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Piedmont - Union says airline offered pilots 'free pass' on checkrides

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ualdriver

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http://www.buffalonews.com/2010/03/07/979524/piedmont-denies-deal-to-uncover.html

Interesting story. How much of it is true, if anything?


Piedmont denies 'deal' to uncover whistle-blowers

Union says airline offered pilots 'free pass' on tests

by Tom Precious
News Albany Bureau
Updated: March 07, 2010,


ALBANY — Piedmont Airlines has offered its pilots a "free pass" on required, annual safety training that tests their flying skills in return for providing names of fellow pilots who anonymously raised concerns to The Buffalo News in January about an airline safety device, its pilot union has charged.
 
He might have said it, but I highly doubt he meant it. He's a pretty emotional kind of guy and might have taken the original Buffalo article personally.

I've taken many checkrides with that guy running the sim. I wouldn't hesitate to put my wife and son on an airplane flown by a crew he signed off.

This particular check airman catches a lot of crap, but will go down in flames on your behalf if you are right. I watched him threaten to resign on the spot because of the way another pilot was being treated. He was dead serious about it too and that sort of action from him carries a bit of weight. He has personally flown the last leg of a trip for me so I could make an earlier commuting flight. Most important, I never came out of the sim when he was running it and NOT learned something valuable.
 
OPECJet said:
He might have said it, but I highly doubt he meant it. He's a pretty emotional kind of guy and might have taken the original Buffalo article personally.

I've taken many checkrides with that guy running the sim. I wouldn't hesitate to put my wife and son on an airplane flown by a crew he signed off.

This particular check airman catches a lot of crap, but will go down in flames on your behalf if you are right. I watched him threaten to resign on the spot because of the way another pilot was being treated. He was dead serious about it too and that sort of action from him carries a bit of weight. He has personally flown the last leg of a trip for me so I could make an earlier commuting flight. Most important, I never came out of the sim when he was running it and NOT learned something valuable.
Click to expand...

True True...
 
I can definitely see him taking any negative attacks on the training dept personally (like the Buffalo news story re: Piedmont not having stick pusher training), so I can see him being human and expressing how much he would like to get rid of pilots who insulted his first born son, the PDT training dept. But he is known to exaggerate a lot of things to get his point across, so something in this case was obviously different.

He's a tough instructor but I think he's fair and goes to bat for pilots all the time. I actually look forward to, and enjoy having CQ with him because I know I will learn way more than just the FAA minimum required.

I sure hope he doesn't get screwed.
 
A couple of times amongst friendly pilots as a joke is one thing. Doing it repeatedly to every pilot he saw in that period equals harassment in my book. Tongue-in-cheek or not. His mouth gets in the way of his job way too much...
 
OPECJet said:
He might have said it, but I highly doubt he meant it. He's a pretty emotional kind of guy and might have taken the original Buffalo article personally.

I've taken many checkrides with that guy running the sim. I wouldn't hesitate to put my wife and son on an airplane flown by a crew he signed off.

This particular check airman catches a lot of crap, but will go down in flames on your behalf if you are right. I watched him threaten to resign on the spot because of the way another pilot was being treated. He was dead serious about it too and that sort of action from him carries a bit of weight. He has personally flown the last leg of a trip for me so I could make an earlier commuting flight. Most important, I never came out of the sim when he was running it and NOT learned something valuable.
Click to expand...


The guy in question is a little emotional at times but I back everything Opecjet just said above.
 
OPECJet said:
He might have said it, but I highly doubt he meant it. He's a pretty emotional kind of guy and might have taken the original Buffalo article personally.

I've taken many checkrides with that guy running the sim. I wouldn't hesitate to put my wife and son on an airplane flown by a crew he signed off.

This particular check airman catches a lot of crap, but will go down in flames on your behalf if you are right. I watched him threaten to resign on the spot because of the way another pilot was being treated. He was dead serious about it too and that sort of action from him carries a bit of weight. He has personally flown the last leg of a trip for me so I could make an earlier commuting flight. Most important, I never came out of the sim when he was running it and NOT learned something valuable.
Click to expand...

I could not have said it better myself Dan. Very True.
 
OPECJet said:
He might have said it, but I highly doubt he meant it. He's a pretty emotional kind of guy and might have taken the original Buffalo article personally.

I've taken many checkrides with that guy running the sim. I wouldn't hesitate to put my wife and son on an airplane flown by a crew he signed off.

