Pinnacle, Mesaba, Colgan SLI

[Monster Buck]

I get the impression that many at Delta forget where they came from

I first commented on your post but I changed it. The first one was strongly in opposition to what you said. But after thinking about it......deep sigh....you are right. Some. Not most though forget from time to time. Although some may wrongly disagree for their own reasons, I will never and have never forgotten were I came from....which includes all the way back to the son of immigrant truck driver and a maid. You are right brother.....some forget, I will not. Paid my dues and will fight to raise the bar for all those behind me. The day I got hired at Delta I was given a large written copy of the contract I was to benefit from. I did not fight for those rights. Decades of pilots before me did. It is now my turn to fight for the ones that follow and not gut it for my own benefit. Good luck to you.

 

[CptMurf]

Damn good thing everyone doesn't think this way. Shooting for third? Constantly lowering the bar that someone else raised for you.

After reading your post about 20 times to figured out how it was "spot on", I think I got it. "Shooting for third" is due to the fact that I dealt with (1) negotiations and contract '04, (2) BK concessionary contract, and (3) TA negotiations. And I am shooting for the third contract, with the exact same rates as the first, to finally be honored. And that extending an initial 5 year contract into 12 is constantly lowering a bar that someone else has raised for me. But due to their own problems, they lowered their contracts to less than what the TA offers.

If that is what you meant, then I agree. If not, than I stand by my initial quote.

In your last point, I agree, the timeline is due to mgmt wanting it done. But they wanted it done before moving aircraft, which would have triggered contract provisions which would have drug the entire Corp into labor problems. No one doubts mgmt wanted it done quickly, but the pilots needed it done just as quickly. Time was not on our side like during section 6 or BK negotiations.

 

[Ridgeback]

after the SAAB retirement and the CRJ-200s begin their flights to the desert and are replaced with more 900s and/or Q-400s/Q-400Xs.

Regards,

ex-Navy Rotorhead

I love these guys...PLEASE EXPLAIN to how we are getting any more 900's. They are SCOPED out period....NO mainline pilot is going to give up scope an inch further...

 

[MACH-TUCK]

I love these guys...PLEASE EXPLAIN to how we are getting any more 900's. They are SCOPED out period....NO mainline pilot is going to give up scope an inch further...

I had a Delta wide body captain in my jumpseat today tell me he would gladly give up scope for a raise.

 

[PeanuckleCRJ]

I had a Delta wide body captain in my jumpseat today tell me he would gladly give up scope for a raise.

I would as well. Scope is neither here nor there, but money is where it's at.

You can have the "9." Mgmt can make more money off of those than the 50's and they'll pass the money along to us.

 

[GRAAB HIRBOUBI]

I love these guys...PLEASE EXPLAIN to how we are getting any more 900's. They are SCOPED out period....NO mainline pilot is going to give up scope an inch further...

After catching my breath and the palpitations stopped from the announcement that Pinnacle bought us I realized that there is a possibility of even more expansion than just the Q's. You are right the Delta 900's are at max scope. But there are other airlines out there besides Delta. Then there is the whole thing about Air Service Agreements coming up for renegotiation so it is possible we could get some significant growth. I believe the Q fleet is going to be much larger than predicted especially when the fuel costs go up over the summer.

I am not so sure the SAAB is as dead as people say but time will tell. So I am guardedly optimistic.

I must have gone to the wrong road show. While the first year contract doesn't have us making much headway compared to other company's but I seem to remember that by year 3 or 5 each we were highest in the industry. Of course it does little to make you happy about being highest paid when you need food stamps but that's all been discussed before. Now other company's saying what they would get or what they would take is pure speculation. This is what we have right now. There are some pluses and minus's on both sides. Colgan makes enormous gains. Pinnacle and Mesaba will never recover from the 6 years or the bankruptcy but there are improvements.

Not the greatest, certainly not the worst contract. If you feel strongly vote 'No'. I support that as much as I support a 'Yes'. Only wasted vote is the one not made.

