NWA may lose AirTran jumpseat

[320AV8R]

Let's get something straight here, Chief. I don't want or need your jumpseat, period.

First of all, my name is not Chief. If you don't want or need the J/S, you don't have to worry about being denied the J/S. It seems like you have an axe to grind about a specific event involving a NWA pilot. Were YOU denied the J/S?

The problem is that you guys have a couple of pilots who are "on a mission" to deny AirTran pilots the jumpseat. Five times in twelve months is not a fluke.

Since there has been no formal policy change, the problem is a FEW INDIVIDUAL pilots. Do you have specific flight numbers & dates? If so, your J/S coordinator should be contacted to resolve the problem with the INDIVIDUAL NWA pilot or pilots.

But it's becoming clear that some NWA guys haven't grasped the situation, and have come very close to losing j/s privileges with AirTran.

Exactly.....SOME pilots....a few....not the entire NWA pilot group is involved here. When offline pilots show up for the J/S, everyone I know treats them with courtesy & respect. I would follow the proper channels to report this alleged abuse. Let the J/S comittees find a solution. If we lose the Airtran J/S, that's a decision they will have to make.

 

[Ty Webb]

Actually, I have the employee name and seniority number of the most recent one. Want it?

When we rarely get a single complaint of a "denied jumpseat", but we have 5 of them . . . all from NWA, well, you don;t need a weatherman to tell you which way the wind is blowing (or sucking).

 

[a320drivr]

As a JB pilot who commutes exclusively on NWA I will admit I get a rash of you know what about every third time I commute. Not much I can do but take it if I want a ride home. It seems to be the DC9 guys. The 757 and A320 guys are great as are the LGA gate agents. What do I get crap about?
1. not being ALPA
2. B6 is whoring the industry with our pay (too bad they have no idea what we make)
3. not having a standard pension
4. letting other carriers FA's ride
4. etc

 

[furloughed dude]

NWA is a very unionized carrier. Air tran has the reputation for being a scab carrier, and that is because of some of the older guys who are Eastern scabs. NWA has alot of ex-Eastern people. Not saying it's fair, and most don't think that way.

As far as pay goes, I don't think Air Tran's pay is as good as NWA. DC-9 captain pay goes from 175 (1st year) to 190 (12th year).

Jumpseat privileges are reciprocal, and obviously if Air Tran doesn't reciprocate, then NWA stops as well. I think it would hurt Air Tran more than NWA due to size of networks.

Bottom line, we all have worked with a$$holes, these are isolated incidents. Let it slide... It screws over the masses because of a few bad experiences...

 

[Ty Webb]

Yeah . . . maybe to someone who is still living in the 1990's.

We will officially be a major this year, with over 1000 pilots . . . the vast majority of whom were hired long after the merger. The last DC9 has left, the 737's start showing up in a couple of months, and we will be negotiating our next contract. Life is good here.

As far as pay goes, I don't think Air Tran's pay is as good as NWA. DC-9 captain pay goes from 175 (1st year) to 190 (12th year).

No, you're right. Our pay isn't as good as NWA, yet. On the other hand, we don't have any pilots working at Home Depot, and our upgrade should be running around 2 years, once the 14 planes we a re getting this year start showing up.

Jumpseat privileges are reciprocal, and obviously if Air Tran doesn't reciprocate, then NWA stops as well. I think it would hurt Air Tran more than NWA due to size of networks.

I don't think so, not by a long shot. I would estimate that well over half of our pilots live in either ATL or MCO, and only a few of the commuters come from a place not served by us. I have never jumpseated on a NWA carrier . . . never saw the need to.

Bottom line, we all have worked with a$$holes, these are isolated incidents.

That's the point of this whole string, guy. It is not an isolated incident at NWA- copy?

 

[g159av8tor]

I think it would hurt Air Tran more than NWA

I agree.

Even if half of Valu... er... AirTran's pilots live in base, I speculate that a lot more of your people are using NWA jumpseats than the reciprocal.

