Raytheon declares war on pilots?

[gunfyter]

FLOPS had better lawyers maybe.

But I would say certain incidents and situations mentioned in the document...

while it is not necessary to have a union to say NO... I am not flying this trip or yes i am writing up this plane...

When you get fired there is no grievance procedure without having a union.

 

[luvu]

the difference was that John didn't start with Teamsters lawyers

One can also see that engaging in "protected activity" is no defense in our court system unless you have a quality legal team with lots of money to back you from the outset.

Vote ASAP, if only for the access to high powered legal counsel.

 

[luvu]

you got that right

These ruling will have an impact on any pending lawsuits against FO / RTA.

You got that right. At any future trials or hearing of grievance, FO/RTA management will not to be able to lie about or deny their pattern of dispatching aircraft in unairworthy condition.

That FACT is now a part of the legal landscape. Management has no power to change this.

A pilot union, however, can absolutely change this. A strong union, can say, "this sh>t stops today."

Because everybody knows a Strong Union has the power to make this stick, having a Strong Union on property will go a LONG ways toward repairing FO's reputation in the marketplace.

 

[LAZYB]

If you read the entire document, you will see that the judge ruled against John G.

Topliff​

.

These ruling will have an impact on any pending lawsuits against FO / RTA.

That link is to a DOL administrative judgement.

My reference is to legal action taken by the 5 or 6 pilots (don't remember/don't care) against Flight Options/RTA/Raytheon. Details of which are sealed, with a gag order. Search and you will find that we are talking a minimum of $ millions each.

 

[luvu]

reposted "with author's permission" from another board

I am… someone who tries to research things and think about them before forming an opinion or taking a course of action. I’ve tried hard to sort through the rhetoric on all sides of the issue now before us, searching for those grains of gold in all the sand that’s being flung up. I try hard to be respectful of other people’s ideas and opinions, even if I don’t agree with them. I’ve been called many things: “a little tightly wrapped”, “slightly over-caffeinated”, “a danged Liberal” (and those are just from my Dad!); but I hope that “close-minded” isn’t one of them.

I am… a professional decision-maker. I evaluate, analyze and try to reach sound, logical conclusions all day, every day. It’s what I’ve been trained to do; it’s what my profession demands. I don’t respond well to a “hard sell”, and telling me what I think, or should think, is an almost sure way to get me to turn you off.

I am… someone who’s never had any exposure to unions before this, and was anti-union in my outlook when I first came here. I was “original” Flight Options, right down to my gold and teal necktie; a True Believer. Since then, I’ve watched three different management teams; I’ve listened to what they said, and I’ve seen what they did. Over time, I’ve seen a motivated, familial group of people, eager to demonstrate “fanatical attention to detail” to our Owners - turn into an angry, dispirited group of people who, many times, are only going through the motions necessary to get our Owners from Point A to Point B. I’ve watched morale slowly spiral lower and lower.

I am… mindful of the lessons I’ve learned in my life about trust in relationships. Trust is a fragile thing, and once abused it takes a very long time to rebuild. Once broken, it may be beyond repair. Our Company’s management (and their predecessors) have made a number of promises, assertions, representations and nuanced suggestions, many of which have turned out to be without substance, misleading or downright untrue. I have seen benefits scrapped because they were “not sustainable for this size of a company”; yet those same type programs seem to work just fine at some of the Fortune 500 companies. I have seen programs and initiatives, loudly promoted when they first appeared, quietly die. I have seen incentives bargained away, sneakily, behind my back, only to find out about it after the fact. I have seen assurances negated, promises made by one set of managers summarily withdrawn by another set of managers, for unsupportable reasons (or in some cases, NO apparent reason). I have seen people forced out of their previous seats, even as I have lost seniority to those same people. I have heard repeated requests to “give us a chance”, “give us one more chance” and “we hope it’s not too late to earn your trust”. I think that the trust which had been established between our Company’s management and the majority of our pilots is presently inop; I think it has been MEL’d one too many times, and that this latest attempt at an MEL extension is just a little too far beyond the limit for most of us to feel comfortable to continue to fly it. I would politely suggest that perhaps it is too late, and I would refer those people asking for trust to my comments at the beginning of this paragraph.

