Outlook at Spirit

[Flyinhi]

Had dinner the over night with matt n. and he was all for PBS and claims that 4 days between pairings hurt us. They also claim they wanted pay to up near southwest but at the same time I can see work rules going out the window. They seemed to think they can finish before they are out.

How is the 4 days between pairings hurting us? Everyone is going to need the 4 days for commuting to all the bases.

 

[$0.02]

Good point Flyinhi! I was flying with another member of our MEC to "Port au Poverty" who actually said to me, "Four days off between trips is a bad idea because it forces the company to build inefficient lines!" I about fell out of my seat! He then said that PBS would allow US to fly the first two weeks of the month and then have the remaining part of the month off...my question to him was, "Do you really think this company would allow lines to be built that way?" Yikes....

 

[lostplnetairman]

5,000 CAL pilots can't be wrong on PBS--just vote NO!

QOL is key--4 days off are mandatory since two days are used for commuting--just vote NO!

 

[Gearthrower]

If the company could build efficent pairings they would currently under the present contract. PBS does not create pairings it builds lines according to the to the entered prefs. When will people get it PBS is a line builder it does not build the pairings if the pairings suck then the lines will suck. I worked at a commuter that had no set number of days off between pairings and we where still inefficent. Same story here nothing to see; No matter how good a contract you have if the company will not follow the current contract how can we expect them to follow a new contract. I say hell no to PBS; they can not be trusted will talk next time. Pay depreciates, QOL never does!!!!

 

[boomlrd]

I don't care about anything else, ( well mostly) but as a guy coming from a PBS airline in which the same promises were made, if there is PBS and less than 4 days off in between pairings, I will vote NO!

 

[joeyfly55]

Pbs Sucks!!! Vote No!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[huncowboy]

Once I've started to actually spend time over my bid, I had very good results with PBS. It does take time to learn how it works and it takes time to build a good bid. But the flexibility it provides is nice.

I have no clue about line bidding but I think with line bidding there are no superb lines and there are no extremely crappy ones. It is more toward the average. Am I right? I really don’t know I have never had that.

With PBS if you are at the bottom you will fly the worst trips with the least days off etc... But there is still some control even if you are really low. However if you are senior you can make your own line. You might have to build a few different versions of that line but you can get a lot of what you ask or even 100% if you are really on the top. It works well with a large base with many trips overlapping each other (thus providing enough variations) and it sucks with a small base.

PBS takes more away from the junior and provides it to the senior as long that senior person knows how to bid. I once shared the van in CLE with a senior CAL CA and he was not happy with PBS. (He was a super nice older guy btw.) He said he was doing good initially, but for the past few months he was getting ********************ty trips. He also said he had the same bid in since the beginning. Obviously he did not understand PBS, and he choose to not learn it while others junior to him did. Thus his bid that provided good trips initially (probably a very generic bid) became less “competitive” while others started to figure out the system.

With PBS there is a learning curve and there is a monthly homework to do to have a good line. The more junior a person, the more he/she is asking for, the longer it takes to build a decent bid. If you don't put in your time you won't use it to its extent. There is absolutely no reason a senior person should ever get a bad line if he knows what he is doing except:

If the company controls the whole thing it can get real bad. At my current (current for about another 15 minutes… yeah…) company they were withholding trips and hand building lines as they wished. Then you could go and work that month and later get $20 in a grievance. It has been said here before. If the company has control over PBS than probably better screw it. But if the pilots can run it, and there is proper training before its release than I think it is a great tool that provides some control. This or the other way the trips will be built by the company. Right? Why let them build your line too?

My 0.002

PS: Now someone please be nice enough and tell me where I can find the other two memory items in the QRH? I could only find the Loss of speed data (or something similar). Where is the other 2? I am making my flash cards for training. Thx!

 

[Beetle007]

How is the 4 days between pairings hurting us? Everyone is going to need the 4 days for commuting to all the bases.

I have never heard any of the union guys say we should get rid of the 4 days off. I have heard them say they want to make it pilot waivable. I would be OK with that. And I still say it should be 5 days =)

We already have pilot waivable options when bidding. A good example is we can voluntarily take our 24/7 away from base if it is to our benefit.

I'm not against pref bidding if we also have good work rules. With good work rules, pref bidding will only hurt the guys who currently milk the system picking up open time and junior assignment pay. Pref bidding sucks at other airlines because they don't have any work rules to protect them (e.g., High daily guarantee, high minimum days off, etc).

 

[Gearthrower]

The QRH items you are looking for if you are refering to Spirit's books, they are located at the end of each specific system section if there is a memory item. I do not have my books with me or I would give you specific page references sorry. They are hard to find good luck.

 

[huncowboy]

The QRH items you are looking for if you are refering to Spirit's books, they are located at the end of each specific system section if there is a memory item. I do not have my books with me or I would give you specific page references sorry. They are hard to find good luck.

Thanks! I have found them after I got some PMs from other guys.