Pinnacle contract

[deceptibum]

Can the person who sets up the website with all those airline contracts put the Pinnacle one on there if possible? Or anyone else with the ability to post a Pinnacle contract somewhere online.

Thanks!

 

[othello]

It Suck's
19$ hr first year
No Pay until you pass your ceckride
No Medical or Benifits until either 60 or 90 days after you pass your checkride ( I cant remember )
No company ID until after you pass your Ride = you can't even jumpseat home on free weekends during training.
No Hotel during training your on your own.

How Long is trainning? 2 months if your lucky 4 is more realistic and 6 is not unheard of. That is a long time with no pay.

I just jumpseated with a guy that has been there just over a year and the only good thing he had to say is that they do fly very nice planes. But there contract is garbage.

Its about as close to Pay For Training as your gonna find.

They currently are obligated to hire low time Guys from some $$$ academy (gulf stream?) as well as mainline NorthWest furloughs.

 

[JJJ]

Are there any specifics that you want to know about the contract?

 

[DTWFO]

I have never heard of anyone spending 6 months in training or even 4 months. I don't know where you got that from, but it is totally false. 2 months is correct.

 

[B190Captain]

I have never heard of anyone spending 6 months in training or even 4 months. I don't know where you got that from, but it is totally false. 2 months is correct.

Still, two months too long with no income and $19/hr when you do pass your checkride. HORRIBLE!!

NWA furloughs would make more money collecting unemployment.

 

[JJJ]

Pinnacle first year pay is not $19/hr. It's now up to a whopping $20.13/hr. I know it sucks, but you're going to get hosed at most airlines the first year.

 

[B190Captain]

Pinnacle first year pay is not $19/hr. It's now up to a whopping $20.13/hr. I know it sucks, but you're going to get hosed at most airlines the first year.

Not hosed that much!

 

[B190Captain]

Pinnacle first year pay is not $19/hr. It's now up to a whopping $20.13/hr. I know it sucks, but you're going to get hosed at most airlines the first year.

Most regionals yes but nationals and majors the hit would be minimal.

 

[DoinTime]

Most regionals yes but nationals and majors the hit would be minimal.

I don't believe that anyone was saying that Pinnacle was a national or major airline. Starting salary is on par with more than half of the regional airlines operating.

Its always fun to listen to Othello expound on the quality of our contract. Considering most of the pilots at Pinnacle haven't read our contract I doubt he has ever even seen a copy of one. I'm sure he's just a disgruntled Mesaba Saab FO venting though. I forgive you.

 

[bigboy]

I don't believe that anyone was saying that Pinnacle was a national or major airline. Starting salary is on par with more than half of the regional airlines operating.

Its always fun to listen to Othello expound on the quality of our contract. Considering most of the pilots at Pinnacle haven't read our contract I doubt he has ever even seen a copy of one. I'm sure he's just a disgruntled Mesaba Saab FO venting though. I forgive you.

Othello is correct about most of what he said.
and for your info Doin Time, this Saab FO make more money than your CRJ 's FO and thats under our old contract.

fly safe.

 

[dondk]

So... How MANY regional with BETTER starting pay are still hiring? Not too many...

How many regionals with BETTER starting pay did take concessions?

It is a regioinal, if you think you are going to get paid the money Air Wisky or ASA, Comair or whoever.. then go to them...

As I understand the competive min's are 2-3x's more than our competive min's

As for the 6 months... that was in mid '01 and usually for the street Captains. It actually was not 6 months, but more than 4 months. Training was doing two classes a month in each equipment and over saturated the department

As for a good contract.. well it is/was as good as it was when signed in 1999... Not as good as ANYTHING signed after 1999 (except Mesa's)...

 

[JJJ]

I find it amusing that some Mesaba pilots talk about how bad our FO pay is, yet during their informational picketing they have signs that say "I make $17,000 a year" Based on a 75 hour month that works out to be $18.89 per hour.

Pinnacle first year FO pay is $20.13/hr or $18,117 based on the 75 hour guarantee.

What is Mesaba's pay for a second year FO?

I'm assuming that with the furloughs at Mesaba, the most junior pilot there is on second year pay. This means one of two things. Either their FO pay is worse than ours, or they are walking around with signs that have flase and misleading information on them. I find it hard to believe that a second year FO makes only 17K.

Don't get me wrong, I hope Mesaba gets a good contract, and gets it soon.

 

[DoinTime]

Othello is correct about most of what he said.
and for your info Doin Time, this Saab FO make more money than your CRJ 's FO and thats under our old contract.

Let me see there Big Boy.....I'm looking in your contract and according to this your current FO rates are as follows

0-.5 = $18.21
.6-1 = 20.35
1-2 = 24.40
2-3 = 26.79
3-4 = 29.18
4+ = 30.05

Now lets look at current Pinnacle rates:

0-1= 20.13
1-2 = 23.68
2-3 = 29.21
3-4 = 32.31
4-5 = 33.31

Over the first two years its a wash. Our first year rate exceeds your rates for the first year but yours exceed ours in the second year. I think you can see whos exceeds whos from there out. Don't forget your AVRO FO's make these same pittiful wages.

