Opinions on a job offer.

[BeckyAnne]

I interviewed on Monday for a corporate operator, it was the first formal interview. We (the Chief Pilot and I) had already talked at the airport after I gave him my resume some time back and once more two weeks ago when I dropped off an update to my resume.

Well the job offer was made it is mine for the taking, about a $5,000 bump in pay, benefits, 401k etc.

But, there’s always a but.

There are some strings attached, so to speak. One of the conditions of my employment is that I must obtain my ATP. They presented me with two options.

One, I could go it on my own, pay it out of pocket and take my ride anywhere I wanted and they would reimburse me for the cost of the written and the checkride only. If it required a motel due to out of town travel that was on my bill.

Two, they would pay for my ATP but it would have to be done in one of two ways, the first would be at FSI when I do my type rating, I can do my ATP ride as well. The other would be in the event that a slot in a type class was longer than 6 months away; they would send me to the FSI in Lakeland to do just my ATP.

Either way I am required to sign an 18-month training contract for the type rating.

The reason I present this is to ask if anyone has any experience with the FSI and their ATP program?

I would like to take it with All ATP’s in ATL, for personal reasons.

Second, when doing the ATP ride concurrent with a type rating is this a big even or is it just essentially the type rating expanded in areas the examiner feels he/she may need to take you there.

I’ve heard a type-rating ride is more or less just an ATP ride.


What are the good and bad of a training contract, in my past I’ve never been asked to sign anything other than the normal job stuff.

While now with the job market what it is, I would be a fool to say I would jump ship before the 18 month period is up, but my ultimate goal in the fractionals and if NetJets called I would not be able to resist.

But the above is not likely as I have no jet time and my last app to them was before 9/11 when I was applying to everyone under the sun including NASA… no lie I really did!

I’m just looking for any information anyone in a similar boat might be able to give me or share up.

I’m very new at this corporate game, coming out of a small property management group where I flew a Seneca and a 421 two days a week while CFI-ing to make ends meet.

Thanks in advance

Becky

 

[Dep676]

I just went to Flight Safety for the first time this year. It was best training I had ever had. I would say go there and get your ATP. Like said before your type ride is the same as the ATP. Also especially if the contract is pro-rated 18 months will fly by and you will be done. The way NetJets is going it could be a while before you get called and then a while to start if offered.

I knew of people that have gone to All ATP's and have busted their rides for stupid stuff also. Not saying people haven't passed at FSI either. I just think FSI is a lot better operation and training.

What kind of plane is it that you are getting hired into?

Good Luck and Fly Safe.

 

[CL60]

Easy decision!

Becky,

Do it! There really is nothing to think about here. Go with what you know right now... is NJA knocking on your door right now? If not, then you must rely on factual data. I'm guessing you still have over 20 years left to fly. 18 months is not that long. If EJA calls and you must fulfill your obligations with this other company, they will respect the fact that you have a high work ethic and will probably keep a spot open for you.

It looks like you're worried about a problem that does not really exist. These are actually potential problems that may or may not exist in the future.

Take the ATP/type ride at FSI. I've had a type rating at FSI and they do a fine job. BTW, you can kill two birds with one stone by taking the type and ATP at the same time... same ride.

Hope this helps to alleviate your concerns.

Good luck,

 

[ultrarunner]

This is an easy one. Think about what the company is offering you...to PAY for your ATP/Type rating. In exchange for an 18 month commitment. THIS IS A NO-BRAINER. Period.

Question I present is this:

Either way you gotta hang out for 18 months, right? So, WHY would you even consider going out on your own to get it (less their stated reimbursemnt), in-as-much as it's likely not going to get you a type rating. When the first options seems much more appealing. AND you're gettting the training in what you'll be flying for this company, I'm assuming.

With no other information to go on, it sounds like you're dealing with a good outfit.

As a previous poster mentioned, the ATP and Type Rating come from the same PTS. You will have no problems with the FSI Type/ATP course.

Becky, I am courious as to why you are hot on All ATP's in Atlanta? What gives?

Good luck.

 

[LR25]

The training aggreement they are presenting you is a normal one. At least there not saying you pay now, and then we will pay you later.

This should be a very easy decision with no reservations.

Also, the type and ATP ride are the same. There really wouldnt be any reason to go to All ATP's, it would only mean that you would do two checkrides.

Alot of operators dont even entertain the idea of a type rating until your ready for an upgrade, you are going to get one right away, this makes the job even more valuable.

And as far as Netjets and such, I would take this job, do your 18 months without even worrying about sending out one resume. If you dont even have any turbine time right now, you are not most likely going to be called from any of these companys, there are just too many people on the street with thousands of hours of time.

Take the job and enjoy it.

Good luck and have fun in training.

