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Results of Eagle Flight 5401 Accident Investigation

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The plane was on the ground for a good 3-4 seconds and didn't loose any speed. Looks like the FO never brought the power to flight idle. And he was about 5-10 knots fast too.
 
hotwings402 said:
How did they find out he was taking meds? Did he volunteer it after the accident? Geez.

Dude, they take a urine and blood test after ANY accident to see whether you are under the influence of any drugs or alcohol. Very unlikely he would volunteer such information. It's a very powerful sedative, and should not be taken while flying.

Depending on the medications half-life, it can be detected for several days after being taken. It does not necessarily have to have been taken that day either. For those of you wondering, all medications have published half-lives. For instance, if a drugs half-life is say, 12 hours, then after 12 hours of ingesting the medicine, half of it is excreted from the body. 12 hours later of of the remaining is excreted, and so on. As you can see, the more days that go by, less and less is removed.

Take 20mgs.

12 hrs./10mgs.

24 hrs./5mgs.

36 hrs./2.5mgs. remains in system...


FYI, I used to work in a mom & pop pharmacy part-time while in school. Learned a lot and actually got to fill prescriptions....:)
 
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Thats true, I'm sure theres alot of guys on this board that have had anxiety at some point or even depression but please guys don't take this stuff while flying, its probably worse than drinking and flying.
 
hotwings402 said:
Thats true, I'm sure theres alot of guys on this board that have had anxiety at some point or even depression but please guys don't take this stuff while flying, its probably worse than drinking and flying.

I agree.
Mmeds. are just a crutch. Don't solve anything except band-aid the problem. You need to find out whats causing these things.

One post mentioned that it was his first day off IOE and with a difficult captain. I can see why he may have wanted some chillout pills!:)

I noticed from the video the CA told the FO that they were gonna balloon, yet they were still pretty far out from the threshold and 1,000 marker. He also told him not to pull back or flare, I guess so that it would prevent against any ballooning. But at the speed they were at, I think if he began his flare they might have floated a little bit, not balloon. I don't think it they were set up to balloon at the speed, height and distance from where it was called out.
 
T-prop said:
Results of EGF 5401 Accident Investigation
[font=verdana, arial, helvetica]SAFETY RECOMMENDATIONS

As a result of the investigation of the Executive Airlines Flight 5401 accident, the National Transportation Safety Board makes the following recommendations.

To the Federal Aviation Administration:

Require all 14 Code of Federal Regulations Part 121 and 135 air carriers to incorporate bounced landing recovery techniques in their flight manuals and to teach these techniques during initial and recurrent training.
[/font]

Now that sounds like fun - would that involve some practice in the sim? ;-)
 
Here is another reason why you don't take drugs and fly. People die.

http://ntsb.gov/ntsb/brief.asp?ev_id=20010816X01703&key=1

The toxicological examination revealed that 0.049 ug/ml of codeine, in conjunction with 1.658 ug/ml of morphine, was detected in the pilot's urine. Morphine is an inactive metabolite of codeine. No codeine or morphine was detected in the pilot's blood. Codeine is a narcotic painkiller, used for control of moderate to severe pain. Codeine is found in various prescription painkillers, as well as in some over-the-counter cough suppressants.

Additionally, the toxicological examination revealed that 0.355 ug/ml of paroxetine was detected in the pilot's blood, and unspecified levels of paroxetine were detected in liver tissue and urine samples. Paroxetine (trade name Paxil) is a prescription antidepressant medication commonly prescribed to patients suffering from social anxiety disorders, and panic attacks.

During a telephone conversation with the National Transportation Safety Board investigator-in-charge on January 3, 2002, the pilot's personal physician reported that he had prescribed the accident pilot's prescription for Paxil, but had not prescribed any medication that contained codeine. The physician added that he first started treating the accident pilot on May 9, 2001, after the pilot complained of ongoing chest and throat tightness. According to his physician, the pilot explained to him that he had a longstanding history of anxiety that was previously treated with other anxiety medication. The pilot told the physician that he had to discontinue use of the medication since he was a pilot.

The NTSB medical officer reviewed the medical records obtained from the accident pilot's physician, and extracted, in part, the following information.

May 9, 2001, the physician wrote in the pilot's medical records, in part: "26-year-old male comes in today for "years" of ongoing chest and throat tightness. ... He says it often comes on when there is bad weather and he has to fly, or when he has to give his briefing talk to several people." The medical records note that the pilot was scheduled for an Upper GI Series, to be conducted within the next two weeks. Additionally, the physician prescribed 10 mg of Paxil to be taken once per day, and provided the pilot with a one-month supply of Paxil sample packages.

On May 23, the accident pilot underwent an Upper GI Series examination. According the physician's notes, the examinations findings were, in part: "There is moderate large distal sliding hiatal hernia with minor gastroesophageal reflux." Additionally, the physician writes: "...He [the pilot] also says he feels slightly better on Paxil 10 mg, so tomorrow he is starting 20 mg per day. He says he'll phone when he needs more meds."

On June 19, the accident pilot visited the physician for a follow-up appointment. The physician's notes state: "... comes in with progress report on his Paxil trial... He notices that he has less anxiety while flying his plane and less subjective shortness of breath while speaking to people in the airplane. It was getting to be enough of a bother that he was real unhappy with his job. Now he says that's being reversed. ...He complained of a little grogginess upon waking in the morning, but feels that it clears rapidly and is not present at the time of his going to work. ... will increase the Paxil from 20 mg to 30 mg a day. Told him again to expect a subtle increase in his early morning grogginess. He understands that he's not to work if he feels that this is impairing him at all. I also was clear that his records would have to be surrendered if an employer requested them. He agrees and understands. He'll increase to 30 mg for next three weeks and see if he feels in optimal control of anxiety. If not, he'll increase to 40 mg and notify me - samples given today for about 6 weeks."

On July 25, five days before the accident, the pilot's physician made the following entry in the pilot's medical records: "By the way - Request for refill of samples today. Feels 30 mg is good dose of Paxil..."

The FAA's 1999 Guide for Aviation Medical Examiners states, in part: "The use of a psychotropic drug is considered disqualifying. This includes all sedatives, tranquilizers, antipsychotic drugs, antidepressant drugs , analeptics, anxiolytics, and hallucinogens." The drug Paroxetine (Paxil) is considered a mood-ameliorating drug and requires a review by the FAA's medical certification division before being used by pilots. The prescribing physician was not an FAA certified medical examiner.
 
Pa32-300 Accident, not ATR.

This post is in reference to the preceding one, in regards to the sight seeing pilot of a Pa32-300, NOT the ATR.


Medications also increase your susceptibility to histotoxic hypoxia. This is a condition where your tissue cells are unable to utilize the oxygen being transported through your blood for cellular uptake. Bascially, even at a relatively low altitude, someone who smokes an/or takes unapproved medications will experience hypoxia at lower altitudes. This may be well below the 12,500' threshold or the more pracitcal figure of 10,000.

Personally, he may either not have been psychologically suited to pilot a plane or he should have tried to deal with these feelings he was having through therapy. The article states that weather and flying along with the briefing casued him anxiety. This could have been treated in other ways. Maybe he wasn't confident in his IFR skills or the aircraft he was flying. Perhaps more time with a more experienced mentor in IMC could have helped. A course on public speaking or just reading and practicing your speaking skills might have helped too. Sometimes exercises in public speaking can alleviate this fear and may actually make you more relaxed overall.
 
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