rj captain question

[billjohnson321]

whats it like flyin with some of these new 100,000 dollar pilot mill graduates? i was in fla talking to some dca guys and they acted like they were already hired by delta.the rj seems like a lot of plane for someone coming straight out of a seminole.

 

[acaTerry]

While I agree that these academy kids are often times full of themselves, the CRJ and ERJ are not terribly difficult to operate. Its the "headwork" that too many of the low timers do not have.
Not trying to be critical, just taking an across-the-board response. I've seen some real good kids from from the academies, but only those who kept their egos in check.
Between the two planes, the ERJ is much easier.

 

[JJthejetplane]

Some of the better pilots I have flown with have been from Gulfstream. The seem to be better sticks and pay attention to the Ops Specs. Some of the other guys have bad habits and would rather fly single pilot, or they just don't know how to fly as a crew.

 

[sweptback]

Between the two planes, the ERJ is much easier.

As somebody who has only flown one of the two airplanes, I'm just curious why you think that?

 

[~~~^~~~]

whats it like flyin with some of these new 100,000 dollar pilot mill graduates? i was in fla talking to some dca guys and they acted like they were already hired by delta.the rj seems like a lot of plane for someone coming straight out of a seminole.

Is this flame bait?

Hate to break it to them, but the statistical possibility of any of those pilot wanna be's going to Delta are extreemly long. Delta is not hiring, the 737-200's are going somewhere ( other than off the runway ) as are the MD88's & 90's. Some of the current Delta pilots are headed for E170's for less than I earn with a 6 year old contract.

The pilot mill types vary. Overall, I wish the programs did not exist. I prefer the guys with 121, or cargo, experience. Former Delta, World, Eagle and Piedmont pilots have been the best new hires I have had the pleasure of working with.

A school can not teach experience. The mill types have very little situational awareness due to the fact that they have very little experience.

 

[~~~^~~~]

Some of the better pilots I have flown with have been from Gulfstream. .

Now that has got to be some flame bait

 

[J32driver]

I've flown with a couple of the low time guys. Most do a pretty good job with the procedures. They seem to be a little heavy handed and haven't learned the art of passenger comfort yet... that will come in time though. My biggest complaint is attitude. Some seem to have a pretty big chip on thier shoulder and don't like to take constructive criticism.

I think they know that everyone is looking at them, and that makes them a little more sensitive than your average new FO. If you can get them relaxed and comfortable with you, I find that usually by day 2 of a trip, they are ready to start asking questions and learning. Thats all that I really want.

 

[The_Russian]

Some of the better pilots I have flown with have been from Gulfstream.

It's not flaimbait. We are trained very well and it is hard to get through for most. We have the toughest training next to Great Lakes. 5 of the 10 street Captains in January's ground school failed our OM-1 test. Ouch! And these guys came from other regionals.

And we are really a cool bunch of guys to fly with and have a beer. Not at the same time though.

 

[Smacktard]

We are trained very well and it is hard to get through for most.

The best training money will buy!

 

[Hovernut]

As a graduate of one of those 'pilot mills,' may I shed some insight? I'll admit, the jump from the Seminole to the RJ was quite a humbling experience and I wish I had some sort of turboprop transition. One of the most difficult tasks was managing all the hardware and getting used to the crew environment. Who pushes this button or twists that knob in this particular phase of flight, and where IS that button/knob in the first place? Chair flying the craap out of the thing, especially with someone in the other seat is about the best thing to do to prepare. The fellas nowdays have a Frasca RJ sim and ground school to help the transition.

CAA, now DCA, does one heck of a job weeding people out. An unscientific study of mine, using my original instrument class as an example, yields the following results: 34 enrolled; 5 made it to CFI and to an airline. I saw it in the groundschool classes I taught and in the flight instructing I did. People who just didn't want to commit the blood/sweat/tears it took to make it through a fast-paced 141 program left in droves....after spending a fair amount of money usually. That place sure does prepare you to drink from the fire hose!

