OMG! ROFLMAO! "Management by TRUST" by Kenn Ricci

[hangarrat]

(BTW "Glass Pilot" obviously you don't even work for a frac based on your a/c profile, so what makes you think YOU know how "unstable" my words are? You haven't a CLUE what is going on here)

oh ye of little knowledge. thou hast begged the wrath of glass to come down upon thee. Translated - "did you see the P180 in his profile?" uh - duh - 5th largest and growing...

 

[Voice Of Reason]

VOR-

I've been around KR for a long time.

Join the club....

I'm sure KR doesn't want Flight Options to be hamstrung by a CBA. However, a comprehensive scope clause will go a long way towards protecting us from the scenario you proffer. I think we all need to see how the scope clause will read before we start worrying about the sky falling.

Um, the "sky" already "fell" under his watch (hence the union in the first place), then sold us down the river to much worse devils (to our faces anyway)...they did much more dirty work (the last of which happened while he was back on the property)...and experience says we will be sold yet again.
I'm just SAYIN'....

 

[ProFracPilot]

...and experience says we will be sold yet again.

I won't dispute the possiblity. My point is if scope is crafted properly in the CBA, it shouldn't matter.

You did bring up a good point in a prior post when you commented about NJA pilots leaving 1108. I know there is an agreement between 1108 and ASAP to work together on "future projects". I would like to learn more about what exactly this agreement outlines. Perhaps the structure has already been put in place for seniority list integration that could result from a merger.

 

[Voice Of Reason]

I won't dispute the possiblity. My point is if scope is crafted properly in the CBA, it shouldn't matter.

You did bring up a good point in a prior post when you commented about NJA pilots leaving 1108. I know there is an agreement between 1108 and ASAP to work together on "future projects". I would like to learn more about what exactly this agreement outlines. Perhaps the structure has already been put in place for seniority list integration that could result from a merger.

KR is only slightly ahead of the trustworthy curve than that group, I would hope we have learned by now....(even PRIOR to the recent 'controversy')

 

[Voice Of Reason]

I won't dispute the possiblity. My point is if scope is crafted properly in the CBA, it shouldn't matter.

Is it possible to craft a scope that will survive through:
- a company that has a bigger (and anti-union) group of pilots acquires or is acquired by Flops?
- a company that has a bigger (DIFFERENT union) pilot group that acquires or is acquired by Flops (and may staple...what if THEY have an iron clad scope clause)?
-Flops selling off the operation in parts
-Flops turning the operation into something other than fractional (charter, lease, managed, new variation of operating not yet named that KR will again "invent")?
-Contract pilots flooding the operation
????
Just a few things to think about

 

[ProFracPilot]

Is it possible to craft a scope that will survive through:
- a company that has a bigger (and anti-union) group of pilots acquires or is acquired by Flops?
- a company that has a bigger (DIFFERENT union) pilot group that acquires or is acquired by Flops (and may staple...what if THEY have an iron clad scope clause)?
-Flops selling off the operation in parts
-Flops turning the operation into something other than fractional (charter, lease, managed, new variation of operating not yet named that KR will again "invent")?
-Contract pilots flooding the operation
????

I'm no expert on scope or CBA's, but I'd guess it is impossible to craft a scope clause that would cover every possible angle. If I don't like (or understand) what I'm reading in any portion of the TA - but especially the scope clause - when we get it, I'll be questioning our union leadership. I strongly encourage all who will be affected by this TA to do the same.

 

[Ultra Grump]

I hope there is a way to protect that, WORSE YET, the NJ's guys dumped IBT perhaps so we won't be the same union, so their BIGGER group will have no qualms about stapling the entire flops group to the bottom. Yup, laugh, but I'll pull this post up yet again when it happens. After all, we're ALL in the "USED aircraft" business now aren't we? One & the same :nuts:

Why the hell would NJA want a steaming pile of Beechjets?

 

[Voice Of Reason]

Why the hell would NJA want a steaming pile of Beechjets?

...because the BBJs were such big sellers, and the rest of the fleet is mostly all still so "new"

 

[wacoflyr]

Is this some kind of stream of consciousness post? 'Cause you keep hitting the post tab before you get it all out. If this is working for you, keep at it. What ever it takes to get healthy. We understand.

Wacoflyr

 

[netjetwife]

I won't dispute the possiblity. My point is if scope is crafted properly in the CBA, it shouldn't matter. I agree with that.

You did bring up a good point in a prior post when you commented about NJA pilots leaving 1108. I know there is an agreement between 1108 and ASAP to work together on "future projects". I would like to learn more about what exactly this agreement outlines. The idea is to work together on industry wide issues (like user fees) that will affect both pilotgroups. Perhaps the structure has already been put in place for seniority list integration that could result from a merger. The only structure that has been put in place is the new EBoard position -- VP of Industry Affairs...