 

[320AV8R]

Actually, I have the employee name and seniority number of the most recent one. Want it?

Ty-

I'm trying to contact our ALPA J/S coordinator. Either I'll pass the info to him, or you two can contact each other.

I'll let you know.

 

[Ty Webb]

Oh, really?

Well, please do tell us what particular piece of wisdom you are basing that on . . . . . because, geez, I probably only know about a third of our pilots, but from that sample, I only met three who commute off line.

Two from SEA, but one of them has moved to ATL . . . .
One from Maine.
One from Paris

Gee, that leaves a whopping three pilots I have met in my two and a half years here who have an off-line commute.

I would venture to guess that we probably have less than 20 pilots systemwide who commute from a non-AirTran served city.

And the rest ten to live in ATL, MCO, or commute from one of the 45 cities we serve.

But, hey, you know better than me, right?

 

[320AV8R]

Ty-

Our J/S coordinator wants you to contact him.

I'll send you the details.

 

[atafan]

While you guys duke it out......

A Public Service Announcements

ATA will take all Part 135 and 121 pilots, as many open seats we have in the back.

Never a charge, and we are happy to do it!

I know that we have always been in this together....

ATA - Doing more with less for over 30 years.

 

[atldc9]

First of all, let's not forget that right up until Ty Webb gets elected to the union BOD, HE DOESN'T SPEAK FOR THE AIRTRAN pilot group. This is the wrong forum to start making claims like this.

Second of all, there are a lot of AirTran pilots that commute offline, and are VERY appreciative for the rides we get. Thanks to everyone who gives those rides to us.

I have not met any other Captains at AirTran that like the $25 second jumpseat fee, but it is reality, and we have to live with it. It is still better then the deal Delta gives. Anyone who has ever been left at the gate when there were seats available knows what I mean. It sucks, and being able to pay $25 to go would have been great. Are we actively trying to restore our unlimited free jumpseates, heck yeah, but it is a long process.

Finally, if you want a ride on us, I'll take you. Hopefully you'll be the first jumpseater there, and we'll have seats available.

 

[Flying Freddie]

I thought the unlimited jumpseat was part of the last contract. If this is so, why wasn't this grieved?

 

[g159av8tor]

Will someone PLEASE log me out of the IAD Holiday Inn Express computer...not my remarks.
Tailwinds...


__________________

 

[Ty Webb]

I thought the unlimited jumpseat was part of the last contract. If this is so, why wasn't this grieved?

No. Freddie, it's not, or it sure would be grieved.

Many pilots are calling for it to be included in the next one. As you know, everything you "get" in contract talks "costs" you something else, but most of us will work to get it anyway.

 

[Steeler Fan]

ATLDC9 obviously commutes too!

I have ridden on Airtrans a couple of times and was even the second or third Jumseater and was not charged. BUT! if they are charging 25.00 for 2nd and up off line jumps, then I do have a problem. I know that we at ASA carry a whole bunch of them to and from ATL. All of them very polite and professional, but they need to get the charge taken off.
Just my .05 cents. [/B]

Like ATLDC9 said, getting stranded stinks! AirTran's policy is pretty good, and it doesn't strand pilots at the gate while the airplane leaves with open seats...

I know people blast AirTran's jumpseat policy, but it's way better than Delta and AMR...

I view it as one free offline jumpseater, and for everyone else a $25 ID-90 (maybe).

Even this $25 charge is not something our pilot group is extremely proud of (and I think our union's trying to change this).

I've already been stranded by American attempting to go from STL to ORD (one offline jumpseater went, and I watched the plane leave with 40 open seats--bummer). At least this doesn't happen at AirTran...


Let me say this, I do wholeheartedly believe the jumpseat is a professional courtesy, that we should extend as often as possible to COURTEOUS PROFESSIONALS. I used to jumpseat a lot on TWA, and I always had an extra ID-90 in my possession, just in case.

