Should captain pay top out at 150K?

[Flybet3]

Last year I made $107K and with a wife and 3 kids I barely have enough to get by.

Sounds like you need to administer your finances. $8916 per month is barely enough to get by? WTF is wrong with you? Sounds like you gotta beat the wife into cooking more at home and not eat out all the time. Geesh.

 

[Benhuntn]

We should make what the market will bear. Not one penny less or more. What are we worth? Well, I can tell you this run a jet off the end of the runway and you could be looking at a Billion dollar loss. So what is a captain worth? He has a lot of responsiblity.

 

[L'il J.Seinfeld]

We should make what the market will bear. Not one penny less or more. What are we worth? Well, I can tell you this run a jet off the end of the runway and you could be looking at a Billion dollar loss. So what is a captain worth? He has a lot of responsiblity.

So does a bus driver.

Get the money while you can folks. 15 years from now there won't be the ridiculous pay scales at the pax carriers like they have now. Go figure that at United, which is a marginal company in and out of bankruptcy, there still are fat, lazy, baby boomers making 200k. It's almost as bad as the auto industry paying high school grads/GEDs over 50k a year to literally screw things in.

It's hilarious to hear you guys try and justify 6 figure incomes for yourselves. I enjoy the money and will take it as long as possible. I just don't have myself fooled that what we do is hard at all.

 

[Ty Webb]

Fightt for better pay, etc., but some people need to get off of their high horse. You are a pilot. It is a job. It doesn't make anybody special, because they can fly an airplane.

Klauski . . . . is that you?


Am I special? Uh, that's not the issue, Chief.

The issue is:

Do I have a specialized skill set, one that involved 4 years of college, an additional $100K in flight training (in today's dollars) followed by better than a decade of "gaining experience" by working my way up and gaining "seasoning" so I can operate your $30M machine safely and efficiently, regardless of my comfort, mood or circumstances? Am I required to spend half the month away from home, sleeping in marginal hotels, eating meals where/when I can, and dealing with days that can start at 4:30 a.m. and run for 16 hours . . . . . and operate safely, efficiently, and professionally at all times?

The issue, MF, is can you make it worthwhile to me to do all of the above, while you're sleeping in your bed in Orlando?



Over and out.

 

[Mamma]

So does a bus driver.

Get the money while you can folks. 15 years from now there won't be the ridiculous pay scales at the pax carriers like they have now. Go figure that at United, which is a marginal company in and out of bankruptcy, there still are fat, lazy, baby boomers making 200k. It's almost as bad as the auto industry paying high school grads/GEDs over 50k a year to literally screw things in.

It's hilarious to hear you guys try and justify 6 figure incomes for yourselves. I enjoy the money and will take it as long as possible. I just don't have myself fooled that what we do is hard at all.

Congratulations!
You are sharing the same company as Tanker Clown and Instructordude! That must make you proud to have so much in common!

 

[Bringupthebird]

Folks that really feel they are worth 200K have left this career and never looked back.

 

[JoeMerchant]

The artificially high payrates at the TOP of this industry created the ridiculous low payrates at the bottom.....People are willing to work for nothing at the bottom so they can make the big bucks at the top.....

Combine this with absurdly low entry requirements and the fact that we can't transport our experience across company lines.....and we have the perfect storm......

ALPA pom-poms won't change the laws of supply and demand and the failures we created.....

 

[Mamma]

The artificially high payrates at the TOP of this industry created the ridiculous low payrates at the bottom.....People are willing to work for nothing at the bottom so they can make the big bucks at the top.....

Combine this with absurdly low entry requirements and the fact that we can't transport our experience across company lines.....and we have the perfect storm......

ALPA pom-poms won't change the laws of supply and demand and the failures we created.....

ALPA this ALPA that....yawn.

 

[JoeMerchant]

ALPA this ALPA that....yawn.

....don't suppose you want to address any of the points I raised....or would you rather just cry like the rest about how you aren't paid what you are worth....Cry about if you want...but that won't change it....

 

[Green]

Part of the reason pilot pay is so low is that there's always some jerkoff comparing airline pay to some non-linear barometer. I've met your ilk before:

Newbie McPencilneck: "Geez, this job is swell! We get to sleep in real beds and no one's shooting at us! I can't believe they're paying me for this!"

Ty: "That's not really a valid point of reference. This job is what you suffered all those years for. You don't want to spend the rest of your life in sh!tholes and flying for dog biscuits".

Newbie: :blush:

So, while I appreciate your military service, let me buy you a nice big warm cup of STFU, fool.


Ty

Perfectly put.....

Also you guys who claim 200K is some absurdly high salary must all live in the midwest, the South, or have low expectations in life...200k is NOT a rich man's salary if it represents the pinnacle of your career. If you live on the East or West coast that is certainly not a dollar amount which will raise eyebrows. It's enough to have a decent lifestyle in a nice neighborhood but all your neighbors will be making the same if not more.

My cousin just got out of a top law school and starts at 160k/year (24 years old). Now some j#ckas# will say 'go be a lawyer,' but I'm just trying to demonstrate that we have slipped well behind the professions we used to compare ourselves to.

 

[JoeMerchant]

My cousin just got out of a top law school and starts at 160k/year (24 years old). Now some j#ckas# will say 'go be a lawyer,' but I'm just trying to demonstrate that we have slipped well behind the professions we used to compare ourselves to.