The paranoia directed at those who spent lots of time, money, and energy helping a fellow frac group is undeserved and down-right sad. The primary motivation in leaving the Teamsters was a strong desire to be independent and a firm belief that the NJ pilots were, in reality, already going it alone and doing a far better job in the process. They deserved a good reputation based on their own merits, and all of their dues money to do more for the NJ pilots while better representing their own interests in industry affairs. If there was a secondary motive concerning another pilotgroup, I believe it was thought that an in-house association would be more appealing to the NJI pilots.

Good luck on the upcoming TA and remember Scope--it's more than a mouthwash!

 

[Ultra Grump]

...because the BBJs were such big sellers, and the rest of the fleet is mostly all still so "new"

Relevance is apparently overrated in the VOR household.

 

[Voice Of Reason]

Relevance is apparently overrated in the VOR household.

Would that, by chance, be the same relevance that causes you and NJW to turn every clearly titled thread into one about NJs?

 

[gunfyter]

VOR,

Who turned this thread to be about NJ?

 

[netjetwife]

... WORSE YET, the NJ's guys dumped IBT perhaps so we won't be the same union, so their BIGGER group will have no qualms about stapling the entire flops group to the bottom. .....

Get the facts straight. GF is right. This is the false accusation that I responded to. My husband is one of those who led the Independence movement and I know exactly why my family gave up (and are still giving) so much of our personal time to form an in-house union/association. It is for the reasons I explained and I find this absurdly paranoid suggestion insulting to the NJ pilotgroup who only wished to have complete control over their destiny and their money. Posters seeking to start ugly rumors shouldn't be surprised when those in the know set the record straight. NJW

 

[B19 Flyer]

Get the facts straight. GF is right. This is the false accusation that I responded to. My husband is one of those who led the Independence movement and I know exactly why my family gave up (and are still giving) so much of our personal time to form an in-house union/association. It is for the reasons I explained and I find this absurdly paranoid suggestion insulting to the NJ pilotgroup who only wished to have complete control over their destiny and their money. Posters seeking to start ugly rumors shouldn't be surprised when those in the know set the record straight. NJW

She should know.. remember all that inside information that she has because the union doesn't have any kind of confidentiality rules with thier membership? ​

She is not a union member, she does not work for NJ, yet SHE is going to set the record straight. :laugh:​

 

[glasspilot]

B19, if the First Lady told me that the President was planning to invade some country in the next two weeks I'd believe her.

You can agree or disagree if NJW's husband should talk to her or not about union stuff, but the fact is he does. Right or wrong, he does.

So...as a result she has an opinion. She decides to post that opinion here. It's a free country. I do believe each and every pilot and poster like you know that and as such there is little conflict. My point is there is little deception going on. Hell, her name is NETJETWIFE. That says it all. She is very upfront about her position.

If you're mad at her husband for talking to her then maybe you could ask her nicely for her husbands cell number and you could call him and complain.

 

[netjetwife]

Glass, I post only general information which is available to NJ pilots and spouses who follow Union issues closely. I have signed a confidentiality agreement which I honor. If you'll notice, I don't break news here. I wait until the pilots discuss things first. I'm always upfront (sticking only to topics I can talk about) and I have a public reputation for being honest. Thanks for noticing...
NJW

 

[Galaxy]

To get back on track..

I don't care what books the guy writes. All we need from him is a quick negotiation to a industry standard contract and put everything in writing. Then the guy can sit in CGF and make cartoon for all I care.

Oh yea-and to keep up with the attitude of everything is about NJ.
I would like to thank again all the hard working NJ pilots for all the help we have received from you. We would not be anywhere close without your help.

 

[B19 Flyer]

B19, if the First Lady told me that the President was planning to invade some country in the next two weeks I'd believe her.

You can agree or disagree if NJW's husband should talk to her or not about union stuff, but the fact is he does. Right or wrong, he does.

So...as a result she has an opinion. She decides to post that opinion here. It's a free country. I do believe each and every pilot and poster like you know that and as such there is little conflict. My point is there is little deception going on. Hell, her name is NETJETWIFE. That says it all. She is very upfront about her position.

If you're mad at her husband for talking to her then maybe you could ask her nicely for her husbands cell number and you could call him and complain.

I'll repeat myself again.

Is SHE the one that should be setting people straight as a non-employee or union member of Netjets?

All of her information is second hand, and it's clear that there is only one place it could be coming from.

When she posts those radical opinions, which of course she's entitled to, are they hers or her husbands?

I would think If I was a NJ union member, I'd be concerned a non-union member is "setting the record straight."

 

[netjetwife]

Galaxy, I'm sure your gracious thanks will be appreciated by all the NJ folks who read your post. Nicely done! When you guys have a worthy CBA in place, many of your frac peers will be cheering too. Pulling up the bar is the right thing to do. Kudos to the Options pilots! NJW