Question regarding Comair flying going to ASA and Skywest

[capt. megadeth]

It seems that when Skywest started getting ASA airplanes and flying, people were up in arms calling them scabs, saying they should "refuse" to fly those airplanes. Since ASA is getting Comair flying and airplanes, are the ASA guys expected to do the same and are they "scabs" if they don't? Just curious.

 

[79%N1]

Do you not understand that ASA did not take concessions, undercut, or agree to fly larger aircraft for 50 seat pay in order to secure new flying? That is a big difference. Skywest Inc bid on the Delta RFP, won it, and assigned the aircraft to ASA. All while the ASA pilots are standing strong and fighting for a good contract.

 

[Rogue5]

79%, please see my other post in response to you. The "50 seat pay" argument no longer applies:

I am sure that you must be aware that the "700/900 flyin for 50 seat rates" situation no longer applies. As of Jan 1st 2007 all 50 seat CRJ flying rates will increase 1% and 700/900 flying will receive a 5% override with an additional increase of 1% each year until 2010.

So, a 4th year 50 seat RJ Captain (for example) will get paid:

$61.54 x 1.01 = $62.16

if he/she flies a 700/900 their override will equate to:

$62.16 x 1.05 = $65.26 in 2007.
$62.16 x 1.06 = $65.89 in 2008.
$62.16 x 1.07 = $66.51 in 2009.
$62.16 x 1.08 = $67.13 in 2010.

Again, this is pay for 4th year Captains only, and does not take into account standard year longevity increases around 3% per year.

FWIW, www.airlinepilotcentral.com shows ASA's 4th year 200 Captain rate at $60.00 and a 700 Captain rate at $66.00 (rounded numbers, I'm sure)...

 

[capt. megadeth]

That's not my point. My point is is that ASA is going to be flying Comair airplanes thus possibly resulting in job losses at Comair. Are you not both ALPA? Aren't you going to stand up with your ALPA brethren and refuse the flying unless it is done by Comair pilots?

Do you not understand that ASA did not take concessions, undercut, or agree to fly larger aircraft for 50 seat pay in order to secure new flying? That is a big difference. Skywest Inc bid on the Delta RFP, won it, and assigned the aircraft to ASA. All while the ASA pilots are standing strong and fighting for a good contract.

 

[MarineGrunt]

This should get interesting.........

Hang on.... gotta take some Dramamine before this spin gets out of control,,,

 

[doh]

It's a nice thought but will not happen in the current environment. ALPA screwed the pooch 30 years ago when they allowed outsourcing. They still haven't figured out that they need to unify (hey, isn't that word a derivative of union?). If they ever do figure it out, then pilots can stand together. Until then, it is each "bargaining unit" for themselves. Management can continue to erode the quality of life for everyone until that day arrives.

 

[79%N1]

79%, please see my other post in response to you. The "50 seat pay" argument no longer applies:

Yea, I read the post with those jokes of rates or "Over-rides". It is so sad, it doesnt even rate a response.

 

[WWEfan]

This ASA pilot is not happy about flying Comair's airplanes, but what can I do about it? I can't refuse a trip and I wouldn't expect a SKYW pilot to refuse an airplane just because it has an EV tail number. We are all in this mess together. We just have to stand tough and stop bending over for growth.

 

[SBD]

As a Comair pilot I was originally pissed about this announcement. How dare ASA take our planes! But when it comes down to the bottom line, we are all just contractors. ALPA is a joke when it comes to the regionals. I am very honored to fly for a regional whose pilots fought for a somewhat decent rate to fly a RJ. Delta is who decides what companies they want to fly their regionals. ASA has no say in where they fly or what they fly. Comair pilots would have been elated if this decision went our way. It sucks that our planes are going away. If we strike I hope that no one crosses that line and picks up the flying. The regional business is a whipsaw that will keep on going until we get everyone on the same page. ASA I'm happy you guys got, instead of MESA or CHQ. I trully hope that things will get better at Comair because it is a nice place to work. I'm still somewhat new to the airline business but that being said it really is beyond our control. The majors decide who is the cheapest and 9 times out of 10 that is who they are going to choose. Good luck to ASA.

 

[FmrFreightDog]

A very small percentage of vocal ASA pilots were on here calling Skywest pilots names. Most of us understand that, even though we don't like it, airplanes move where managements want them to move, not where pilots want them to move. The vast majority of ASA pilots never faulted the Skywest pilots when our 70s started going away.

Having said that.....

Am I happy about flying Comair airplanes? Not at all. Can I do anything about it (short of quit my job)? No. Will I understand when a vocal minority of Comair pilots want to call me names? Yep.

It's a sorry situation. Peoples' lives get affected and there is a need to vent. I understand that. Honestly, I'll understand if some of the Comair pilots want to hate us.

For the record, I have not once made a negative remark about the Skywest pilot group. What were they supposed to do? Refuse to fly the airplanes? Although that might have been a highly principled stand to take, principles don't buy groceries. Like I said, the vast majority of ASA pilots don't hold anything against Skywest pilots. I can only hope the Comair guys feel the same.

 

[bvt1151]

That's not my point. My point is is that ASA is going to be flying Comair airplanes thus possibly resulting in job losses at Comair. Are you not both ALPA? Aren't you going to stand up with your ALPA brethren and refuse the flying unless it is done by Comair pilots?

Are you suggesting ASA take active steps to stop the whip-saw!?!? They can't even take active steps to negotiate their own contract.

 

[capt. megadeth]

Wow....thanks guys! No nasty responses. This was more aimed at the pilots that were ripping on Skywest pilots before.

 

[wmuflyguy]

Are you suggesting ASA take active steps to stop the whip-saw!?!? They can't even take active steps to negotiate their own contract.

Ah..crap, here we go.


It doesn't bother me as much as SkyWest flying the planes, because ASA can still negotiatie a significant pay raise. I it will really bother me, if they take some crappy pay rates after they are recieving a little "growth"

 

[COOPERVANE]

I am not going to refuse to fly a Comair airplane, but I'm not on here high-fiving myself about it. I don't enjoy growth at someone elses expense.

The difference is, there were some on this board that were GIDDY at the prospect of growth when ASA was loosing A/C to SKW. Just a little TOO excited about it.

Comair pilots have always been a class act and I wish them luck. We will both need it.

 

[IFLYASA]

I am not at all happy to take Comair's planes. Even though I work at ASA, Comair is a much better run company over ASA. Everytime I go into CVG, the rampers are always there, there is always an open gate, and the ground crews are quick to service the aircraft. I can't say that about Atlanta. Why Delta would dismantle a great company is beyond me.

Good luck guys/gals....

 

[imacdog]

Why Delta would dismantle a great company is beyond me.

Remember that we are talking about a company that decided random flight cancellations and an employee fund for purchasing fuel would be a good idea.

 

[Tomct]

Not happy about getting those airplanes. To the Comair folks....I'm Sorry! You can bank on the fact that I would NEVER cross a picket line of yours or ANY Union carrier. Hope things turn around for ya'll. Happy Holidays...FWIW!

 

[SkyNation]

It seems that when Skywest started getting ASA airplanes and flying, people were up in arms calling them scabs, saying they should "refuse" to fly those airplanes. Since ASA is getting Comair flying and airplanes, are the ASA guys expected to do the same and are they "scabs" if they don't? Just curious.

no. well, at least not here on the daily moronathon that is fi.com. here, anything done under the banner of ALPA is lauded as 'sticking to your guns' or 'nutting up' or 'having a spine.' unless it is in regards to mesa, of course.