Scenic Tours Requirements

[dkelly]

Looking to see whether or not I am legal to give scenic tours. I know that you must have Commercial license, Instrument rating if over 25 miles or night....and drug testing program. I recently began a program for the flight school I am working for. Does being on their program satisfy this requirement? Thanks

 

[cvsfly]

Not sure where you get the requirement "instrument rating if over 25 miles or at night". Are you operating under the exclusions of 119.1 or are you operating under Part 135? If the former, then you are limited to 25 sm non-stop radius (seating and payload capacity limits as well) and yes you would be subject to an FAA approved drug program. And yes a commercial license. If the latter than you must meet the requirements of at least 135.243(b) (VFR operator).

 

[yzf6]

The instrument rating is required for the commercial if you're carrying passengers more than 50nm, or at night.

 

[dkelly]

Actually, I'm looking to do It part 91. And your right yzf6 about the 50 mile. Any suggestions on part 91?

 

[yzf6]

Actually, I'm looking to do It part 91. And your right yzf6 about the 50 mile. Any suggestions on part 91?

All you should need then is a commercial, if you're not going more than 25sm, or landing at another airport. There's no 25mile limit for aerial photography flights though..

 

[midlifeflyer]

Maybe pretty obvious, but don't forget that Class 2 medical.

 

[cvsfly]

As far as the "instrument rating" bit. Are you referring to 61.133? Limitations set forth in (b). Yes you would have a limitation in any operation as a commercial pilot carrying pax more than 50 nm or at night if you didn't have an instrument rating (commercial license with this limitation noted). This is priviledges vs operating rules. Your sightseeing venture will be limited to 25 sm according to 119.1 and operating according to Part 91. Yes the FAA does check up on these things. If you advertise sightseeing flights, you better be on a drug program. We had FAA Drug Abatement inspectors through here the other day and after they left us, they were going to the flight schools in the area.

 

[dkelly]

OK, Sounds good. Does anyone have a reference for the drug testing requirement? One more question. I believe that it is legal for a CFII to give Instrument flight instruction in a tandem aircraft as long as the engine controls are accessible by both student and instructor. I raise the question because the radios and panel are only accessible by the front seat. Partial panel and other items would be more difficult. Let me know if you can find a reference anywhere, thanks

 

[midlifeflyer]

dkelly, here's your drug test reference: FAR 135.1(a)(5). (It's really too bad that 119.1(e)(2) doesn't point you to it)

==================================================
§ 135.1 Applicability.
(a) This part prescribes rules governing -
(5) Nonstop sightseeing flights for compensation or hire that begin and end at the same airport, and are conducted within a 25 statute mile radius of that airport; however, except for operations subject to SFAR 50-2, these operations, when conducted for compensation or hire, must comply only with §§ 135.249, 135.251, 135.253, 135.255, and 135.353.
==================================================

That list of rules that you have to comply with? Those are the drug and drug-testing rules.


BTW, the "dual controls" reg is 91.109. It's been interpreted to mean flight controls. But remember that the reg isn't everything. I can think of a couple of scenarios, especially when under IFR, where I wouldn't feel comfortable as a CFII if I couldn't get to the avionics.

 

[KlingonLRDRVR]

dkelly,

Probably more important than keeping square with the Feds is to ensure you are fully covered by insurance for exactly what you plan to do. If there's a problem everyone one gets named in the search for the deepest pockets. Good Luck.

KlingonLRDRVR

 

[Lead Sled]

I always cringe whenever I see guys asking how to do something on any of these forums. It's not that there isn't a lot of experience hanging out on these boards, but there's a lot of inexperience here too. Sometimes it's impossible to tell the two a part and even if you could, there's alway the possiblity that something important or significant could be missed.

I cut my teeth on scenic flying and the Feds are paying more attention to it than ever before. The first thing that I would do would be to schedule some one on one quality time with one of your friendly local FSDO guys. I've been earning my living in the left seat for 30 years and the one bit of advice I could give you is to develope a friendly working relationship with them. You'll develop a mutual respect that will pay off in the long run. It never hurts to be known as one of the guys who tries to do things right if you get my point.

The other point I would make would be to do as KlingonDRVR said and talk to your insurance folks. When all is said and done, it's not the FAA that determines who can fly what or who can do what - it's the insurance companies.

'Sled