Pay for training

[Skyline]

Goose !!

Family life? That's debateable. As for health insurance, that can be found in many non-airline flying jobs, including my current instructing job. As for a "good" living, I suppose it all depends on where your priorities lie. You couldn't live the life of luxury on the salary that I'll probably make, but the same could be said of 90% of all jobs flying or non.

-Goose

Well good luck to you. Most of what you said doesn't make any sense to me. I can't imagine what you have in mind to do as a career. It sounds more like a Kenyan school teacher for the peace corp. Pilots don't help people. Pilots are greedy selfish and immoral. We care about getting to the money and good life as fast as possible. You sound more like a missionary pilot. In any case nothing I have to say will be of benefit to you. Best of luck. I hope you get that Husky. I would like one too. Perhaps we could meet at a fly-in someday?

Skyline

Remember WWJD ?

 

[Metro752]

skyline is obviously new to posting on the internet because he uses punctuation and capital letters which is good i suppose but whats the point if you can read it who needs punctuation capital letters or evenspacesnobodydoes

Perhaps we should though?

 

[Goose Egg]

Most of what you said doesn't make any sense to me...Pilots are greedy selfish and immoral. We care about getting to the money and good life as fast as possible.

Yeah, you're all dirtbags. Congrats.

I can't imagine what you have in mind to do as a career.

I have been intentionally vauge, and that is becuase I have some definite goals in mind, but I'm still not quite sure how I am going to go about achieving them. When I have more information and a course of action, I will be more forthcoming.

It sounds more like a Kenyan school teacher for the peace corp... You sound more like a missionary pilot.

Guess again. For the zillionth time, I'm not going to be a bush pilot.

I hope you get that Husky.

Maybe I will, maybe I won't. Who knows. I'd really rather have my own glider anyway. I just thought the Husky thing was cool as an avatar.

-Goose

 

[Skyline]

I am sorry

I am sorry. I am kind of a dork I guess. My college letter writing class just will not leave me. I will try todobetter.


Skyline

 

[Skyline]

Kids these days

Man I just don't get you guys. I understand that since 9-11 everyone who has been in flight school since realizes that most will not make it to the big money. However there is no need to become monks. You guys are all braced to be living in boxes and almost feel ashamed to try and make a good life for your selves. There seems to be a prevailing sense of martyrship going around. It is no fun to be poor when you are in your 30's. You have to get out there in your 20's with a definite sense of purpose about getting that good airline job. By the time you start to wake up at 28 it is too late.

Skyline

 

[b757driver]

Interesting philosophies and arguments here. For what it's worth, I have NEVER paid for a type rating, training program or an aviation job and I have no regrets. Why? Because in this business there are NO GUARANTEES!! Wake up folks, have you heard how well the top 5 are doing? How the salaries are, not to mention the benefits? Oh and if that were not enough, how many are on the street, again. This is not rocket science but a FACT of life in the US airline/aviation industry. Expect it. There is NO such thing as a stable company with maybe the sole exception of SWA. But even they are not infallible.
My point is why bother to bankrupt yourself when there are no guarantees that you will even have a job in 6 months, 2 years or whatever? How are you going to pay off your loans then? Take risks by all means but even the most savvy investment analyst will want to do his homework carefully before making a decision.
The best story I can relate from personal experience is that once I had a number of ATPs(including some foreign/ICAO ones with a B737 rating on them) but not on my FAA ATP (long story for another time). Also had hard time on type. This did not open any doors, so I thought long and hard about buying a 737 type locally. I finally decided not to because I did not believe by doing so it would enhance my resume. Instead, I spent the money on all my FAA Instructors tickets and then found a job instructing (always have something to fall back onto preferably something you are good at and enjoy).
Years later the government bought me a 737 type through the WIA program when I was laid off by my then Part 121 employer. And I'm real glad I did not spend the money getting the type. It would have made NO DIFFERENCE in even getting an interview, never mind a job! It is so easy to get sucked up into this whirlwind of competition and must have this and must have that edge. I almost went with the herd but the little voice on my shoulder war right all along and I leave you with that thought: if it does not feel right, if you are unsure - even a little bit, and particularly if you don't have it in writing that they will DEFINITELY offer you a job on condition of getting a type or doing their PFT, then you are better off without it. Go do something else. You will feel a whole lot better, not to mention no hole burnt in your pocket.
If on the other hand, you KNOW it's going to work for you and you have the ready dough, then go for it. It's kind of like gambling. You got to know the strategy of the game and you have to have a money management strategy also. You put aside what you can comfortably afford to lose and hey, if you hit the jackpot, great but if you don't, you won't lose your shirt either. Try it in Vegas sometime!!

 

[Skyline]

Pft

b757driver,

My point exactly. All the people who I have known who by hook or by crook got into the left seat of something with turbine engines while they were still very young got on with UAL, UPS AA or other great jobs. They lied, cheated or bought their way in, but they are sitting there at good US companies senior enough to avoid furloughs. I took the hard road and will never be able to get it back. As I am sure you understand how crappy it is to be behind the power curve in this career. Like I have mentioned before I think that in the end we all pay. Some with wasted years of their lives and some with cash. Paying with cash is much much cheaper. I feel as though I paid highly at N7. If you recall they were trying to install a training contract of 50K but were stopped by the state of NV. If someone approached you with an offer of a position at your first choice airline and all you had to do was to pay 30K, would you do it? The opportunity to move home and to earn a good living at the job of your chioce? I would do it man !!! There is no room for an EGO or for high moral standards in this career.

Skyline

 

[BushwickBill]

Skyline,

Not sure if I follow you on the whole systems manager point. I watched a Skywest CRJ land with no flaps at bakersfield when I was delivering a new 182. I doubt those guys were on auto fly. I'm also confident that there was some serious decision making going on between the crew. I'm sure those guys were working pretty hard and if I had been a passenger I would have been praying there were no PFT types at the controls. I feel strongly that the decision making skills you earn through experience are what makes a good pilot, and you cant buy that. Personally I feel that PFT will result in serious problems for safety at some point.

 

[Skyline]

No Flaps

B Bill,

All that stuff is in the manual. There are no decisions to make. Just follow the directions and call MX cointrol if you have any questions. No problems. It is a proceedure that is practaced in the sim every few years. All of that stuff is automated and drilled in practice. The problems come when they don't follow the directions and something bad happens like pinnacle.


Skyline

 

[Snakum]

Pilots are greedy selfish and immoral

Well ... you got us there.

You guys are all braced to be living in boxes and almost feel ashamed to try and make a good life for your selves. There seems to be a prevailing sense of martyrship going around. It is no fun to be poor when you are in your 30's.

Now you've done it! You're actually making sense. We'll have none of that here, Mister. Please cease immediately.

Minh