I am… not afraid of my company’s management. Indeed, I count some of the middle managers as close personal friends, and some as professional acquaintances whom I respect a great deal. I have listened to their ideas, and in some cases I have asked for their views before coming to my own conclusions. I am willing to believe that there may be more to some stories than I’m aware of, and I’m not afraid to ask for more information, instead of leaping to unsupported assumptions. I don’t believe anyone in upper management either likes or dislikes me personally; any more than you might look at a bee hive and feel anything really positive or negative about any of the individual bees; they’re just a group, and they produce a product you want or need - nothing more. Any good lawyer will tell you: It’s not about you, so don’t make it personal. Take the emotion out of the equation; there’s nothing but a set of facts. But, like numbers, they can be used to tell you whatever you want to hear.

I am… skeptical of my Company’s motivation in offering me an improved compensation plan, and in listening and responding to my issues, at this particular moment in time. I am not unaware that our Company has had quite some time to develop and offer me an improved compensation plan, and to listen to my issues before now; nor am I unaware that they did not seem terribly interested in my compensation or issues until there was 1) a highly lucrative and industry-setting contract covering compensation and Quality of Life issues, brought to conclusion by a Union at our largest competitor, and 2) a nascent and imminent organizational drive underway at our Company, conducted by that same Union. I am also skeptical of Raytheon’s timing in 1) acquiring the last outstanding 4% interest in our Company; and 2) our recent re-acquisition of RAS mechanics which used to be our to start with.

I am… someone who wants a career here, and still wants to retire from here. I do not want a stepping-stone to somewhere else. I want our Company to be successful, so making demands on the Company which are not sustainable is not in my best interest; accepting pay and working conditions less than what I am worth is also not in my best interest. Assumptions that I will do either are naïve, at best.

I am… an educated, mature, thoughtful professional. I have not said anything on this forum (or any other) that I am personally ashamed of, or would have difficulty repeating to anyone’s face. I will not stoop to, or participate in, name-calling, personal ridicule or malicious personal attacks on anyone, management or otherwise. To do otherwise demeans me, undermines my sense of self-respect and makes it vastly less likely that I will be taken seriously and/or be negotiated with as the mature adult that I am, or be shown the respect I am due as an individual.

I am… after much thought, prayer and consideration of all sides of the question, taking a stand on the side of our Union. I think that self-representation might have once been a good idea; but I think that our co-workers who are presenting FOPA to us, if they are sincere (and I have no valid reason to assume they aren't), might have chosen a less awkward time to unveil their proposal. My opinion, for what it's worth, is that currently we are better served by being part of a strong cross-industry Union which represents all fractional pilots, not just those which work at one Company or another; and which has the experience and resources to effectively and expeditiously assist us in reaching a fair and equitable agreement with our Employer. I fervently hope that every one of us will allow every other one of us to do the same thing: acting not on emotion, or fear of reprisal, or a sense of wanting to get back some of your own; but using your intellect to reach a heartfelt and comfortable decision; that is, one you can feel at ease with at the end of the day, knowing you made the “right” decision for yourself and your family, no matter what it was you decided. I fully realize that no matter what the outcome of our vote, we will all still be working and flying together; even if we didn’t vote for the same thing, we can still show respect and care for one another, and remain the same friends that we always have been.

I am… aware that our Company is characterizing our Union as “outsiders”. Well, I’m not an outsider. I’m the same person you’ve been flying with, talking to, eating meals with, and trusting your life to for years. We spend more time with each other than we do with our “real” families – in a sense, we are family. Over time, we’ve talked about our spouses, our kids, our parents, our siblings, our pets, our houses, our cars, our boats, our side businesses, our finances, our pasts, our plans for the future, our regrets, and our dreams. I’m sure that, at one point, you’ve told me, or I’ve told you things we’ve never even told our spouses. I’m not an outsider – I’m one of us. You want to know who IBT 1108 is? It’s all of us, united in our support of one another, and working together to make our Company not just successful, but the best in our industry.

