Prospective Rest

[buckeyes95]

19, Do all aviation professionals a favor and get out. We do not need your type further reducing our QOL. Go take a job at Wal Mart, KFC, or any other non union employer. Have fun with it, enjoy your life.

 

[B19 Flyer]

19, Do all aviation professionals a favor and get out. We do not need your type further reducing our QOL. Go take a job at Wal Mart, KFC, or any other non union employer. Have fun with it, enjoy your life.

What type is that?

Non-union with a great quality of life?

 

[B19 Flyer]

Ya looks like 19 is missing a few important bits of information.

I was missing the information, and I did agree that it wasn't right.

I do not agree that it takes paying union dues to ensure compliance in today's world. I've witnessed far more pain and anguish from unions that I have prosperity. From my personal experience I would always recommend doing your homework and flying for a well run non-union carrier than any union carrier.

 

[GerryG]

I was missing the information, and I did agree that it wasn't right.

I do not agree that it takes paying union dues to ensure compliance in today's world. I've witnessed far more pain and anguish from unions that I have prosperity. From my personal experience I would always recommend doing your homework and flying for a well run non-union carrier than any union carrier.

Just curious 19, have you ever worked for a large Non-Union flight operation?

 

[DO-82 driver]

BE19...... Based on your list of a/c flown, I wonder what you have truely witness. It doesn't sound like your commercial flying carreer is very extensive.

Back in the day you would have been called a "commuter pilot"

 

[B19 Flyer]

Just curious 19, have you ever worked for a large Non-Union flight operation?

OK, all joking is now aside. Without going into details, my specific resume isn't as important as my experience is. The fact is, that I've worked for 91K, 135, and 121, union and non-union but was done flying before I went into the union carrier so I've never paid a penny in dues. I've witnessed lives, families and careers be destroyed by what unions considered important. While the union "fought" for "QOL" issues, those support people of which I am now one of them have been (for lack of a better term) "sacrificed."

I'm currently with a well run non-union carrier flying large iron, and without question see positive things that could never happen in a union enviorment. With that stated, I (regretfully) responded to this thread with factual information. Then it turned into support for a union, which I can't do.

Unions had their time and place. A properly run air carrier will not have issues as what began this thread, thus my advice, do your homework and choose non-union if you have the opportunity.

You can think that your union will speak for you all you want. I personally know pilots and airline folks that have gone through suicides, divorces and bankruptcies because of work actions that supported the upper echelon of the seniority list and not the bottom with little to nothing gained once it was over.

So with that said, I support a well run non-union airline environment, don't feel that airline unions are helpful to any carrier. There is something to be said for being on both sides of the fence. I've said this before.. take the most staunch union supporter and make him a Chief Pilot, then see how long his union speaks for him...and he for his union.

All pilots have the choice of where to work, it took me a couple carriers before I found a home. All I 'm saying is choose wisely...there is something to be said for age and experience...

 

[CA1900]

While the union "fought" for "QOL" issues...

You mean like proper rest, less-than-16-hour workdays, decent hotels not by the interstate, adequate food -- those kinds of so-called "QOL" issues that you dismiss so easily?

I'm currently with a well run non-union carrier flying large iron, and without question see positive things that could never happen in a union enviorment.

I came from a non-union carrier that has adjusted the bulk of its payscale by twenty cents an hour in seventeen years. So I have some experience that tells that not all employers will do the right thing given the chance.

Unions had their time and place.

In aviation, they still do.

A properly run air carrier will not have issues as what began this thread, thus my advice, do your homework and choose non-union if you have the opportunity.

So companies like Southwest and NetJets must be poorly-run organizations because they're heavily unionized?

All pilots have the choice of where to work, it took me a couple carriers before I found a home.

I agree. I came to my current company specifically because of the pay, benefits, and most of all work rules that the union was able to negotiate. It's because of my union that I won't get a phone call at 3:00 AM telling me, "You were off duty starting at 5pm, so your 10 hours is up and we need you right away." It's because of that union that overall pay went up significantly. There are a dozen other things I could name off that are directly contributing to a better quality of life for me, and a more productive, motivated, and safer pilot group for the company.

A union is as effective and productive as the people involved in it. If the employee group is apathetic and uninvolved, then the union will be largely ineffective. On the other hand, if you have an employee group that is involved, and that sees things long-term for both the company and the employees, it's better for both sides.

If you're working at a place where the employees are all treated well and compensated adequately without a union, that's good for you. I've been at a place that used to be like that, and it can disappear in the blink of an eye. At my last company, that's exactly what happened, and we were powerless to stop it because we had no contract in place.

In short, not all union shops are bad, and not all non-union shops are good. You'll see rotten apples on both sides of the fence.

 

[Fozzy]

.fud.

 

[jonjuan]

.fud.

Must be what all the 1st year F/Os who quit NJA put on their exit interview form when they learn the reality of upgrades and the HBA.

 

[CA1900]

I'm a first year F/O at NJA. I was not misinformed about the domicile situation in the slightest, and was told to expect 3-5 years to upgrade, which looks accurate so far.