 

[Smarta$$]

I had a Delta wide body captain in my jumpseat today tell me he would gladly give up scope for a raise.

Disgusting. Nothing less. Seems almost every senior pilot anywhere could give a Sh!t about anyone but themselves.

 

[Smarta$$]

I would as well. Scope is neither here nor there, but money is where it's at.

You can have the "9." Mgmt can make more money off of those than the 50's and they'll pass the money along to us.

Is this a joke? This profession is more gone than I thought.

 

[Flyprdu]

I had a Delta wide body captain in my jumpseat today tell me he would gladly give up scope for a raise.

Remember his name. Tell others. And be sure to tell him and anyone else who thinks they can pull up the ladder after climbing it that they better get used to walking to work.

 

[gojo]

I first commented on your post but I changed it. The first one was strongly in opposition to what you said. But after thinking about it......deep sigh....you are right. Some. Not most though forget from time to time. Although some may wrongly disagree for their own reasons, I will never and have never forgotten were I came from....which includes all the way back to the son of immigrant truck driver and a maid. You are right brother.....some forget, I will not. Paid my dues and will fight to raise the bar for all those behind me. The day I got hired at Delta I was given a large written copy of the contract I was to benefit from. I did not fight for those rights. Decades of pilots before me did. It is now my turn to fight for the ones that follow and not gut it for my own benefit. Good luck to you.

Classy response, and please accept my apology. I shouldn't gereralize. I realize that every company has them. Good luck to you also

 

[Ridgeback]

More 900's?

Delta= NO max limit reached
NWA=Just incase you have lived under a rock...see above
United/CO= NO WAY...CO pilots aim to keep the 50 seat scope and dump the current large RJ's over time
American= only took ten years to get eagle 24 more
US Air=Who can work cheaper than the new out of bankruptcy MESA
SWA= No RJ's...ever

So tell me again where is the 900 growth at?

 

[suupah]

$0.40, you are doing good, I get 0 raise and worse reserve rules... Plus I will be displaced out of my position and thanks to the integration will NEVER get a chance to get back on the plane, at least as captain. I am still waiting to see how this merger was at all good for us.

*oops quoted wrong post. I was responding to the argument that because 9l pilots are getting substantial raises, it should be considered a windfall by an arbitrator when formulating an sli solution.

The problem I have with this argument is that a contract is not necessarily permanent. It should not be considered when weighing gains in an sli.
Bidding power for days off, schedules, vacations etc should be the focus.

Also consider that the Q rates that we are getting a raise for are now going to be flown at those rates by current xj and 9e pilots whereas they would have been flown at the current crappy rates otherwise. So in that sense it is a raise for everybody.

 

[Raskal]

More 900's?

Delta= NO max limit reached...

So tell me again where is the 900 growth at?

Well, apparently Delta isn't on the same page...say hello to 8 additional E-170's from Shuttle America. Guess the growth is at DAL regionals.

 

[PeanuckleCRJ]

Well, apparently Delta isn't on the same page...say hello to 8 additional E-170's from Shuttle America. Guess the growth is at DAL regionals.

Those are 70 seaters... That leaves about 10 left until the 51-70 seat jets are maxed out.

 

[Ridgeback]

Well, apparently Delta isn't on the same page...say hello to 8 additional E-170's from Shuttle America. Guess the growth is at DAL regionals.

Please read my whole post is says 900's

 

[Raskal]

Please read my whole post is says 900's

Sorry, I got that. I thought an e170 was a 76 seat plane, I'm not so good at the airplane geek thing.

 

[Monster Buck]

More 900's?

Delta= NO max limit reached
NWA=Just incase you have lived under a rock...see above
United/CO= NO WAY...CO pilots aim to keep the 50 seat scope and dump the current large RJ's over time
American= only took ten years to get eagle 24 more
US Air=Who can work cheaper than the new out of bankruptcy MESA
SWA= No RJ's...ever

So tell me again where is the 900 growth at?

70 more at Delta, although 200 less 50's