Yeah, sometimes I fly with CAs that look down upon my aviation training, and some who are just jerks (something you'll find in any occupation). But as a quick learner, I quickly got the hang of the RJ and just smile and nod at the quivers thrown my way from those losers, and soak up more knowledge and technique from CAs willing to share. The few goobers I've had the displeasure to fly with usually shut up after they find out my previous military/technical background. That's awefully nice of them, it allows me to blisfully listen to my right-wing radio on the ADF

 

[FL000]

My personal experience with them has been:

Great attitudes
Humble
Excellent at standard procedures
Vast knowledge of POH/Op Specs
Good CRM
Questionable non-standard skills due to lack of practical experience

Overall, I don't mind flying with them a bit.

 

[General Lee]

Is this flame bait?

Hate to break it to them, but the statistical possibility of any of those pilot wanna be's going to Delta are extreemly long. Delta is not hiring, the 737-200's are going somewhere ( other than off the runway ) as are the MD88's & 90's. Some of the current Delta pilots are headed for E170's for less than I earn with a 6 year old contract.

The pilot mill types vary. Overall, I wish the programs did not exist. I prefer the guys with 121, or cargo, experience. Former Delta, World, Eagle and Piedmont pilots have been the best new hires I have had the pleasure of working with.

A school can not teach experience. The mill types have very little situational awareness due to the fact that they have very little experience.

Fins,

So, you know there won't be any future replacements for the 737-200s, and all of the MD-88s and MD-90s? Weren't the MD88s the first to get the new interiors? I guess that means they are going first? Aren't the MD-90s going to SLC? Do you know something we do not? Also, we have a 4 year draw down of the 737-200s, and only 4 will be going this year. We have been hearing many rumors from good sources that the 737-700 will replace a lot of those aircraft in the future----when financing can be attained. And, you too may be earning the Chautaqua pay scale after your contract talks---since a carrot will be held out for you and your junior pilots---and will most likely be taken. You like to say that your airline is profitable and should share in the profits, but Delta route planning could easily set up a new El Paso hub for all of your planes, and then your "profits" would be nonexistant. Face it, Delta decides whether or not you will be profitable by placing your planes where the profits are. They could place the Chautaqua planes there next. So, in closing, I would just hope that you would refrain from your "This will happen next" stance, and maybe we both could enjoy this boat ride. We both have no clue what will happen next, except that I will likely hit 4,000 posts sometime next week.


Bye Bye--General Lee

 

[The_Russian]

The best training money will buy!

GAA grads spend half as much and anyone enrolled at a complete aviation program at a college, FSI, DCA, Pan Am, and the list goes on.

 

[Hovernut]

but Delta route planning could easily set up a new El Paso hub for all of your planes, and then your "profits" would be nonexistant.

Bye Bye--General Lee

Cool! Then I can commute from Los Alamos and make some REAL money on the side again at my old nuclear job!! Not to mention skiing at Clowdcroft and hovercrafting on the Rio Grande!! Oh General, please make it so

 

[Axel]

How- in the blue blazes- did this thread turn into another fight betweeen CA, ASA and DL.

 

[Rook]

To respond about the CRJ/ERJ...

I think that the ERJ may be more automated than the CRJ. ERJ's having FADEC and all makes thrust settings easier. I have no ERJ experience but flew the 120 and loved that airplane so I have faith in Embraer products.

And the GAA guys I've flown with have been great so far.

Rook

 

[Bluto]

CRJ vs. ERJ

I've flown both. Can't really tell you which one's easier. They're pretty much the same, except that it's easier to get a decent landing out of the CRJ (except in a x-wind!).

 

[ACE]

How- in the blue blazes- did this thread turn into another fight betweeen CA, ASA and DL.

[/Q

Because the general has no life and has to turn every thread into a DL vs. CA and ASA. That aside, I personally have had very few problems with DCA grads. Very very few of them have had attitude problems. Those with attitudes are not hard to knock down a notch if it becomes a problem.

