Passengers in Jumpseat

[EntertheCentury]

Anyone know of any documentation prohibiting (FOM, FARs etc) passengers from riding in the jumpseat on a 91k/135 flight? Any documentation that states that only trained personnel are allowed?

 

[JokerFuel]

The FAR's don't specifically address jump seat eligibility. That's the loophole that allowes FAA personnel....ATC, facilities inspectors to ride in your jump seat. Any limitations will likely be addressed in your company Opspecs and FOM. For instance, flight attendants are prohibited from occupying the flight deck jump seat as they aren't properly trained in flight deck operations.

 

[say again]

It's usually in the company SOP's, if you have such a policy. Ours prohibits pax from sitting in jumpseat and the FAA signed off on it.

 

[rsm]

For fractionals it is normally placarded somewhere on or aroud the jump seat. "Crew Members Only" or atleast it is on the Challengers.

 

[gutshotdraw]

In my experience, the people that ask to ride on the jumpseat are usually nervous flyers that feel an additional bit of "control" by sitting there and it helps to alleviate some of the anxiety.

We also tend to put the FA on the jumpseat when it's a full boat in the back although I know some operators insist the FA be in the back and put a pax on the seat when seating capacity is an issue.

But there is no regulatory prohibition under 91/91K or 135.





Two of my best celebrity flights involved a musician and an actress riding the jumpseat for a couple of hours and chatting away amiably. Above 10,000 feet of course....

 

[2EASYPilot]

On our Falcons it is placarded and has been since delivery.

 

[EntertheCentury]

Thank you!

 

[pilotyip]

Passengers can ride the jump seat on cargo airplanes with no seating aft of the cockpit. They need to be per-screened by the FAA, and then given a standard passengers screening before boarding. They get a permit for an explicit flight or series of flights. We take them on our DC-9's and DA-20's every once in a while

 

[gunfyter]

I've been asked and not allowed it. I don't even want the Flight Attendant up there....

 

[gutshotdraw]

Why? Just because you're paranoid doesn't mean they're NOT out to get you....

 

[CA1900]

I've been asked and not allowed it. I don't even want the Flight Attendant up there....

I had a passenger, as we're climbing through ~10K on a long flight, ignore the seatbelt sign and come up to do something. All of a sudden in my ear, I hear him scream, "OH MY GOD WE'RE GOING TO RUN OUT GAS!!"

Somebody taught him to read the FMS in the Excel, and he saw the "0.0" at destination. Unfortunately, they didn't teach him enough to realize that its landing fuel is not accurate during climbout. That's just an example of the kind of thing I'd really not want happening close to the ground with passengers riding in the jumpseat.

 

[CRAWDADDY]

For instance, flight attendants are prohibited from occupying the flight deck jump seat as they aren't properly trained in flight deck operations.

If only that were true. Another reason not to bid a three crew a/c

 

[gutshotdraw]

If only that were true. Another reason not to bid a three crew a/c

I kind of like having an FA around most of the time. Too bad our good ones are quitting left and right.

 

[ProFracPilot]

No Passengers Allowed

Our FOM prohibits passengers from occupying the observer seat. And this is a great example of why.

We had to do a go-around at PDK last week due to "controller training in progress". The local controller calls us on a 4 mile final (we were less than 2) and clears a Hawker for takeoff. When we told the controller we were well inside 2 miles, he told the Hawker to hold short. The Hawker pilot either a) didn't understand the difference between the ILS hold short line and the runway hold short line, or b) lied when he said he was already on the runway AND tells the controller "they have to go around". I had already made that decision and was pushing the power up. The local controller let the trainee attempt to unravel the mess he created (a mistake, IMHO), which continued to snowball as we flew a visual pattern back to 20L. By the time we landed, there were 2 more go-arounds by other aircraft and we had an RA. Only 1 passenger even inquired as to why we went around. Had one been sitting up front it would have involved a lot more questions at the wrong time.

Yes, it is times like these I'm very happy to not have a passenger sitting on the flight deck.

 

[gutshotdraw]

Here's an interesting one for you folks from the 121 world.

Let's say an authorized jumpseater from the Agency that is "here to help you" shows up in your cockpit for a FAM ride. Problem is, the person has a FULL BEARD and might have a tough time getting the oxygen mask to seal in "the unlikely event" of a loss of cabin pressure. Technically, they are an additional crewmember with all the requirements of that status.

So, do you let them on your jumpseat?

Don't dismiss it too easily. My houseguest had this EXACT scenario in her major airline cockpit yesterday. It was a short turn and she and her Captain didn't really think about it until after the flight. There is nothing in their FOM about it. The Chief Pilot said "file an ASAP."

Interesting case, no?

 

[tomgoodman]

Here's an interesting one for you folks from the 121 world.

Let's say an authorized jumpseater from the Agency that is "here to help you" shows up in your cockpit for a FAM ride. Problem is, the person has a FULL BEARD and might have a tough time getting the oxygen mask to seal in "the unlikely event" of a loss of cabin pressure. Technically, they are an additional crewmember with all the requirements of that status.

So, do you let them on your jumpseat?

Have them don a mask and shut off the supply. If they start to turn blue, it's a good seal, and you issue them a SODA waiver.

 

[greed]

Have them don a mask and shut off the supply. If they start to turn blue, it's a good seal, and you issue them a SODA waiver.

I love it!

 

[G4dude]

I kind of like having an FA around most of the time. Too bad our good ones are quitting left and right.

Our FAs are terrific, almost without exception.

 

[G4dude]

Here's an interesting one for you folks from the 121 world.

Let's say an authorized jumpseater from the Agency that is "here to help you" shows up in your cockpit for a FAM ride. Problem is, the person has a FULL BEARD and might have a tough time getting the oxygen mask to seal in "the unlikely event" of a loss of cabin pressure. Technically, they are an additional crewmember with all the requirements of that status.

So, do you let them on your jumpseat?

Don't dismiss it too easily. My houseguest had this EXACT scenario in her major airline cockpit yesterday. It was a short turn and she and her Captain didn't really think about it until after the flight. There is nothing in their FOM about it. The Chief Pilot said "file an ASAP."

Interesting case, no?

Wow. That's all I can say. Wow. Never thought of this, and neither has the FAA. And they are all-knowing and all-seeing.

 

[ProFracPilot]

Our FAs are terrific, almost without exception.

Perhaps, but as a wise old Captain once told me regarding FA's: "They ALL have issues".

In my experience, he was right. :laugh: