Pinnacle vs. Mesaba

[redflyer65]

Going somewhere for a "flow-up, back" program is foolish at best. When you enter the bottom of the seniority list, what good is it really going to do you? Those captains ahead of you will actually have better luck going to other airlines than NWA. And who does a flowback help after a possible terrorist attack? Not you.

Do you guys really think those snap backs will ever be inacted? Look at how it's written. Look who makes the decisions on when the snap back is supposed to happen.

You have a better shot that Colgan will operate those Saabs before the snap back happens. The odds are not in your favor.

 

[norskman2]

Going somewhere for a "flow-up, back" program is foolish at best. When you enter the bottom of the seniority list, what good is it really going to do you? Those captains ahead of you will actually have better luck going to other airlines than NWA. And who does a flowback help after a possible terrorist attack? Not you.

Historically, very few regional pilots have ever benefited from a flowthrough. Maybe this'll be the exception.

On the other hand, the airline industry is notoriously cyclical, and the FLOWBACK provisions have absolutely killed movement at many a regional. Look at what happened at CAL, AMR and USAirways.

Take your chances, but remember flowthrough/flowback is a double-edged sword, and payback is a bitch.

 

[DoinTime]

The rapid growth at Mesaba will cause full snapbacks to occur in the near future. Factor in the Saab pilots and Mesaba pilots have abover average pay rates. Also, you have to factor in how work rules affect pay. Mesaba has a 4 hour minday, full cancelation pay, block/better, premium pay and other language that enhances a pilots monthly credit. My buddies at SWA and Continental keep telling me how much they miss the Mesaba work rules and I have heard that often from them.

With all due respect even with full snapbacks in 2010 and 2011 Mesaba will be the worst paid small turbojet operator by the end of your contract. Most of the carriers that comprise the "average" have the same, similar, or better work rules than XJ.

If NWA hires in 2008, 60 Mesaba pilots stand to flow up.

In order for 60 to flow up NWA would have to hire 600 in 2008. That is doubtful with the proposed fleet cutbacks. Another thing that has yet to be fleshed out with the flow rules is if someone who bypassses flow up still occupies a flow up position. This was the way it was at eagle I believe. You might get 60 vacancies to flow up at XJ but if the top 60 do not take them nobody goes up.

 

[XJohXJ]

Flow backs to Mesaba can not exceed the number of flow ups. Zero flow ups means zero flow downs.

Yes, of course many of us have read the contract language. There is no ambiguity in the snap back provisions. A certain amount of aircraft on a certain date equals a certain percentage of snap backs.

Yes the SF3's will eventually go away. Probably not for at least 5 years, which is plenty of time for full snap backs.

The corporate street thugs are just as bad at Mesaba as they are anywhere else. However, Mesaba just plain doesn't suck right now. Get over it.

 

[FlyHigher]

What is a snap back?

 

[SEVEN]

I'm a low-time military reserve guy looking to get on with either Pinnacle or Mesaba out of DTW (live close by). I know PCL has the 3500 upgrade requirement, which means even with my part-time military flying, it will take me around 3 years to get there (currently at about 550). What are Mesaba's upgrade mins? I'm trying to look at the pros and cons of both. This is what I've figured out so far from reading the posts on FI:

Pinnacle
Contract still not figured out
Pay sucks

Mesaba
Getting 200's and 900's
Contract (is it decent?)
Pay sucks, but not as bad as PCL

Thanks ahead of time for the input!

I was in your shoes a few years ago with plenty of pic turbine. I did a little research and went with Mesaba. QOL and work rules don't even compare when you put the two side by side. Mesaba is a far better company to work for from the time you begin training and on. Good luck with your decision.

 

[JMO]

What is a snap back?

Ditto

 

[JMO]

What is snapback?

Anyone....

Beuler...Beuler...

What is snapback?

 

[PCL_128]

"Snapback" is a provision in the concessionary bankruptcy contract that automatically jacks the payrates back up when a certain number of airplanes are on the property.

 

[Tank Commander]

It's when your shirt gets tucked into your underwear...