For now, have an extra $25 in your wallet, and hopefully, you'll never get charged.


What's really funny here is that some will spend this energy attacking AirTran's J/S policy, but I don't see people here calling for DELTA and AMR to change theirs...

BTW, thanks ATA for unlimited...AWESOME!!!

 

[flx757]

Re: Interesting

All of them very polite and professional, but they need to get the charge taken off.

Being a former AirTran pilot, I KNOW none of the pilots are happy about this policy, and are doing all they can about it.

But for you to make the blanket statement..."they NEED to get the charge taken off", shows you know very little about the situation. It wasn't the pilots who put the "charge" on in the first place, so it's not so simple to just "get the charge taken off". This is a policy that was implemented by AirTran's management, and will have to be negotiated away with the next contract. Then the AirTran pilots will decide how badly they "need" to get this charge removed by seeing what they will have to give up in return. But, believe me...they take this issue very seriously, and will be doing all they can. However, you need to understand it isn't their doing in the first place, and most Captains go out of their way to help other airline pilots trying to use AirTran's jumpseat.

Of course, if you don't like the policy, there are other carriers from whom you can choose.

 

[IAHERJ]

To the ASA pilot who made the comments about our J/s policy:

I use ASA and Delta a lot on my commute. I appreciate the unlimited ASA jumpseats. Were you working at ASA in the mid 90's? I remember carrying many ASA pilots in my COEX days to work when ASA had no jumpseat at all and neither did Delta. No offline jumpseaters at all and most carriers let you guys ride on their jumpseats. I bring this up only to educate you on the history of various carriers and jumpseat policies. They change often as we have all seen. I hope ours changes for the better at AirTran and I think it will. I've heard that discussions have taken place on a very high level however in an informal way about this charge. I've watched 4 Delta planes with seats open leave me on my commute in the last 12 months when I would have been greatful to shell out 25.00 for a seat home. Not complaining because it is just the policy.

If all pilots had their way all seats would be jumpseats and they would all be free etc. but we don't control those issues directly. We negotiate with our companies for the policies and I'll assure you that the pilots at AirTran are working on improving our policy.

Thanks
IAHERJ

 

[dA-RoCk]

We've had a few air tran guys on a couple of our flights in the past. Solid group of guys over there... Your right Delta/AMR jumpseat policy blows fat donkey D!ck.. I commuted from IAD-STL for almost 2yrs on AMR/EX-TWA'ers. The Twa guys were the beSt. They never left a pilot trying to get home after a long trip, even if they had seats in back ( i.e reguardless of policy).

I think air trans policy is not the bad, at least you have options, and that's a good thing when commutting. I guess my point is we should all take care of each other. On the line and off the line.

Dela/AMR need to get there sh!t together on this issue. This one for one sh!t is for the birds, and it leaves alot of pilot's hanging in the wind and that just aint f!ckn cool....

All jumpseats seaters are welcome on our flights, that is until we fill it up.


RoCk

 

[Beerme]

No, you're right. Our pay isn't as good as NWA, yet. On the other hand, we don't have any pilots working at Home Depot, and our upgrade should be running around 2 years, once the 14 planes we a re getting this year start showing up.

Do you even think about what your saying before writing it? Your actually bragging about being lower paid! Unbelievable! That's whats wrong with the industry...guys like you who are proud of being low paid slaves just to upgrade in 2 years and brag at your high school reunion how your now a "real, honest to god airline pilot!"...who just happens to make half what a REAL airline pilot makes. PLEASE!!! Grow the **CENSORED****CENSORED****CENSORED****CENSORED** up!

That's the point of this whole string, guy. It is not an isolated incident at NWA- copy?

I used to welcome all JB and Air Tran J/S, but after reading this post, I might change my mind.
Bring it on!

 

[Ty Webb]

There's nothing to "bring on". You're an idiot with a comprehension problem. The only thing you are likely to "bring on" is a headache.

