NWALPA's response to it's members.....

[N2264J]

Re: NWALPA's response to it's members...

Originally Posted by N2264J
So the NWA MEC who routinely excluded Mesaba, Compass and Pinnacle pilots from negotiations that affected their interests is not being totally upfront when crying foul about the NWA MEC being excluded? Gee, imagine that.

Imagine a flow thru without participation by the MSA or CPZ pilots. Imagine it, because in reality...they were involved.

Oh, that's big of ya. So did the NWA MEC include the Pinnacle and Mesaba pilots in the discussion where the NWA MEC got a $15 million dollar bargaining credit for diverting 40 growth airplanes away from Pinnacle and Mesaba?

Were the Pinnacle and Mesaba pilots brought on board when their alter ego, Compass, was established?

Were the Pinnacle and Mesaba pilots in the room when the NWA MEC bargained scope that restricted the size and number of aircraft they could fly?

There were no direct negotiations between NWA ALPA and DAL management at any time. Not legal. (See also: "racketeering")

Is there something in your eye - a tear or maybe a beam? Here's a tissue.

 

[JoeMerchant]

Oops! My bad! Your MEC was approving the deal simultaneously with a brief meeting between the NWA MEC and DAL management.

Back to the point: There were no direct negotiations between NWA ALPA and DAL management at any time. Not legal. (See also: "racketeering")

The context of this issue is simple: The DAL MEC contends that their objective is to welcome the NWA pilots into the fold as "brothers", yet did nothing to facilitate that objective while they were the sole ALPA entity permitted to negotiate directly with DAL management.

There were no negotiations between DAL management and the ASA/CMR MECs regarding issues that affect the ASA and CMR MECs. How is that any different? I guess according to you that wasn't legal. Interesting that you now see the light...I guess your Ox is getting gored now.....

 

[JoeMerchant]

As you mentioned previously, Prater has the ultimate control to stop this sort of thing: his signature. A simple statement to Moak that he wouldn't be signing any new merger LOA that wasn't jointly approved by both MECs would have stopped this dead in its tracks. Unfortunately, he's instead decided to allow MECs to run amok and do whatever the hell they want. In the process, he may have just created uSAPa 2.0.

I thought your position was that each MEC is free to negotiate how their flying is performed.....That is what DALPA did in this case.....Why the change of heart now.....Is it different when "big airplane" pilots get the short end of the stick?

MEC's have been running amok for a long time...that is the way this association is structured...AND YOU SUPPORT THAT STRUCTURE. You got what you wanted.....now live with it......

 

[~~~^~~~]

Anyway, back to the subject of the thread.

I understand an olive branch was extended to the NWA pilots from the D_MEC, do not have any details. But IMHO LOA19 is not turning out to be very popular. More than a few Delta pilots would prefer a joint contract.

 

[PCL_128]

Oh, that's big of ya. So did the NWA MEC include the Pinnacle and Mesaba pilots in the discussion where the NWA MEC got a $15 million dollar bargaining credit for diverting 40 growth airplanes away from Pinnacle and Mesaba?

Were the Pinnacle and Mesaba pilots brought on board when their alter ego, Compass, was established?

Were the Pinnacle and Mesaba pilots in the room when the NWA MEC bargained scope that restricted the size and number of aircraft they could fly?

The relationship between the NWA, PCL, and MSA MECs is not the dysfunctional mess that you're used to between CMR and DALPA. In fact, Captain Wychor has always been very close with the NWA MEC. The MECs share an office in MSP. The lines of communication are always open. You RJDC wankers need to stop trying to speak for the Airlink pilots. Your union terrorism does not appeal to them.

 

[pilotyip]

Remember all union contracts are local in nature.

 

[Muskycat]

Anyway, back to the subject of the thread.

I understand an olive branch was extended to the NWA pilots from the D_MEC, do not have any details. But IMHO LOA19 is not turning out to be very popular. More than a few Delta pilots would prefer a joint contract.

LOA19 is not intended to be a contract extension. This is very important to point out.

It may take a long time to reach a joint contract. Until we reach a joint contract each pilot group will continue to work under their PWA.
LOA19 does nothing more than assure pay increases in addition to the DAL PWA increases if joint negotiations are extensively prolonged.

Our goal at Delta is to have one joint contract created by NWA and DAL together and go forward together under a new PWA.

 

[JoeMerchant]

The relationship between the NWA, PCL, and MSA MECs is not the dysfunctional mess that you're used to between CMR and DALPA. In fact, Captain Wychor has always been very close with the NWA MEC. The MECs share an office in MSP. The lines of communication are always open. You RJDC wankers need to stop trying to speak for the Airlink pilots. Your union terrorism does not appeal to them.

Gee Wally....we can have a great relation like Mesaba/PCL/NWA....Sign me up......

Can't wait to see how that works out for them....

Do you honestly think the NWA MEC is going to look out for the PNCL and Mesaba folks? They are going to look out for number 1....Guess who that is going to be....

I see Wychor has a nice ALPA national job now....These politicians just want to secure a Herndon job before everything falls apart....

How's that Brand Scope coming?

How about the flowthrough?:laugh:

 

[Occam's Razor]

LOA19 is not intended to be a contract extension. This is very important to point out.

It may take a long time to reach a joint contract. Until we reach a joint contract each pilot group will continue to work under their PWA.
LOA19 does nothing more than assure pay increases in addition to the DAL PWA increases if joint negotiations are extensively prolonged.

Let's say, just for yuks...the DAL guys are the one's who choose to prolong the negotiations.

Let's say they choose to complete the LOA membership ratification process, while using all means at their disposal to delay the declaration of a PID by the Executive Council. Then they choose to slow-play the negotiation/arbitration process after that. Such a strategy would, in effect, apply more pre$$ure to the NWA side.

I'm reading the words.

And watching their feet.

If we don't see a near-term engagement with the NWA MEC on the SLI process...we'll know which way their feet are moving.

 

[Muskycat]

Let's say, just for yuks...the DAL guys are the one's who choose to prolong the negotiations.

Let's say they choose to complete the LOA membership ratification process, while using all means at their disposal to delay the declaration of a PID by the Executive Council. Then they choose to slow-play the negotiation/arbitration process after that. Such a strategy would, in effect, apply more pre$$ure to the NWA side.

I'm reading the words.

And watching their feet.

That is a very valid point about us dragging our feet. But keep in mind the raise they're offering is nothing more than 5%, basically inflationary raise.
I'm not so sure DAL MEC is going to get LOA19 passed amongst the pilot group. Not many DAL guys where enthusiastic about the deal.
And as much as we don't want the merger, I don't think there is any way to kill it. Hence the reason it's going forward. Richard and Doug are just puppets who can be fired and replaced.

I have a lot of friends at NWA and would never want to through them under a bus or leave them on the street. We both have to realize we'll be making sacrafices to make it work. Not just onside takes all.

 

[tomgoodman]

Engaged, but not married

If we don't see a near-term engagement with the NWA MEC on the SLI process...we'll know which way their feet are moving.

I wouldn't be surprised if there already is "engagement", at least by phone or e-mail. Management is in a hurry to get the deal approved and closed. A pre-merger joint contract and SLI will help them, and they will pay for this help. If they get it done without such pilot assistance, their wallets will slam shut and they will revert to a cost-control mode. A divided pilot group will then have great difficulty in prying loose any contract improvements at all. Both MECs know this and, while in a delicate political position, are not stupid.