Question for the Reg gurus

[CLECA]

If a person has a current .299 check, and then transitions to new equipment which they have never flown before, does that .299 carry over or require a new .299 before flying as PIC on the new equipment? I can't find anything in the regs that prevents this but it just seems like a new line check would be required. Thanks

 

[t-bone]

If a person has a current .299 check, and then transitions to new equipment which they have never flown before, does that .299 carry over or require a new .299 before flying as PIC on the new equipment? I can't find anything in the regs that prevents this but it just seems like a new line check would be required. Thanks

.299 line checks are not type specific. "No certificate holder may use a pilot...as PIC of a flight unless...that pilot has passed a flight check in ONE of the types of aircraft which that pilot is to fly."

135.299 (a).

 

[pilotyip]

But a LC under a different Part airplane, i.e 121, will only apply to that Part. We ran innto this problem when one of DC-9 Capt's was flying the Lear also. The FAA would not accept his DC-9 LC for the LJ because of a different set of regs.

 

[CLECA]

.299 line checks are not type specific. "No certificate holder may use a pilot...as PIC of a flight unless...that pilot has passed a flight check in ONE of the types of aircraft which that pilot is to fly."

135.299 (a).

I understand that reg, my question is: Is there another reg somwhere that addresses new equipment or an initial training stipulation.

In other words, can this guy go fly as a captain, on an airplane he has never set foot in solely on the fact that he has a current line check in another aircraft? I should also mention we have an approved program for OE, and I have taken that into consideration. Thanks again.

 

[pilotyip]

Line Check

I understand that reg, my question is: Is there another reg somwhere that addresses new equipment or an initial training stipulation.

In other words, can this guy go fly as a captain, on an airplane he has never set foot in solely on the fact that he has a current line check in another aircraft? I should also mention we have an approved program for OE, and I have taken that into consideration. Thanks again.

A line check 135.299 is a check of the ability to go from point A to point B, this can be done in any airplane in which you hold a 135.293. The PC 135.293 is an equipment check that is done every 12 months, it must be done in the specific airplane if a type is required. The 135.297 is an instrument check., cnan be done in any 135 airplane.

 

[ultrarunner]

I understand that reg, my question is: Is there another reg somewhere that addresses new equipment or an initial training stipulation.

No. Nor for a line-check. But your training manual may differ, but I doubt it.

In other words, can this guy go fly as a captain, on an airplane he has never set foot in solely on the fact that he has a current line check in another aircraft?..

Yes, provided it's operated under the same part, i.e 135, as someone pointed out earlier.

 

[CLECA]

Ok, thanks guys!

 

[CelticCitation]

299 doesn't address it, but there are certain families of aircraft that a 293 can cover. For example, a 293 check given in a C172 covers a whole list of other Cessna singles, such as the 210, 182, etc. There needs to be differences training, but it should all be spelled out in your training manual. The same is true with some Lears, Citations, and so forth, but a 293 in a Lear is not good for a Citation. A 293 in a LR35 with differences is also good in a LR31.

 

[pilotyip]

135.297

299 doesn't address it, but there are certain families of aircraft that a 293 can cover. For example, a 293 check given in a C172 covers a whole list of other Cessna singles, such as the 210, 182, etc. There needs to be differences training, but it should all be spelled out in your training manual. The same is true with some Lears, Citations, and so forth, but a 293 in a Lear is not good for a Citation. A 293 in a LR35 with differences is also good in a LR31.

but a 135.293 in a CE-550 is good for a 135.297 in a Lear jet

 

[CelticCitation]

A 293 is only good for that type. So a 293 in a Citation is not good in a Lear. A 297 and a 299 in a Citation would be good for a Lear, assuming that the captain has a current 293 in the Lear.

293- annual equipment check, type specific.

297- 6 month instrument currency check, can be done in any type the pilot is current in, although some POIs will want some kind of alternating schedule.

299- Route check. This is a holdover from scheduled ops, and only needs to be between two airports typical of the operator's destinations. Can be two airports 5 miles apart.

All three must be done for a pilot to act as PIC under IFR under Part 135. No 297 needed for VFR Ops. This is just a sample of all the training that will be required by the individual operators training manual. There are a myriad of other things that may be required, such as Hazmat, international ops, RVSM, and so on.

 

[CLECA]

Ok, here's another question. If a pilot took his 293 in a LJ in JAN, he obviously must take another 293 in by JAN or FEB with grace. What if he does a type ride including a 293/297 in SEP in the CE-550, does he still need to take a 293 by JAN to remain SIC current in the LJ?

 

[pilotyip]

yes

Ok, here's another question. If a pilot took his 293 in a LJ in JAN, he obviously must take another 293 in by JAN or FEB with grace. What if he does a type ride including a 293/297 in SEP in the CE-550, does he still need to take a 293 by JAN to remain SIC current in the LJ?

as per above you need a 293 in ever type you fly every 12 months plus grace.

 

[Flex-ible]

I understand that reg, my question is: Is there another reg somwhere that addresses new equipment or an initial training stipulation.

In other words, can this guy go fly as a captain, on an airplane he has never set foot in solely on the fact that he has a current line check in another aircraft? I should also mention we have an approved program for OE, and I have taken that into consideration. Thanks again.

He must have a .293 check in the specific plane, unless it is close enough that the FAA permits differences training.

 

[Flex-ible]

Ok, here's another question. If a pilot took his 293 in a LJ in JAN, he obviously must take another 293 in by JAN or FEB with grace. What if he does a type ride including a 293/297 in SEP in the CE-550, does he still need to take a 293 by JAN to remain SIC current in the LJ?

Yes. .293 good for that type for 12 months. An intervening 293 in a different plane is irrelevant.

 

[CLECA]

Thanks guys