Ops management call for 2 extra meetings

[SilverSurfer]

Put up or shut up

So you're suggesting that the union is NOT saying that pilots should quit? Funny, that's not what they've said here...Perhaps it is YOU that doesn't know what is going on...too busy telling pointed anecdotes on public boards to get other guys fired, I guess.

OK dude show me one communication from anyone in the union leadership that has told our pilots to quit. Just one. You are the one that has specialized in anecdotal statements, baseless accusations, and distortion of or a complete lack of the facts.

Still out there reading all those Union communications to find that one you were referring to. Hey, save yourself some time, just make it up like you have done everything else.:laugh:

 

[realityman]

VOR,

It's been the widespread mission of the NJA pilots to ruin the reputation of FLOPS?

Ahhhhhh........maybe stopping your meds at this point in time wasn't such a good idea after all.

That has got to be some of the most paranoid conspiracy crap I've heard since that movie with Mel Gibson, what was it, oh yeah, Conspiracy Theory!

Up until that last post I was willing to have reasoned debates with you on these subjects. But, egads man! Lighten up a bit.

I assure you, the vast majority of pilots at NJA, as well as our entire union leadership structure, have got far better things to do with our time than trying to destroy the reputation of a company that, from the very beginning, didn't have a good reputation.

As for 1108 purposely trying to take out FLOPS as a competitor, well, that completely contradicts what you were saying earlier about all they want is the dues money. I think putting all the pilots out of work at FLOPS would have a NEGATIVE effect on the bottom line of dues at 1108, now wouldn't it? So which is it? Are we trying to get as much money from you as possible? Or are we trying to put you out of business, therefore guaranteeing a large reduction in union income?

Besides, NJA doesn't need the union's help to put FLOPS under. What if NJA simply came up with a standing order that for the foreseeable future, all newhires would come from applicants currently employed at FLOPS. At a hiring rate of 300 pilots per year, how much hurt would that put on FLOPS?

VOR, you really need a vacation. And I'm not being a smarta**. Seriously, take a break from FlightInfo and at least put your thoughts in order a bit. You're not sounding very reasoned anymore.

 

[SilverSurfer]

Crickets From Voice Of Treason

So you're suggesting that the union is NOT saying that pilots should quit? Funny, that's not what they've said here...Perhaps it is YOU that doesn't know what is going on...too busy telling pointed anecdotes on public boards to get other guys fired, I guess.

OK dude show me one communication from anyone in the union leadership that has told our pilots to quit. Just one. You are the one that has specialized in anecdotal statements, baseless accusations, and distortion of or a complete lack of the facts.

This is the third time I put this question to you Voice Of Treason and all we hear is crickets. I haven't seen a single word you have posted that was factual or true, this is a simple question about your comments. Do you not stand behind your words, can you not substantiate the accusations you make, can you not support the baseless lies you post here. Come on Treason,,,, man up.

 

[Galaxy]

OK dude show me one communication from anyone in the union leadership that has told our pilots to quit. Just one. You are the one that has specialized in anecdotal statements, baseless accusations, and distortion of or a complete lack of the facts.

This is the third time I put this question to you Voice Of Treason and all we hear is crickets. I haven't seen a single word you have posted that was factual or true, this is a simple question about your comments. Do you not stand behind your words, can you not substantiate the accusations you make, can you not support the baseless lies you post here. Come on Treason,,,, man up.

Silver-
He gets the QUIT ideas from me. I will take responsibility for those words. NEVER have I said that the union feels pilots should QUIT. I have only said it was my personal opinion. I have posted this many times for him and all to see. I want to see the 1108 win the battle. However for some-they don't have it in them to endure the fight. His anger about his views of inaction from the union just continue to grow within him.
Is he a troll? Who really knows-only he knows for sure. I have read many-many of his posts-He does seem highly misinformed on alot of issues-mostly dealing with NJA-the CBA and the IBB.
My stance will remain the same-If you can't endure the fight at FLOPS or can't take the chance that there will be nothing in the end. Well, then QUIT. There are so many real flying jobs out there right now. 10 out of 10 former FLOPS pilots agree that life is better for them the DAY they left FLOPS.
I believe in the 1108 and have trust in the Union's leadership. What I don't trust is the lame mgt that sits at the top of the puzzle palace in CGF.

 

[SilverSurfer]

Voice Of treason

Silver-
He gets the QUIT ideas from me. I will take responsibility for those words. NEVER have I said that the union feels pilots should QUIT. I have only said it was my personal opinion. I have posted this many times for him and all to see. I want to see the 1108 win the battle. However for some-they don't have it in them to endure the fight. His anger about his views of inaction from the union just continue to grow within him.
Is he a troll? Who really knows-only he knows for sure. I have read many-many of his posts-He does seem highly misinformed on alot of issues-mostly dealing with NJA-the CBA and the IBB.
My stance will remain the same-If you can't endure the fight at FLOPS or can't take the chance that there will be nothing in the end. Well, then QUIT. There are so many real flying jobs out there right now. 10 out of 10 former FLOPS pilots agree that life is better for them the DAY they left FLOPS.
I believe in the 1108 and have trust in the Union's leadership. What I don't trust is the lame mgt that sits at the top of the puzzle palace in CGF.

