Recurrent question

[8AF]

Any regional out there will give you at least one sim session before your PC ride?
Second question: V1 cut - is that a failure if you veered to the runway edge then regain control?

 

[CoolSidePillow]

it depends on the carrier. I have heard of some places that give you a training event first but the checkride doesnt allow for any TP's afterwards. Other places put you in the sim cold and might allow for a certain number of TP's.... when you think about it.... as a professional pilot with lives in your hands you should be able to to fly and handle your aircraft everyday at work without practice. As far as V1 cut failure.... I think it is up to the discretion of the sim instructor and what guidelines he is going by as to whether or not you bust if you veered around the centerline a bit. Did you do that in a plane with aft mounted jets?

 

[8AF]

yes, just busted my PC in the CRJ sim.

Well, I guess I should just learn from it. I wasn't as prepared as I thought.

 

[rickair7777]

yes, just busted my PC in the CRJ sim.

Well, I guess I should just learn from it. I wasn't as prepared as I thought.

Most PC's are done cold-turkey (to save $). The big problem for us during a PC is that the SIM does NOT fly like the real airplane...and you are used to the real thing! (CAE sims seem better than FS sims as far as the CRJ goes) Of course the instructor understands that, and is normally willing to give you leeway (like veering off CL on a V1) due to the fact that you are not used to the sim.

However the PC event is a "whole person" evaluation. The instructor wants to see evidence of preparation and that you give a sh*t. If you show up on time, neatly dressed and groomed, study limitaions and systems, and know your profiles COLD, any instructor will give you leeway on simulator squirliness. Every place I've worked, the instructor can rewind, retrain you on the spot, and have you do it again for credit. If you weren't allowed to do this, the instructor was probably underwhelmed by your overall knowledge level prior to that point...

Play the game the way it's supposed to be played.

 

[great cornholio]

Both regionals I've ever flown for have thrown you in the sim cold turkey. They usually give you 2 TPs. (have to be diff manuevers. Can't both be a V1 cut.) Heres how the typical TP works. You fail your first V1 cut. Rewind and do one for practice. Rewind again and this one counts towards the PC. Do it good keep on goin. Mess it up again you bust the ride. Now if you mess up a stall you get to TP on that again the same way. Now lets say you do something dumb and dick up a hold. Thats your 3rd busted manuever so the checkride is done you don't get anymore chances to hold. Thats how its worked at both regionals I've flown for.

 

[8AF]

rickair777 you are right, the instructor thought I'm not well prepared (knowledge). However, I would say it was my inexperience in preparing for PC. I did spent a lot of time study but he asked me several items on the Captain's flow which I did not expect. The whole oral lasted less than 30 mins which I don't think was comprehensive evaluation of my knowledge level. He was called to do the PC last minute which doesn't help.
So it wasn't a good start and here we go into the sim. V1 cut was mentioned above. Yes I veered but I regained control, not off pavement. SE ILS was above Vapp at 1000' but back to Vapp by 500'. It is the sim so I was fighting to get it stablelize. I was centered on LOC and slope the whole time. The only one I think I truly deserve a retrain was the go around didn't call for flaps 8.
By the book I deserve a fail ride but there is inconsistency in conducting PC. A buddy of mine went full scale on the 1st ILS and unstable on the 2nd and still pass. Now I will study up and do it again but I don't think it was fair.

 

[700Flyer]

A checking event for the check airman/examiner is always a humble moment, as he/she is privileged to look through a momentary "window" at your systems
knowledge and flying skills, and evaluate your decision making process in the "office" you live in.

In most cases these guys do not make decisions flippantly and it bums them out to the extreme when they have to bust someone.

It is not based on a maneuver or two - it is always a comprehensive evaluation of your overall performance. We've all had days we are glad to walk away in one piece...you just don't wanna have one of those days when it is your checkride.

 

[great cornholio]

rickair777 you are right, the instructor thought I'm not well prepared (knowledge). However, I would say it was my inexperience in preparing for PC. I did spent a lot of time study but he asked me several items on the Captain's flow which I did not expect. The whole oral lasted less than 30 mins which I don't think was comprehensive evaluation of my knowledge level. He was called to do the PC last minute which doesn't help.
So it wasn't a good start and here we go into the sim. V1 cut was mentioned above. Yes I veered but I regained control, not off pavement. SE ILS was above Vapp at 1000' but back to Vapp by 500'. It is the sim so I was fighting to get it stablelize. I was centered on LOC and slope the whole time. The only one I think I truly deserve a retrain was the go around didn't call for flaps 8.
By the book I deserve a fail ride but there is inconsistency in conducting PC. A buddy of mine went full scale on the 1st ILS and unstable on the 2nd and still pass. Now I will study up and do it again but I don't think it was fair.

Was it your first ever PC/recurrent? From what I've seen it seems like most people don't study much for the first PC because they figure that they will learn it all again in the few days of recurrent class. Recurrent class is fast paced and usually you don't learn much during those days so in order to be ready for the oral you have to study before you get to class. The other problem that people have with their first recurrent is that they have no idea what to expect. Anyways take this as a learning experience and move on. Everyone has a bad day. You just were unlucky and had yours in the sim.

 

[8AF]

Thanks for the encouragement guys. Cornholio you are right on; it was my first PC and I didn't know what to expect. I guess I was complacent too because I did well on the job as a first year FO. I know the profile and call out but forgot to do some chair flying before the PC, so when going into the sim cold turkey I just didn't do so well.
700flyer, I guess you are a check airman and I understand what you say. If I were in his/your shoes I may also do the same thing; therefore no hard feeling. However, I still feel that my case was not a clear cut failure. It is hard to swallow since it is my first failed checking event (ATP, ADX, MEI and the initial training). Nevermind, I will get over it in a few days.