This particular check airman catches a lot of crap, but will go down in flames on your behalf if you are right. I watched him threaten to resign on the spot because of the way another pilot was being treated. He was dead serious about it too and that sort of action from him carries a bit of weight. He has personally flown the last leg of a trip for me so I could make an earlier commuting flight. Most important, I never came out of the sim when he was running it and NOT learned something valuable.
Click to expand...

I agree 100%. This guy would give you the shirt off his back if you needed it.
 
ah jon boy...yeah got a mouth the size of the grand canyon and behind all his little quirks he's a good guy that would do anything to help out a line pilot...
 
Concur with the sentiments above. He was one of the couple who I actually respected in the training department.
 
I am sure they know or have a good idea who is talking to the press. It should not be to hard to figure out. The first story I have no problem with. Hey, we do not have the training for the pusher, fact. Are we getting it, yes. So what is the big deal. This second story is just being childish. We all know that the instructor in question was just kidding about the "free ride". If you have ever done a sim session with him you would know there is no such thing as a free ride from him. I really think the union is making a big mistake. They are going after the best instructor at PDT in spite of a few CAs that were downgraded. And from what I have heard, they maybe should not even be FO's. But, I was not there.
 
I will second all the positive comments about JP stated above. Yes, he can be emotional. Yes, he likes to talk a lot. Yes, he wants to see continuous improvement in the quality of the pilot group. Can he be somewhat abrasive at times? Sure. But having been instructed by and flown the line with him for the past 10 years, I can say that there is not a single instructor more personally invested in each pilot's professional development than JP. He cares, and cares a lot.

I will say I don't agree with him on everything. JP is not a fan of our ASAP program, and I have always enjoyed our little debates on the subject. I will also say that, knowing JP's personality, I am sure he thought he was cracking a funny little joke to the crews he was interacting with. He just cracked it to the wrong hypersensitive pilot.

That brings us to the 800 pound gorilla in the room that need to be mentioned: This is less about JP than it is about this rediculous North vs South, refight the Civil War garbage. Every complaint I can remember about JP came post merger. Why is that?

Furthermore, these leaks are NOT helpful to us as a pilot group, contractually or otherwise. As a matter of fact, the first BUF news article made us look pretty dumb... We should turn the stick pushers off? Are you freaking serious?

If you want to use the press to help illuminate the issues, then fine, go to your union leadership and get Herndon invovled so the pros that we pay good money for can manage the message properly. Having armies of one running around and spouting off to the press distracts our leadership, shows that we have no control over our message and demonstrate a complete lack of pilot unity. These articles do way more harm than good in my opinion and is harmful to our efforts to negotiate a contract.
 
LowlyPropCapt said:
I will second all the positive comments about JP stated above. Yes, he can be emotional. Yes, he likes to talk a lot. Yes, he wants to see continuous improvement in the quality of the pilot group. Can he be somewhat abrasive at times? Sure. But having been instructed by and flown the line with him for the past 10 years, I can say that there is not a single instructor more personally invested in each pilot's professional development than JP. He cares, and cares a lot.

I will say I don't agree with him on everything. JP is not a fan of our ASAP program, and I have always enjoyed our little debates on the subject. I will also say that, knowing JP's personality, I am sure he thought he was cracking a funny little joke to the crews he was interacting with. He just cracked it to the wrong hypersensitive pilot.

That brings us to the 800 pound gorilla in the room that need to be mentioned: This is less about JP than it is about this rediculous North vs South, refight the Civil War garbage. Every complaint I can remember about JP came post merger. Why is that?

Furthermore, these leaks are NOT helpful to us as a pilot group, contractually or otherwise. As a matter of fact, the first BUF news article made us look pretty dumb... We should turn the stick pushers off? Are you freaking serious?

If you want to use the press to help illuminate the issues, then fine, go to your union leadership and get Herndon invovled so the pros that we pay good money for can manage the message properly. Having armies of one running around and spouting off to the press distracts our leadership, shows that we have no control over our message and demonstrate a complete lack of pilot unity. These articles do way more harm than good in my opinion and is harmful to our efforts to negotiate a contract.
Click to expand...


I agree with the above too. There are much better ways to handle the whole thing than crying wolf...
The little boy that is crying wolf to the press is going to get his a$$ beat by the PDT pilots too, not just by the check airmen. The whole thing does tend to make the place look second class.
 