 

[~~~^~~~]

As a graduate of one of those 'pilot mills,' may I shed some insight? .... One of the most difficult tasks was managing all the hardware and getting used to the crew environment.

I quickly got the hang of the RJ and just smile and nod at the quivers thrown my way from those losers, and soak up more knowledge and technique from CAs willing to share. The few goobers I've had the displeasure to fly with usually shut up after they find out my previous military/technical background. That's awefully nice of them, it allows me to blisfully listen to my right-wing radio on the ADF

You mentioned something that I have noticed more and more out of the DCA grads. What is it with the need for constant audio coming from some source other than the VHF Comm Radios? Listening to the ADF and missing calls was one thing, but lately they have been shown up for work with Crazy Eddie's Electronics store in their bags. CD, DVD, MP3, I-PODs, they have everything.

Hope that I am not one of the Captains you describe derisively, but a 300 hour wonder in an RJ just does not need any distrations in flight. For one thing, the FO needs to be keeping an eye on the Captain to ensure the left seater does not screw up. For another thing it is pretty inconsiderate not to even ask before deciding that you are bored with flying and want to do something else for the 30 minutes remaining in the flight.

These same guys take the radar over to their side, use it for something meaningless, like pointing it at the dirt, finding the City of Atlanta and commenting about the "level 5 just north of the airport." When finished, they leave the radar on their side, pointed at the moon, or the ground, with never a thought that the guy flying might actually need the radar for weather avoidance. All while missing radio calls and looking like a bobblehead doll in an earthquake.

General:

I always hope that you are right, but, LOA 46 and some other agreements that we are getting the whiff of certainly seem to indicate that Delta's job growth is not going to be at mainline ( although your furloughed pilots have prefential employment and bidding rights ).

The chance of mainline hiring a DCA grad ( even those in Delta's minority women's scholarship program ) are very darn slim. Of course, if your MEC had not consistently blundered on scope and if Dan Ford and the RJDC guys had got their PID the story would be completely different.

Unfortunately we get further, and further, from Delta flying performed by Delta pilots. Until that turns around, Delta is not going to be hiring.

~~~^~~~

 

[Hovernut]

You mentioned something that I have noticed more and more out of the DCA grads. For another thing it is pretty inconsiderate not to even ask before deciding that you are bored with flying and want to do something else for the 30 minutes remaining in the flight.

~~~^~~~

Fins, it's not just us "new" guys (been here over two years); I see plenty of CAs tuning in the sports channels or NASCAR, and some of the younger ones (I'm 39) getting their Radio Disney fix. As any good instrumented pilot is trained to do, I can multitask and prioritize. When in busy airspace or high workloads, it's strictly business. When cruising and the opportunity arises, I tune to my heart's content. It's usually a last-resort type of thing. As I've said before, I'll engage in meaningful conversation (usually more radio calls missed by both parties in that mode) or listen to a rant before I go about utilizing alternate entertainment options.

Bored with flying? On the contrary! You bet my head's on a swivel whilst winging my way through scenic country, as you ASA guys will find out flying out of SLC on OUR routes! Geez I'm going to miss flying out West!

I thought this job was supposed to be fun!? Are the ADF police going to be monitoring my usage now? Do you not think most people at this level in the profession have the common sense to know when it's appropriate or not? Yes, I agree that there are a few of your so called 'tweakers' that are still amazed with the technology and the job, but they'll settle down in due time and maybe a tactful word or two from your side will help educate them. In the mean time, when I fly with the few of those that say 5 words in a 5 day trip, I have my ADF.

I'll take 'Crazy Eddie's' electronic craap over the 12 or 13 boring channels the 'nicer' hotels have. No Fox News? Then I'll take my Drudge Report and Glenn Beck-Rush Limbaugh Insider feeds instead

Safety of flight is my primary concern. Period!

 

[180ToTheMarker]

These same guys take the radar over to their side, use it for something meaningless, like pointing it at the dirt, finding the City of Atlanta and commenting about the "level 5 just north of the airport." When finished, they leave the radar on their side, pointed at the moon, or the ground, with never a thought that the guy flying might actually need the radar for weather avoidance. All while missing radio calls and looking like a bobblehead doll in an earthquake.