He absolutely is misinformed and all of his post are filled with inaccuracies and out right false statements. The worst part of it is that when his lack of knowledge or his false statement are pointed out to him, he doesn't give a sh!t. Regardless of what his actual intentions are, the end result of them is to spread FUD. As such he becomes a tool of management and is working against those of us that are here to fight the fight to the end.

The time for middle of the road has come and gone. Any pilot at Floptions is either with us or against us, there is no more in between.

 

[fischman]

Ice in the veins boys. It is only business.

 

[Sportsman]

Quiting

I am a 10 Year veteran and quiting is exactly what I think of each week as I pack my bags for 8 days of pure Hell however I have made a promise to myself that I would remain until we have a contract and find a cure for MS. I faithfully pay my dues to the 1108 and it is deffinately time to $hit or get off the pot with this company. How long will it take to get a contract? Answer: as long as we let it. When the cost of supplimental chater exceeds the annual cost of a contract we will then get a contract. I have heard pilots say Ohh they will just close the doors, well guess what If they want to close the doors do it now don't wait another minute shut it down. Yea I didn't think so. In 2 years time this will be nothing more than a pilot management company that caters to 135 charter, Jet Pass and the owners of the A/C and they will be flown under 91-k. Without significant scope clauses in our contract we can plan on lets see flying a X out of APA for example making 125k a year maybe and living on a pager definately. Better hope Owners live in your town.

Just Another Pissed Off FLOPS Pilot and 1108 Member in good standing.

 

[Galaxy]

Spot on Sportsman!

I am a 10 Year veteran and quiting is exactly what I think of each week as I pack my bags for 8 days of pure Hell however I have made a promise to myself that I would remain until we have a contract and find a cure for MS. I faithfully pay my dues to the 1108 and it is deffinately time to $hit or get off the pot with this company. How long will it take to get a contract? Answer: as long as we let it. When the cost of supplimental chater exceeds the annual cost of a contract we will then get a contract. I have heard pilots say Ohh they will just close the doors, well guess what If they want to close the doors do it now don't wait another minute shut it down. Yea I didn't think so. In 2 years time this will be nothing more than a pilot management company that caters to 135 charter, Jet Pass and the owners of the A/C and they will be flown under 91-k. Without significant scope clauses in our contract we can plan on lets see flying a X out of APA for example making 125k a year maybe and living on a pager definately. Better hope Owners live in your town.

Just Another Pissed Off FLOPS Pilot and 1108 Member in good standing.

Exactly! By giving mgt the time to make these decisions they are allowing owner contract to expire therefore releasing them from lawsuits. You are spot on by saying it will take as long as YOU allow it. Mgt is saving a lot of money by stalling this contract. F & H is making a lot of money by trying to avoid or delay a contract. Who is the one left out of the loop. The PILOTS! Turn up the heat-If they fire you unjustly-who cares? It is a sh@t job anyway. Turn around and sue-many are in that very process anyway. If you find something better-GREAT!-just turn up the heat before you go. Force the blundering idiots to play a hand before they are willing..
Everyone should wake up and see the path the GO BACKWARD plan is headed. ALL CHARTER-ALL the TIME!

CONTRACT OR FIRE SALE!

 

[SilverSurfer]

No more Mr. Nice Guy

Exactly! By giving mgt the time to make these decisions they are allowing owner contract to expire therefore releasing them from lawsuits. You are spot on by saying it will take as long as YOU allow it. Mgt is saving a lot of money by stalling this contract. F & H is making a lot of money by trying to avoid or delay a contract. Who is the one left out of the loop. The PILOTS! Turn up the heat-If they fire you unjustly-who cares? It is a sh@t job anyway. Turn around and sue-many are in that very process anyway. If you find something better-GREAT!-just turn up the heat before you go. Force the blundering idiots to play a hand before they are willing..
Everyone should wake up and see the path the GO BACKWARD plan is headed. ALL CHARTER-ALL the TIME!

CONTRACT OR FIRE SALE!

The time has come for every pilot at Floptions to decide who he is going to stand with, his fellow pilots fighting for our jobs or the poor excuse for managers and men that populate CGF. We have to many pilots that are paying dues but waffling in their actions at work, not executing the initiative supported by our Union leadership. Now is time for all or nothing. Management has to feel our solidarity and it has to rock them to their corrupt little cores. All of us are tired of this grind we have been going through with contract negotiations, it's wearing down everybody in the company. Management is the culprit for negotiations taking so long. They have refused to meet any more then we already do or do anything to speed the pace of negotiations. When management feels the solidarity of a unified pilot group, when they see what their foot dragging is doing to the company, when the company is losing more profits through company wide inefficiencies then the cost of a contract, when they recognize that they need the pilots help to make the company survive, we will have a contract.

