before you're ready.

Forget about it. He can't be talked to. He has 300 hours and knows it all already.

 

[paid4training]

Hey ksu, go back to manhattan and sit down at a restaurant at Aggieville(I think that in what it's called) and order yourself a nice bowl of dicks!!!! I grew up half my childhood in that town, They must have given you the key to the 7-11 crapper!!! And I know you gotta be proud!!!

Yea, um can I insure my daughters Barbie jeep with you??? I asked about insurance!!!!

A$$hole!!!!!

 

[Paradoxus]

My 7-month-old son is now asleep and I am not typing on my ipad so allow me to retort.

Yo old dudes, like whatever man!!! All I waz axing was an opion on an planz for some bling bling to make mo' money for all my baby momma's!! I aplogixs for offending youz if I did!!!

However, thank you for all the constructive responses along with the information, I will research your views and opinions to reach a decision.

Although it does not matter to anyone but those involved in the process, I am not a 300/500-hour wonder. I have over 3000 hours with 500 multi and 300-turbine time with ZERO accidents or incidents. The insurance company has approved my application for the past two years for the value of the airplane.

Hey ksu, go back to manhattan and sit down at a restaurant at Aggieville(I think that in what it's called) and order yourself a nice bowl of dicks!!!! I grew up half my childhood in that town, They must have given you the key to the 7-11 crapper!!! And I know you gotta be proud!!!

Yea, um can I insure my daughters Barbie jeep with you??? I asked about insurance!!!!

A$$hole!!!!!

As presented, Exhibit A in the argument that second-career-types in aviation ought be regarded with an answerable-level of suspicion.

 

[paid4training]

Ohhh yea, well ur stupid!!!

Childish, bitter, get a life!!!

 

[paid4training]

Deleted

 

[imacdog]

I hear the insurance rates on psychopaths is typically higher than someone a bit less frothy at the mouth.

 

[CaptSeth]

I was going to contribute something useful here. But I've been busy busting minimums and plowing through "level five thunderstorms" with 400,000 pounds of metal strapped to my ass.

 

[con-pilot]

I was going to contribute something useful here. But I've been busy busting minimums and plowing through "level five thunderstorms" with 400,000 pounds of metal strapped to my ass.

"Busting minimums"? Now just what did those minimums ever do to you that made you break them?

 

[BayBum37ft]

I have been flying jets single pilot for years with the F/Os they give me that don't have a clue and a few captains too.
Capt. Seth where you at these days?

BayBum

 

[U of I Tweak]

2500 hours of flying in the practice area does not prepare one to be a captain on a jet. 300 hours of turbine is about enough to not be dangerous as a copilot. You have a way to go yet before you're ready.

Umm...I started with zero hours of jet time....like I suspect you did at one point. Was I dangerous? There's nothing mystical about flying a jet. - 800 hour jet SIC

Sent from my DROID RAZR using Tapatalk 2

 

[ksu_aviator]

Hey ksu, go back to manhattan and sit down at a restaurant at Aggieville(I think that in what it's called) and order yourself a nice bowl of dicks!!!! I grew up half my childhood in that town, They must have given you the key to the 7-11 crapper!!! And I know you gotta be proud!!!

Yea, um can I insure my daughters Barbie jeep with you??? I asked about insurance!!!!

A$$hole!!!!!

I like to think I'm a pretty good judge of character. When you put so much importance on 300 hours, it tells me you don't realize how little experience you have. It tells me you have 2 of the 5 hazardous attitudes, macho and invulnerability. I don't think you've posted anything that disproves my initial assessment.

300 hours is nothing. Likely you haven't seen all four seasons. You probably haven't even had a real emergency yet. You may or may not have deiced. You need to understand that 300 hours has not afforded you any special wisdom, even if you are an ace pilot with a photographic memory.

Quit taking offense to the fact that you have a lot to learn. I have more than 6,000 hours now and I'm enrolled in an online class to learn more. Try learning something from me and the other posters on this forum, and admit you aren't ready to fly a jet single pilot. You just aren't.

 

[BoilerUP]

Umm...I started with zero hours of jet time....like I suspect you did at one point. Was I dangerous? There's nothing mystical about flying a jet. - 800 hour jet SIC

I was an 800tt/0 turbine jet SIC at one time, too.

In hindsight, despite being trained at FSI, I'd probably have been just slightly more useful than a lump of coal if we'd experienced a legit in-flight emergency. I could read a mean checklist and flip switches as commanded and regurgitate systems stuff from the systems manual, but I had zero experience to draw from.

Then again, at some point we ALL have zero experience to draw from, and have to get that experience somehow.

As with anything, flying the airplane Point A to an ILS at Point B is the easy part.

Pilots successfully go from SE pistons to VLJs all the time so more hours isn't an end-all/be-all, but single pilot in a jet is no place for a professional pilot's OJT in my personal opinion as a guy who flies a jet SP.

 

[paid4training]

Again, thank you for all the helpful responses. This forum is a place where someone can ask a question anonymously but along with the good perspectives and information, you also have some negative schoolyard banter such as ksu and few others who post on this forum.

I understand not everyone earned their experience the same way; some military, some civilian, and some had family money help. While others took chances with their own business, met the right person at the right time and earned their experience. There are many different ways to create your own opportunities in this industry; you just have to ignore some people who know nothing about you or your situation.

 

[wingnutt]

Pilots successfully go from SE pistons to VLJs all the time so more hours isn't an end-all/be-all, but single pilot in a jet is no place for a professional pilot's OJT in my personal opinion as a guy who flies a jet SP.

...agreed!

There's nothing mystical about flying a jet. - 800 hour jet SIC

And, while I would also agree there is nothing mystical about a jet, 800 hours in the right seat does not, in and of itself, mean much...no offense.

Its a whole other world out there when you (and you alone) are the one making the decisions, and dealing with the consequences

 

[CaptSeth]

I have been flying jets single pilot for years with the F/Os they give me that don't have a clue and a few captains too.
Capt. Seth where you at these days?

BayBum

Aren't you on Facebook? All the gory details are there. Including the fact that I'm sitting in VIDP at the moment and trying to avoid a case of Ghandi's revenge.

 

[LJ45]

What are you going to do when you are 2 hrs into a 4 hr trip and you need to use the bathroom?
That is my biggest question:beer:

And, yes I have done SP ops in a Citation. Only on short trips and good weather. But, now that I'm older and wiser I think in your situation it's a bad idea to even think about that right now.

 

[wingnutt]

What are you going to do when you are 2 hrs into a 4 hr trip and you need to use the bathroom?

...same thing one does when 2 hours into a 4 hour trip, while flying a king air

 

[ksu_aviator]

...same thing one does when 2 hours into a 4 hour trip, while flying a king air

King Airs have weewee tubes.

Now, in a Metro, that was a different story. All I can say is that there are some great products at Cabella's and Bass Pro!

 

[imacdog]

Umm...I started with zero hours of jet time....like I suspect you did at one point. Was I dangerous? There's nothing mystical about flying a jet. - 800 hour jet SIC

Sent from my DROID RAZR using Tapatalk 2

Of course I had zero turbine time at one point. What I didn't do, was go from zero turbine time to single pilot in a jet. Especially when going from flight instruction, there is a learning curve involved that precludes one from being a safe captain until some experience is gained.