Paperless Cockpits

[Bjetset2]

Does anyone know if two PORTABLE EFBs on the flight deck is acceptable for going without paper approach plates? I have read the FAA AC, but as usual I am getting two different answers from two different FDSOs. Part 91 Corporate Ops, US and Western EU. Thanks for any input.

 

[H.Agenda]

That was my understanding

But you'll have to find it in print to be sure. Is this your first time paperless?

I didnt care for the tablet PC version of jeps for approaches, it was a little smaller than the actual approach..

for enroute high and low they are great.

I switched back to paper, in a pinch I like old faithful. I was burned a couple times by a frozen computer/ computer glitch, etc when I really need them to work.

Those panel mounted collins look outstanding though.

 

[Capt1124]

My reading of the ACs is if you want to go without paper backups you have to have an STC'd mount for the EFB. I don't know if these are available yet although somebody at NavAero told me they werer working on it.

 

[Excel'n]

We've run part 91 that way for years. We never asked a FSDO. We never had a visit from them during that time, but on a recent 135 route check, no mention was made either way by the FED. Part 91, maybe you want to use them until they say you can't, then ask them to support that position?

 

[421Driver]

From someone at ADI in PTK, there are 3 levels of installations. To be certified, I believe it has to have a type III installation, which includes a STC'ed mount with a hard wired power supply. A non-STC'ed mount with hard-wired power is type II, and I can't remember what type I entailed.

It's been awhile since I spoke with them, but I bet they could answer some of your questions.

 

[Spooky 1]

But you'll have to find it in print to be sure. Is this your first time paperless?

I didnt care for the tablet PC version of jeps for approaches, it was a little smaller than the actual approach..

for enroute high and low they are great.

I switched back to paper, in a pinch I like old faithful. I was burned a couple times by a frozen computer/ computer glitch, etc when I really need them to work.

Those panel mounted collins look outstanding though.

Agree with H. Agenda for the most part. We (Part 91) are using a Fujitsu tablet for the JeppView material as well as each pilot has this same info on his personal laptop. Carry backup batteries for the Fujitsu and print all the known airports out on paper before we leave for the trip, Dest, Alts, ETP Alts, etc. Then if there is a change enroute do to the principal wanting a new destination, or an emergency we revert to the Fujitsu. Also carry a printer onboard that would allow for us to print charts if there was enough time. As far as the FAA is concerend, the fact that we are printing the charts before hand, and-or have the capability to do the same, they don't care about are application of this technology. We are just evaluating several Type ll systems for all of our aircraft and should have it installed before the end of summer.

No question that the viewing on the Fujitsu, leaves something to be desired!

 

[Gulfstream 200]

Agree with H. Agenda for the most part. We (Part 91) are using a Fujitsu tablet for the JeppView material as well as each pilot has this same info on his personal laptop. Carry backup batteries for the Fujitsu and print all the known airports out on paper before we leave for the trip, Dest, Alts, ETP Alts, etc. Then if there is a change enroute do to the principal wanting a new destination, or an emergency we revert to the Fujitsu. Also carry a printer onboard that would allow for us to print charts if there was enough time. As far as the FAA is concerend, the fact that we are printing the charts before hand, and-or have the capability to do the same, they don't care about are application of this technology. We are just evaluating several Type ll systems for all of our aircraft and should have it installed before the end of summer.

No question that the viewing on the Fujitsu, leaves something to be desired!

ditto what spooky says. 2 tablets with Jeppview/Flightdeck in the aircraft, ability to print.

Print out everything you may need befrehand as reading those things SUCKS.

never had to actually use one for an approach after many years of using them.

PS - Jeppview is the most pathetic program ever made IMHO.

 

[Bjetset2]

EFBs

Thanks everyone for the advice!!! We are evaluating this issue and all of your experience really helps!! I just wish the FAA was consistent at each FSDO location as to their interpretation of the AC. Oh well, what else is new?

 

[TXGold]

We use them in both the GIV and CE-680. The ones we have in the Gulfstream are nice for using during taxi(shows a little airplane symbol thru GPS taxiing around the 10-9 chart), and are great for alternates. Since we print the charts out that we are going to need, we hardly use them. I suggest if you can get one that mounts to the yoke you will be more inclined to use it, that is if there is room. EFB's are a neccasary evil if you want to print your own charts and not have a huge amount of updates to tackle or books to carry around.

TXGold

 

[mike1mc]

For 135 ops, two units are required including a printer and a 6-month trial period. For 91 you do not require any approvals from the FSDO and I don't think you need two units. I have a King Air paperless under 91 and it only has one Class 3 EFB ("Tablet PC" EFBS are usually Class 2). It would be good practice to have 2 units onboard anyway.

STC for hardmount is NOT required. We operate a Lear 60 and Challenger 604 without STCs for hardmounts. You can use them as "loose equipment". We had to develop a procedure to use the EFBs this way under 135. I beleive FLOPS also uses the units this way. Maybe someone can confirm this.