If you know a pilot that is continuing to operate in a unprofessional manner, carrying known discrepancies, allowing scheduling to work them over 14 hr., Bending the regs to help out management, talk to them. Explain to them that they are the ones enabling management to continue to drag the negotiations process out. Ask them if they are tired of the fight we are in at Floptinos and explain that we need them to help end it.

It's time for all of us to step up and pull together to reach our goal. Our first contract.

 

[skanza]

I am a 10 Year veteran and quiting is exactly what I think of each week as I pack my bags for 8 days of pure Hell however I have made a promise to myself that I would remain until we have a contract and find a cure for MS. I faithfully pay my dues to the 1108 and it is deffinately time to $hit or get off the pot with this company. How long will it take to get a contract? Answer: as long as we let it. When the cost of supplimental chater exceeds the annual cost of a contract we will then get a contract. I have heard pilots say Ohh they will just close the doors, well guess what If they want to close the doors do it now don't wait another minute shut it down. Yea I didn't think so. In 2 years time this will be nothing more than a pilot management company that caters to 135 charter, Jet Pass and the owners of the A/C and they will be flown under 91-k. Without significant scope clauses in our contract we can plan on lets see flying a X out of APA for example making 125k a year maybe and living on a pager definately. Better hope Owners live in your town.

Just Another Pissed Off FLOPS Pilot and 1108 Member in good standing.

What makes the cost of supplemental charter go up? Is it in-house pilot's not flying in-house airplanes? Or, the number of trips booked not coinciding with the level of inventory of airplanes/crews? I'm open to whatever the answer is...

 

[jetwash]

Considering that we lost 12 pilots in the last 6 weeks and we have green aircraft all over the country. It is not hard to see what part of the problem is.

Everyday I talk to guys that have got jobs at other places and are waiting for the class dates.

 

[bluepost]

I am a 10 Year veteran and quiting is exactly what I think of each week as I pack my bags for 8 days of pure Hell however I have made a promise to myself that I would remain until we have a contract and find a cure for MS. I faithfully pay my dues to the 1108 and it is deffinately time to $hit or get off the pot with this company. How long will it take to get a contract? Answer: as long as we let it. When the cost of supplimental chater exceeds the annual cost of a contract we will then get a contract. I have heard pilots say Ohh they will just close the doors, well guess what If they want to close the doors do it now don't wait another minute shut it down. Yea I didn't think so. In 2 years time this will be nothing more than a pilot management company that caters to 135 charter, Jet Pass and the owners of the A/C and they will be flown under 91-k. Without significant scope clauses in our contract we can plan on lets see flying a X out of APA for example making 125k a year maybe and living on a pager definately. Better hope Owners live in your town.

Just Another Pissed Off FLOPS Pilot and 1108 Member in good standing.

SPOT ON FROM AN OUTSIDER!!!! This is the attitude everyone needs to have at FLOPS. Good luck to you all!

 

[Galaxy]

Answer is......

What makes the cost of supplemental charter go up? Is it in-house pilot's not flying in-house airplanes? Or, the number of trips booked not coinciding with the level of inventory of airplanes/crews? I'm open to whatever the answer is...

Answer is.... Who cares????? Thats The S twins problem. The FLOPS pilots have one thing on their minds. CONTRACT or FIRE SALE.
Skanza-I think you should beef up your resume. I think you might need it.

 

[SilverSurfer]

Exactly

I am a 10 Year veteran and quiting is exactly what I think of each week as I pack my bags for 8 days of pure Hell however I have made a promise to myself that I would remain until we have a contract and find a cure for MS. I faithfully pay my dues to the 1108 and it is deffinately time to $hit or get off the pot with this company. How long will it take to get a contract? Answer: as long as we let it. When the cost of supplimental chater exceeds the annual cost of a contract we will then get a contract. I have heard pilots say Ohh they will just close the doors, well guess what If they want to close the doors do it now don't wait another minute shut it down. Yea I didn't think so. In 2 years time this will be nothing more than a pilot management company that caters to 135 charter, Jet Pass and the owners of the A/C and they will be flown under 91-k. Without significant scope clauses in our contract we can plan on lets see flying a X out of APA for example making 125k a year maybe and living on a pager definately. Better hope Owners live in your town.

Just Another Pissed Off FLOPS Pilot and 1108 Member in good standing.

My brother form another mother, you are EXACTLY right on the money here. Its time for all of our pilots to have the balls to step up to the plate and take a stand. They will either stand with us or the will stand with management, but by God its time that all pilots are held accountable for their loyalty.

You are either with us or you are against us.