My post doesn't brag about being paid less, it says that is true we are paid less than NWA pilots . . . . big surprise.

We are a smaller airline, on our second contract. We have made great strides. We will continue to make more.

At least we can read.

 

[UAL'01]

I was recently charged $ 25 on a Jet Blue jumpseat. I was the first and only jumpseat on that flight. A crew on a previous flight told me that I could input all my data for the jumpseat over the phone, which I did, however because of that I was charged the $25. Lesson learned: just walk up to the gate.

I also have heard rumors that AirTran's union is working with management to remove the $25 charge for carriers that allow unlimited jumpseats and keep it in place for the other ones.....just a rumor so far.

The JB guys and girls I met were great , very friendly and truely professional...unlike some people on this board.

 

[Ty Webb]

Rumor is that the Company is considering offering unlimited jumpseat to those that offer it to us . . .

 

[Prof. Joe Vee]

There's nothing to "bring on". You're an idiot with a comprehension problem. The only thing you are likely to "bring on" is a headache.

My post doesn't brag about being paid less, it says that is true we are paid less than NWA pilots . . . . big surprise.

We are a smaller airline, on our second contract. We have made great strides. We will continue to make more.

At least we can read.

Feeling a little unstable today Ty?

Professor Joe Vee
Aerologist

 

[320AV8R]

My post doesn't brag about being paid less, it says that is true we are paid less than NWA pilots . . . . big surprise.

Ty-

That's how it stands today. But we are in Contract negotiations, & our pay could be much lower when the process is finished!!

 

[Capn Mike]

"I know that the policy says the first J/S is free, but I've heard too many stories of the only J/S getting charged.

Yeah? You really believe that, huh? Sounds to me like you WANT to believe it, but I doubt it happened. The ONLY way it could happen is if the guy who bought the pass didn't introduce himself to the Capt. on the way to his seat, because if he told the Capt. he was riding on a pass, the Captain would have cleared it up- period."


Ty,
I was charged the $28 (25 plus 3 for tax) last fall out of LGA when I was the only jumpseater. When I asked the agent if I was the only jumpseater after she requested the money she responded that I was and needed to pay if I wanted on the flight. When I boarded, I introduced myself to the Captain and made my usual request for the JS without mention of the $$ since I thought that was what was expected.

So to say that it doesn't happen is a very bold statement.

I welcome as many jumpseaters on my aircraft as there are open seats for without needing to charge for the benefit. I haven't even asked the AAI guys if they paid the $25 to the agent but maybe I should. ( In a joking manner of course)

Mike

 

[Ty Webb]

Apparently there was a problem in LGA. I am sorry to hear of it.

Don't know if you read all the posts in this string, but I did say that I saw this happen one other time out of LGA, and when the pilot mentioned it to us, we took a delay to fix it.

I hope this never happens to you again, but if it does, please make sure to let us know what is going on. I realize this puts you in a little bit of an uncomfortable situation, but we can't do anything if we don't know about it.

Regards,

TW

 

[DCitrus9]

got cash?

As an aside to the jumpseat fee: If anyone has experience being charged CASH for the 2nd jumpseat, this is not acceptable and I would love to have details of it. Any such occurences are strong grounds for removing the fee altogether. PM me if this has happened to you.

 

[~~~^~~~]

Strange to read threads where so many First Officers argue about J/S policy. Heck, the gate handles most J/S requests since offline pilots have to be issued a ticket and ride in the back anyway. As a Captain, I sometimes don't even know if the gate has put a J/S on the aircraft and if they have a problem it always seems to pop up 10 seconds before pushback and who wants to delay 69 other revenue passengers for a J/S dispute.

If the thread is about AirTran pilots being great guys and NW and DAL guys being arrogant, well, is that news? Everyone is nice when they want my jumpseat and AirTran is nice when I have wanted their jumpseat. My experience is that Delta's Captains are generally pleasant in order of seniority. The more senior, the better and Northwest, who wants to go where they fly? The weather stinks up there!