I am… CJ Captain Mike McLeod.

I am IBT 1108.

 

[luvu]

Another Yes Vote-reposted with permission

"Finally found a time when 1) I was on the ground; and 2) spouse was at home and/or awake. Got my VIN and PIN and cast my vote for IBT 1108.

I have voted in every election for which I was qualified since I was 18. In most national, even local elections, there is a sense that, individually, one's vote probably doesn't carry much direct importance; this is not to say that voting is not an important civic duty(!) - it's just that seldom do elections of that scope come down to individual votes. I have to say that this election is probably the first in which I felt truly that my individual vote might carry any specific importance.

In that vein, I feel that each of us need to reflect on and appreciate the importance of each person's vote in this election.

To those of us who have voted: each of us having made a personal commitment to join a larger cause, we are now obligated to reach out to our friends and co-workers to help them understand our ideas, our reasons, and our decisions. Talk to your friends, your acquaintances, your fellow pilots whom you encounter in your travels. You have taken a brave stand: approach those you meet bravely and ask them if there is any information you can give them to help them make their own decision. Listen to their questions; if you don't know the answer specifically, ask any of the Organizers and get the straight scoop. Take a name and 4-letter so you can get the info back to them. If they have a differing viewpoint, hear their side with consideration. If you disagree on a point or a conclusion, please, do so politely. Part as friends and remember that you'll be flying with him or her someday; how they see you, now, will color how they'll see us, then.

To the vast majority who read, but seldom post: If you are still undecided, please, talk to one of us - you need not publicly post if you're not comfortable with that - write someone a Private Message. Ask us the "hard questions"; heck, ask us any questions; clearly, I personally have nothing to hide, not even my name. I am not alone in that. We'll tell you what we know; if we don't know for sure, we'll find out and get right back to you, or we'll have someone who does know get back to you.

Much has been written about what happened and why. Timelines have been expounded upon, motives have been speculated on, accusations and counter-accusations have been made. All irrelevant at this stage; we are where we are. However; throughout all of the finger pointing, angst, daily Q&A and ongoing drama, no one seems to be able to specifically answer one central question:

When there are people meeting to make decisions about things which affect my life, why is it bad for me to have a voice in that discussion?

There is also the issue of trust. Jim Eppley wrote a very nicely worded piece on trust which he posted on the Company discussion board. He also had the class and respect to send it to me personally prior to posting it, and we discussed it at length. Jim and I are good friends, and although we reached different conclusions, we remain good friends. Jim has expressed his thoughts well, and I think I've expressed myself adequately. Whereas Jim is still willing to trust a verbal assurance from our Company's management, I (among many others) have chosen to place my trust in a written agreement that cannot be changed capriciously. I am reminded of the Russian proverb: Доверя́й, но проверя́й (Trust, but verify), made popular during the 1980's by President Reagan. I think it speaks to the issue of trust as being required on both sides of the issue: I will trust the Company, and believe that what the Company promises to do for me is true; but they in turn must trust me enough to put their promises on paper and put their name to it. In this way we demonstrate our trust in, and to, each other.

This is the critical time; the election is far from over and the shape of our Company's future hangs in the balance. I encourage us all, frequent posters or casual lurkers, to talk to those we meet; keep the tone of our posts and discussions civil; ask and get answers to the questions which matter to each, and let's work together to climb this ship back up to our best cruising altitude.

Best regards,
Mike McLeod

 

[Spackler]

Bump

QUOTES FROM MARTIN LEVITT’S BOOK, CONFESSION OF A UNION BUSTER

"A union-organization effort only results from one thing: BAD MANAGEMENT"