LearLove said:
the stick pusher are only on the 300 and Q400, not the 100/200, right??
Click to expand...

It's been a while since i flew a 200 but i believe that is in fact true.
 
no1pilot2000 said:
It seems like Piedmont Pilots are a close knit group of people.
Click to expand...

The only thing I miss about not being there anymore are the people.
Awesome group of guys & gals! Management doesn't know how good they Fu(kin have it............
 
I finished up with her and sent her his way.:D
 
Captzaahlie said:
I agree with the above too. There are much better ways to handle the whole thing than crying wolf...
The little boy that is crying wolf to the press is going to get his a$$ beat by the PDT pilots too, not just by the check airmen. The whole thing does tend to make the place look second class.
Click to expand...

I agree, but what does this say about your MEC putting this out in the news themselves? They're the ones looking like the whiny cry babies.
Boo Hoo Hoo! We don't have all the facts yet, but we're going to take this story to the press!
Give me a break!
I'm glad to hear you guys respect this DE, he sounds like one of the few stand up guys in the industry. Hope he's around a bit longer.
 
WayBack said:
I agree, but what does this say about your MEC putting this out in the news themselves? They're the ones looking like the whiny cry babies.
Boo Hoo Hoo! We don't have all the facts yet, but we're going to take this story to the press!
Give me a break!
I'm glad to hear you guys respect this DE, he sounds like one of the few stand up guys in the industry. Hope he's around a bit longer.
Click to expand...

The MEC didn't go to the news on this. They only reacted to the news once it was out of the bag.
 
LowlyPropCapt said:
The MEC didn't go to the news on this. They only reacted to the news once it was out of the bag.
Click to expand...

There are certain MEC members and pilots behind the scenes who live to throw mud in management's eye. With that letter, those pilots and MEC members have let their mouth overload their asses. You can't expect to gain a new contract, enjoy any additional quality of life outside the current contract (make no mistake about it, mgmt CAN make your lives miserable inside the context of that contract) or expect Tempe to want to put any additional flying on PDT.

The letter in question is supposed to have been confidential within the MEC, but yet was leaked to the media. Someone within the MEC leaked it. Until you guys take care of that leak, and in turn do some serious house cleaning on the MEC you can expect a very bumpy ride. In my opinion, you've earned that bumpy ride by not participating in your pilot leadership and have allowed self-serving, egotistical people get away with whatever they want.

Lord knows I had plenty of issues with PDT management when I was there, but I understood a mutual respect of both parties to acheive the same goal existed. When all was said and done, the MEC and members of management understood we were on the same team but had different ideas on how to run the plays.

What's going on now is tearing up a lot hard work that other people did. Pretty damn hard to watch from the sidelines, but it's like that bad wreck on the interstate. You just can't NOT stop and gawk. Rant off, man I'm glad I don't have to participte in that crap anymore!
 
Current book or less in contract talks does not sound like "mutual respect" to me.

J.S. giving us a "good product" and "the best he can" with schedules is a disrespect too.

Refusing to give us crewtrack and proper payroll software is damn near criminal.

Half the answers on Ask Piedmont are dismissive at best.

All the previous hard work of others was in shambles before this little diddy hit the papers. Our training department has a bad reputation. Our relationship with the Feds is shady in the eyes of many pilots. A lot of this is undeserved and/or paranoia. However, when our chief check airman pulls a mickey mouse stunt like that and think it's appropriate behavior for a man of his position, it makes me pause just a little... It makes me wonder if the BS CQ rides and insane things JP attempts to "teach" are worth overlooking anymore. Mind you, the guy does have heart and works way too hard for this outfit...

The allegations are 100% true. Not commenting on his motive or that of the leak and where it originated, for that is not the point. The point is, things have to change. Change beyond a shake up in the MEC for f*** sakes.
 
All I'm saying is look at how things got where they are. There is one single event that happened in '06 or early '07 (I think) that started the labor / management relations slide. The company has always taken liberties with the contract but you always knew you could work with them. Most of the issues you state were worked out before things went in the toilet.

I'll grant you that all of them should have been done without asking. Unfortunately that's not how things work there.

Not my place anymore to try and get in the middle of it. Hope you guys can get this crap straightened out.
 
WayBack said:
Says the MEC.
Click to expand...

True.

We will never know who really did it, since he (or she or they) will never have the stones to own up to it. I have my own suspicions, but I can't substantiate any of them so I will keep them to myself.
 

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