 

[Rick1128]

Becky,

Do it all at FSI. An 18 month training contract is not a big deal. Before you know it, it will be over with. Be sure it is prorated and that if you're laid off it is considered completed.

This sounds like a corporate position. I realize that right now you would really like to get on with Netjets, but a good corporate position is usually a much better situation. You usually know all your passengers and where they go. Know all the FBO personnel. Etc. Fractionals, at least from the pilot stand point, are much like charter. Whoever has the money and whatever can fit in the door, goes. Just food for thought.

 

[banned username 2]

I agree with all of the above posts...

Do you ATP/Type rating at FSI as one ride... this is a no-brainer...

I realize you are all hot on NetJets, but you might find out after working this job that NetJets isn't so appealing anymore... Like Rick said, NetJets is basically like flying Charter, what you are going into sounds like a Corporate job...

I would be shocked if they couldn't get you into an FSI Type Rating class in less than 6 months... FSI is laying off people because they are slow... I would think you could get a class next month, or February at the latest...

What type of aircraft and what type of pay are you talking about? How much are they expecting you to work?

Overall sounds like a descent deal...

Good Luck!

 

[BeckyAnne]

Wow!!!

Thanks to all for the insight and response.

After all the high marks people have given FSI I’ll be taking the company up on the ATP, I was just curious about the ATP/Type rating ride. As for All ATP’s I had dealings with them in the past is all. I’ve heard the usual horror stories, but I don’t think anything can compare to Southeastern School of Aeronautics, that place was a nightmare, in the early 90’s I was screwed out of my MEI and $1200.00 by the owner, tried to sue but didn’t have enough money, so now all I do is bad mouth them, as do most of their former students and instructors.

The job.

It is a Corporate Operator, they own a Lear 60 but they do have an interesting “charter” side. I was told the flying is split 60/40, 60% company 40% outside work.

The bulk of the 40% is made up of 5 smaller area companies that were approved by the Owner as well as the Chief Pilot and the occasional friend of friend type stuff as it was put to me. All in all my future boss say they deal with less than 150 different people that can use the plane, but they keep them fairly busy.
They don’t expect a lot out of you that ventures outside of just running a safe flight department. They do their own ground handling arrangements inside the US, one of the secretary’s works with a pilot to line all those ducks in a row. The company requires the plane be professionally cleaned and uses a service thru one of the local chain FBO’s for that but our Chief wants a crew member present during the cleaning process, so people are scheduled for that duty on a rotating basis.

The pay is in the mid 40’s to start and will go up after probation. They also provide all uniforms and charts, pubs etc. A luxury I didn’t have with my last job where I had to dress in business like attire but was given no allowance also I had to purchase not only pubs for the southeast and northeast but the Caribbean as well.

I was put in a bad spot once due to a demanding passenger who just could not understand why I could not fly to some little island I’d never even heard of because I didn’t have any charts. He kept babbling on and on about how clear it was and he’d spot it for me, it had a unique shape, bla bla bla… I wound up in south Florida in a rental car running from FBO to FBO looking for what I needed with the old windbag in the car with me.


Also the company has a Cessna 421 that is used solely for day trips and to visit sites that are out of the way, sort of. Everyone has to fly trips in the 421, including the Chief Pilot on a rotating week schedule, something like one week every 5 or 6 you will be scheduled to pull any 421 trips. The 421 is the owners personal plane and from what I saw is in magnificent condition packed with dual moving maps and a Flight Max radar all brand new!

I was told the type rating was required because they fly a lot out of the country and not only is it wise, looks better to the insurance policy holder but some authorities require both crew be typed.

I was curious about the training contract I had talked to people before who had signed them with mixed feelings and some even had really bad experiences. A friend of mine who taught with me at Southeastern and then went to work for a company flying out of Middle Georgia had a tussle over a training contract and a PIC Lear type when he left for another Lear job in Dallas.

Guess I’m just fearful I’ll do the wrong thing, especially in the volatile job market you cannot be too cautious.

Sorry for the rambling, but I was flipping back and forth trying to answer everyone’s questions. I know this probably reads like Chinese stereo instructions, but I never claimed to be a Pulitzer award-winning writer.

Happy holidays to all

Becky

 

[Gulfstream 200]

Take the job, it sounds like a good opportunity.

Absolute no brainer, FSI for the type/ATP. Its a piece of cake.
Even for your first type you will find FSI pretty easy, just read ahead and be prepared. Not with stupid numbers inyour head, but with checklists, flows, profiles down pat.

congratulations on your new gig.

 

[banned username 2]

Hey Gulfstream 200, I LOVE the new Avatar!!!!! Did you pick that one out special for GVFlyer????

Becky...

Sounds like a good deal... take it, you'll love the Lear 60!!! Lears are great first jets, makes every other jet you fly seem easy!

Good Luck!