If you are not furloughed I would suspect that you are close to or above the 2-3 year rate. Which would put you 9% behind the Pinnacle FO rate for the same longevity.

Our contract is over four year old as well.....nobody said it was a peach.

 

[othello]

Dointime, No I have never read your contract, someone asked a question and I answered it you let me know which of my statements was false and I will be happy to retract it.
your fellow pilot DONDK says that in mid 01 trainning did take between 4 and 6 month. The last few classes have made it through in around 2 month that is also included as a possibailty in my post. I just print what I here your pilots tell me is going on.

And the facts are that for a new hire pilot your contract SUCKS.
yes I do work for Mesaba and our old 1996 contract we still get paid from day 1 company ID with in the first few hours of the first day. medical dental and all other benifits day one. plus a single room hotel 100% payed from day one.

Big Boy good to see you fighting the good fight. peace brother

 

[JJJ]

Also don't forget that at Pinnacle, if you've got 2.5 - 3 years, or if you came here at the right time, less than 2 years, you can be a CA.

So at Mesaba you can be a third year FO at $29.18 or a CA at Pinnacle at $58.55.

I'm glad I came to Pinnacle.

 

[ForgedBlade]

I have to add - the contract is lousy - and a typical generic regional contract that sprang up with the magic promise of all the shiny new jets.

I was a new-hire Captain and training took almost three months in mid-'01 - it was a joke. I have since moved on - thankfully - and can say that for the two years I worked there, I was never treated so lousy by a company.

 

[pimpinthesky]

I love reading these posts because it is just comedy. Listening to uninformed people bitch about companies they don't even work for. Why don't you all just stick to bitching about your own pitiful contracts.

Ooppps, sorry, I forgot Pinnacle is the ONLY airline out there that has an outdated contract.

Please.......get informed

 

[othello]

Pimpin

The thing is that these garbage contracts and consessions and this no pay no hotel crap, all gets gets thrown in our face by our managment in there speaches and in our com2. the company's monthly publication.
while we are fighting for a good contract with fair wages that we can support our kids with for the next 5+ years until the majors turn around. Every time some other regional agrees to less that is lowering the bar in the industry. And while we are picketing and doing our best to get a better life for regional FO's. It hurts our stand when Mangment can sit back and say well XP airlinepilots agreed to this and this so that is what we are compeating with.

 

[JJJ]

All of these mgmt tactics are to be expected during contract talks. The company will put out memo's to the other employee groups telling them of the dire circumstances of XX airline, and if the pilots get what they want, we'll all be out of a job. Divide and conquor (sp) is the game they like to play.

In the unlikely event that your MEC agrees to have the same FO pay and no hotel for training on the TA, the only thing you have to do is VOTE NO.

 

[pimpinthesky]

Orthello

Obviously your management has effectivly erroded commorodery within your company by pitting us against you. In all, realize that pinnacle pilots completly support Mesaba pilots come negotiating time as obviously this will have a direct effect upon the future of our next contract. Remember the last info picket, we stood alongside the mesaba boys/girls to. So in the future don't vent your anger towards us-----

 

[GCD]

There's another thread here that the new DO has already been canned. Does anyone know if it is true?

 

[deceptibum]

thanks to those that emailed me the contract. I have heard stories that 95 were the only confirmed orders for Pinnacle. But i've also heard that it is now 103 confirmed orders. Any insight? BTW, from the latest seniority list, how many pilots and planes are there now? Thanks

 

[justmeinmsp]

I think it's in the neighborhood of 660 pilots and 63 aircraft at present. I have still only heard we are confirmed for 95. But I could be wrong as usual.

 

[DTWFO]

I think it is still 95, but I heard a rumor not too long ago from a guy that was up at Bombardier getting a new plane that NWA had informed them it was going to extend it to 120. Obviously this is just a rumor, but coming from Bombardier.....who knows. I love spreading rumors though

 

[deceptibum]

I interviewed there and the recruiting dept had said the same thing. (About the possibility of 120 jets). Stephanie had said that the airline would know by the end of this year what will happen to the extra jets.

 

[deceptibum]

The desired 1200-1300 pilots the company and union claim to be on property would seem to jive more with 120 jets than an overstaffed 95. But who knows these days.

 

[dondk]

The "orginal" order for NWA is/was 129.
Looking at the delivery schedule, NWA is "scheduled" to take deliver of more than 95 by the end of '04 and there are additional deliveries scheduled for '05.

The last "rumor" that I heard out of MEM was mid 4th QTR this year there will be an announcement that we will be taking up to 50 more jet's to complete by '06.

This will dip into the options NWA has on the additional 175 above the hard 129 order.

I agree with everyone else, the 1200-1300 pilot number has been going around by the union and management now for about 2 years. Late last year it was confirmed that 1200-1300 is the target to be on the property by late '04.

Currently we are around 700 on the property or in some form of training. We will have about 70 jet's on the property by the end of June.

 

[hmmm]

Wish we had a crystal ball to predict wether all that will really happen and dictate our upgrades money and line attainable two or three years.