NWA Straw Poll on TA

[YourPilotFriend]

The pension plan being terminated probably will not happen if the TA passes. If anything NWA will go into a second bankruptcy down the road if it becomes a problem.

 

[Dizel8]

The pension plan being terminated probably will not happen if the TA passes. If anything NWA will go into a second bankruptcy down the road if it becomes a problem.

I think it will, I think the pension is the carrot, and that the company will hold out on cancelling it until the T/A is signed. Once that is accomplished, the pension will soon be a goner, one way or another.

I don't work for NWA, but I think the pilots need to factor into this T/A that the pension is gone as well.

 

[YourPilotFriend]

The problem I have with that statement is NWA has reached its target cost savings from the pilots with the TA. Anymore over-reaching would be a slap in the face to the judge and he will not approve it. United and USairways pension termination was part of their restructuring plans. NWA terminating the pilot pension plan is not part of restructuring.

 

[Freight Dog]

The pension plan being terminated probably will not happen if the TA passes. If anything NWA will go into a second bankruptcy down the road if it becomes a problem.

The pension plan will be out so fast you won't even know what hit you. They'll come to you for another relief, and if you won't play along, here comes another 1113(c).

Every 'bankrupt' airline is (ab)using the bankruptcy protection to shed this "liability."

Right out of the playbook...

 

[Hvy]

My place of employment DID put me in the same position - chapter 11, threats of furloughs/liquidation, we also had the same gun pointed at our head - 1113(c) motion to dismiss our contract:

Aloha Airlines - December 30, 2004 to February 17, 2006.

My perspective remained the same from 9/11 to present day - take your concessions package and shove it where the sun don't shine. You can keep your shiny jet too.

You're such a tough guy....but "my concessions" still leave me above you in more ways than one.

 

[Dizel8]

The problem I have with that statement is NWA has reached its target cost savings from the pilots with the TA. Anymore over-reaching would be a slap in the face to the judge and he will not approve it. United and USairways pension termination was part of their restructuring plans. NWA terminating the pilot pension plan is not part of restructuring.

Not sure the judge will have much say in the matter when it happens, one because NWA management is about as ruthless as a shark smelling blood and two, the judge does not want to be the one that shuts the airline down.

Management WILL find a way to get rid of the pension, the only reason I can see they have not done it already is like I already mentioned, the carrot approach. Can NWA ALPA get a guarantee that the pension isn't next, I sincerely doubt it! The U pilots tried the very same approach, paycuts to save pension, and yet in the end, pension went puff, DAL appears to be going in the same direction rather swiftly, so you know NWA management must be thinking the very same thought and they don't want to be last man out!

If the pension survives, great, but if I were at NWA, I would, as I said, view this T/A in the light that the pension, as it was, is gone.

 

[Freight Dog]

You're such a tough guy....but "my concessions" still leave me above you in more ways than one.

I wasn't referring to you, but a message to the management.

Lighten up, Francis.

 

[Hvy]

I wasn't referring to you, but a message to the management.

Lighten up, Francis.

You did...and I apologize. Sorry.

 

[81Horse]

The pension plan being terminated probably will not happen if the TA passes. If anything NWA will go into a second bankruptcy down the road if it becomes a problem.

A second bankruptcy? I think those days are over, with the recent changes in BK law.

So I'm thinking: if the company had been willing to guarantee the security of the frozen pension plan, then that would be in the TA. Such a guarantee would probably have assured (barely) the ratification of the TA, ugly as it is. Without that assurance, the TA is a tough sell -- even to the most senior pilots.

 

[Lear70]

6 years ago places like UAL, Delta, NWA and American were the dream jobs that many hoped for.

Yes, they were.

Those that were unable to achieve a position there are obviously envious and relishing at the hardships of those that were able to make it there. I would hope that I wouldn't be so bitter.

No, I'm not, you egotistical a*s.

I didn't pass my United interview back in 2000. In retrospect, I am in a MUCH better position, having not had to go through a furlough during the worst hiring prospects EVER in the history of aviation, having had a job that pays the bills during this entire time, and now having an interview scheduled with a stable carrier that tops out above $200,000 a year after 15 years and an EXCELLENT retirement plan that they can't rob by law.

So no, most of us are THANKFUL, not bitter, that we didn't get hired on there. If you are one of the top 10% that are still making high six-figures and long international overnights, then congrats. But pull your head out of your a*s long enough to realize that YOU ARE IN THE MINORITY AT YOUR OWN AIRLINE, and indeed at ANY major airline.

We're also not "relishing" the hardships ANYONE is facing; quite the opposite, we're feeling the pinch along with everyone else and HOPING and PRAYING that this POS gets voted down and a REAL T.A. can be negotiated while the airline is shut down, because that's what it's going to take.

People like you are one of the main reasons this industry keeps spiraling down. "MY quality of life won't be affected, so I'm voting yes."