....yet our UNION contracts have always started pilots out at low payrates...Even the United and CAL mainline contracts start pilots out low.....

How is that these non-union lawyers make so much right out of school...while us UNION pilots make so little....Hmmmm...

 

[Mamma]

....don't suppose you want to address any of the points I raised....or would you rather just cry like the rest about how you aren't paid what you are worth....Cry about if you want...but that won't change it....

You sure a bitter man! Relax Francis. I actually agree with all you posted but your crying about ALPA is getting old. Make your point and move on. We all know you don't like ALPA.
I think I should be paid more also. I haven't rolled over in defeat like you.

 

[hawkerjet]

I'm scared to think what he thinks I should be making flying corporate aircraft. Maybe I should be just happy that I am able to fly nice equipment and senoir management around. ( sarcasm)
I think you might be that guy that low balled a GIV daily rate because you were on vacation and had the time and wanted to go where the trip was heading. You have similar logic, which by the way, I detest.

 

[JoeMerchant]

You sure a bitter man! Relax Francis. I actually agree with all you posted but your crying about ALPA is getting old. Make your point and move on. We all know you don't like ALPA.
I think I should be paid more also. I haven't rolled over in defeat like you.

....and everyones bellyaching about what they get paid while they support a failed union is also getting old...What is your solution?

I'm not complaining about what I get paid.....I am tired of paying a union that actually makes the problem worse however.....

 

[Mamma]

....and everyones bellyaching about what they get paid while they support a failed union is also getting old...What is your solution?

I'm not complaining about what I get paid.....I am tired of paying a union that actually makes the problem worse however.....

If you were at my airline you would be happy to have ALPA on property. We put great guys in the MEC and they are doing a great job in my opinion. Our management, if given free reign would have our pay gutted even more than what the arbitrator Kasher did....34% cut to FOs in 2005. Their last FO offer was 9% with 5% the first year and 1% for the next 4 years...also kick in the horrendous work rules. All while they are making record profits! They have Ford and Harrison and all the cards on their side so I am happy having ALPA's resources to help us fight.

 

[800Dog]

....yet our UNION contracts have always started pilots out at low payrates...Even the United and CAL mainline contracts start pilots out low.....

How is that these non-union lawyers make so much right out of school...while us UNION pilots make so little....Hmmmm...

You mean those UNION contracts that were approved by said lowly paid regional pilots? Don't like the wage, vote no! You blame the union, I blame the yes voters.

 

[clickclickboom]

Sounds like you need to administer your finances. $8916 per month is barely enough to get by? WTF is wrong with you? Sounds like you gotta beat the wife into cooking more at home and not eat out all the time. Geesh.

You left out one important aspect:

Federal and State Taxes, Medicare etc etc etc..

$8916 while wishful thinking ends up at

$5700 per month including withdrawl for 10% 401K

Subtract the following monthly

$2117 Mortgage ( avg mort in usa is $1600)
$150 Taxes ( usa average)
$175 Insurance ( usa average)
$500 Utilities et al
$1400 Children Education Fund ( Currently it costs $700 per month from birth per child to pay room and board and misc average college expenses to send to state school in 18 years)
$679 2 car payments ( 4yr old minivan and 05 accord
$115 car insurance
$250 gas
$250 misc house mx

TOTAL $5636

AM I OUT OF LINE TO SAVE FOR MY CHILDRENS EDUCATION SO I DONT NEED TO GO $350,000 in debt? If you answered yes subtract the $1400 save nothing and have a $1464 monthly surplus remaining.

I think most will agree that those expenses are REASONABLE and indicative of many families. There is NO money figured in for Holidays, Vacation, Taking the wife out once a month etc etc..

We eat home every night by the way and do low or no cost family events ( park, hiking, bike rides, sports, fishing, camping) no disney or atlantis sorry

 

[Tanker Clown]

Tone down your life...

 

[Mamma]

You left out one important aspect:

Federal and State Taxes, Medicare etc etc etc..

$8916 while wishful thinking ends up at

$5700 per month including withdrawl for 10% 401K

Subtract the following monthly

$2117 Mortgage ( avg mort in usa is $1600)
$150 Taxes ( usa average)
$175 Insurance ( usa average)
$500 Utilities et al
$1400 Children Education Fund ( Currently it costs $700 per month from birth per child to pay room and board and misc average college expenses to send to state school in 18 years)
$679 2 car payments ( 4yr old minivan and 05 accord
$115 car insurance
$250 gas
$250 misc house mx

TOTAL $5636

AM I OUT OF LINE TO SAVE FOR MY CHILDRENS EDUCATION SO I DONT NEED TO GO $350,000 in debt? If you answered yes subtract the $1400 save nothing and have a $1464 monthly surplus remaining.

I think most will agree that those expenses are REASONABLE and indicative of many families. There is NO money figured in for Holidays, Vacation, Taking the wife out once a month etc etc..

We eat home every night by the way and do low or no cost family events ( park, hiking, bike rides, sports, fishing, camping) no disney or atlantis sorry

What about groceries? That's easily 3-5 hundred more dollars a month.

 

[TheInsider]

Reality: Our worth is what we are able to negotiate. Just like a product is worth what we are willing to pay for it.