Hey Fins, I think we have flown with some of the same FO's

 

[TopGun-MAV]

i gradruated flight school in florida and went straight to a 1900. now i'm in a jungle jet for a leading rj operator. it was a hard work but i finally made it to the jets. i now have apps out with all heavy iron ops waiting for a call.


maverick (jet fo)

 

[billjohnson321]

why do you call yourself maverick and quote top gun?the glory days of fighter pilots and top gun is loooooooong past. dork

 

[180ToTheMarker]

i gradruated flight school in florida and went straight to a 1900. now i'm in a jungle jet for a leading rj operator. it was a hard work but i finally made it to the jets.

How is going straight from flight school to a 1900 hard work? I thought paying your dues by being a CFI, hauling freight at 3am, and working a second job to put food on the table was hard work. I guess its all subjective.

 

[Axel]

i gradruated flight school in florida and went straight to a 1900. now i'm in a jungle jet for a leading rj operator. it was a hard work but i finally made it to the jets. i now have apps out with all heavy iron ops waiting for a call.


maverick (jet fo)

Here, fishy fishy

 

[BackSoon05]

"i gradruated flight school in florida and went straight to a 1900. now i'm in a jungle jet for a leading rj operator. it was a hard work but i finally made it to the jets. i now have apps out with all heavy iron ops waiting for a call."

Ok, I'll bite.

Thats not hard work, buddy. Thats luck.

 

[mooser]

"i gradruated flight school in florida and went straight to a 1900. now i'm in a jungle jet for a leading rj operator. it was a hard work but i finally made it to the jets. i now have apps out with all heavy iron ops waiting for a call."

Ok, I'll bite.

Thats not hard work, buddy. Thats luck.

Ditto

Mooser

Me= former CFI Freight/corportate then RJ took 4 years past skool

 

[Caveman]

As a very junior Captain at an airlne that hires a lot of the DCI grads I feel qualified to comment. Because I'm so junior I fly with dang near every FNG on property at one time or another. I've had no problems with the DCI guys and gals. They all have good attitudes, are reasonably humble, are willing to learn and for the most part pretty well prepared. Whatever they are doing at DCI is working because by the time I get to fly with them they are competent and qualified to be there. They are better pilots than I was at 1200 hours. Of course, that's a pretty low bar to get over.....

 

[Palerider957]

Fins, it's not just us "new" guys (been here over two years); I see plenty of CAs tuning in the sports channels or NASCAR, and some of the younger ones (I'm 39) getting their Radio Disney fix. As any good instrumented pilot is trained to do, I can multitask and prioritize. When in busy airspace or high workloads, it's strictly business. When cruising and the opportunity arises, I tune to my heart's content. It's usually a last-resort type of thing. As I've said before, I'll engage in meaningful conversation (usually more radio calls missed by both parties in that mode) or listen to a rant before I go about utilizing alternate entertainment options.


Whatever happened to reading the news paper?? All of you should use this time to prepare for a second career (realestate, investing, whatever....) Otherwise you'll never be anything but a galley slave in the regional empire.

Once in cruise, I'm a firm believer that if you leave the RJ alone, it'll leave you alone.

 

[Hovernut]

Whatever happened to reading the news paper?? All of you should use this time to prepare for a second career (realestate, investing, whatever....) Otherwise you'll never be anything but a galley slave in the regional empire.

Once in cruise, I'm a firm believer that if you leave the RJ alone, it'll leave you alone.

I agree. But some of these guys don't even let you do that! Just like the Navy; no unauthorized reading materials! Yeah right...on a 3 month missile patrol you learn to avoid the Chief or the 0 while you pass the time, yet are always vigilent as to how the reactor is running. That's why I listen to the ADF instead. I'm always trolling for a copy of the Financial Times or WSJ when we live in a USA Today world!