NWA answer to pending strike of FA's

[NuGuy]

All employee's should be recalled by the end of this year possibly a little into 2007. Pilot interviewing off the street is going to start soon after.

Our local poster from a cubical on the 3rd floor of NATCO is not telling the whole story.

1) No body is comming back from recall. The acceptance rate is now down in the low teens. Managament has been forced to issue "short notice recalls" because no one wants to come back to work.

2) The rate of sick and fatigue calls with the FAs has apparently gone throught the roof, thus the recall of the FAs.

3) Thanks to a quirk in the pilot's contract, most people now out on furlough can remain so if they desire, so the company will be forced to hire off the street, despite what will probably amount to 600 pilots on voluntary furlough. These pilots are doing the smart thing, and waiting until there's a bunch of newbies under them to come back.

Nu

 

[xjhawk]

hell, if i were a mesaba or pinnacle flight attendant..i would apply, its like more pay, better benefits, and what the he!!, they are already putting up with NWA and crappy management.

 

[Lear70]

The question is....Who in their right mind still wants to work there? In the next two years most airlines will be hiring again. So why would anybody want to work under this brutal mgmt team and subject themselves to a career with such intense unrest?

Just about any regional guy would be happy to turn over his Mesa or Freedom I.D. for a NWA badge. Their management is on the same plan of abuse, it'd just be a different name and an eventual pay raise, sad as that may be.

I myself used to want to work for NWA, however after seeing first hand how they do business ( i use this term loosely). I want to stay as far from anything with red paint on it as I can.

Absolutely. I'm expecting very few, if ANY, of the pilot furloughees to want to come back until there's so many people junior to them they won't have to sit reserve.

There's no way people from the airlines like Spirit, Champion, airTran, Frontier, etc who, in days past, would have left a nice left seat job at those carriers to jump to a major, will EVER apply to the likes of NWA, not to mention DAL or USAirways under the new contracts. They're just better off staying where they are or going to CAL / FDX / UPS / SWA.

Good luck to you all
Schmitty

Yeah, good luck to ALL of us,,, "Boy did I pick the wrong era to become a pilot".

 

[YourPilotFriend]

There are a lot of people who will apply to NWA, in fcat I believe everyone in the regionals probably will, even the ones that say they won't. Also compass will be hiring street captains as that company doesn't have any staff. Also the current NWA mainline has a high rate of sttrition with pilots leaving for FedEx, UPS, or for a foriegn contract. They are expanding the south american routes with a need for hundreds of additional pilots ontop of the furloughees, retirees, and the rate of attrition. Personally I expect if NWa emerges from bankruptcy with the pension intact we will see at least 1500 pilots leave immediately. Since the difference between their pension and expected income could be supplemented by working part time at a super market and they would be home every night. So any regional airline pilot would be smart to go to NWA next year since by 2010 they will make captain.

 

[YourPilotFriend]

Also NWa may provide better job security as its cost of operations is almost less than that of SWA. By the end of this year NWA will have a lower cost of operation than any current LCC so it should stabilize a little bit.

Edit: I left a whole bunch of stuff out. So not to get flamed I have to explain. NWA has an AVERAGE CASM of 10.99 cents a mile and SWA has a SINGLE CASM of 8.05 cents a mile. Actually, when the fuel hedges run out SWA is about 30% higher in cost. The competing seat on NWA which is a domestic economy ticket actually has the same CASM as SWA. SWA sells only one seat a domestic economy ticket. NWA has domestic economy and First class; International economy and business class; regional economy and first class. When you average all of those together you get a cost of operation significantly higher than the CASM at SWA. However, you have to look at the CASM for the competing seat to have a valid comparison. When you look at it from that standpoint, my arguement is very valid.

 

[Lear70]

There are a lot of people who will apply to NWA, in fcat I believe everyone in the regionals probably will, even the ones that say they won't. Also compass will be hiring street captains as that company doesn't have any staff. Also the current NWA mainline has a high rate of sttrition with pilots leaving for FedEx, UPS, or for a foriegn contract. They are expanding the south american routes with a need for hundreds of additional pilots ontop of the furloughees, retirees, and the rate of attrition. Personally I expect if NWa emerges from bankruptcy with the pension intact we will see at least 1500 pilots leave immediately. Since the difference between their pension and expected income could be supplemented by working part time at a super market and they would be home every night. So any regional airline pilot would be smart to go to NWA next year since by 2010 they will make captain.

Umm.... isn't that what I just got through saying?

Holy crap, we agree on something.

A great place to go if you're a regional pilot. If you're anywhere else, stay put, it sucks to be a red-tail employee.

 

[JAM-BRO]

You're right.

The pilots demonstrated that by their wimpering beating, corrupt infighting and ultimate embarrasment.

The mechanics..............well what can be said there, except simply THE embarrassmnet of the industry.

The management................yep, DEFINATELY all about me.

The F/A's who are being expected to work for almost literally peanuts are the ONLY work group there left with self respect.

Hopefully, they won't walk quietly into the gaschamber.

It's that Litterbox's last hope.

I say to them........shovel out those pilot and mechanic turds and clean the sand !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

EagleFly

You seem so smart... When I grow up I wanna be like you!!!

 

[eaglefly]

Also NWa may provide better job security as its cost of operations is almost less than that of SWA. By the end of this year NWA will have a lower cost of operation than any current LCC so it should stabilize a little bit.

Edit: I left a whole bunch of stuff out. So not to get flamed I have to explain. NWA has an AVERAGE CASM of 10.99 cents a mile and SWA has a SINGLE CASM of 8.05 cents a mile. Actually, when the fuel hedges run out SWA is about 30% higher in cost. The competing seat on NWA which is a domestic economy ticket actually has the same CASM as SWA. SWA sells only one seat a domestic economy ticket. NWA has domestic economy and First class; International economy and business class; regional economy and first class. When you average all of those together you get a cost of operation significantly higher than the CASM at SWA. However, you have to look at the CASM for the competing seat to have a valid comparison. When you look at it from that standpoint, my arguement is very valid.

**************MANAGEMENT PILOT ALERT!!!!!!!!!!!*****************

 

[Fly4hire]

**************MANAGEMENT PILOT ALERT!!!!!!!!!!!*****************

I don't know why I bother......only negativity, doom and gloom, and anonymous flaming are welcome here.....

.....yes, NWA got slammed hard, and is a shadow of the former place it was to work. That said it is still better than ANY regional, ANY 121 Supplemental, and anything other than perhaps FDX, UPS if are young enough (and if you don't mind the schedule and no pass privlidges) and SWA (if you don't mind the kind of flying for the rest of your life). AA is going to get hit hard, and CAL while perhaps a happier place to work has no better total benefits. U/AWA had lower pay and benefits before we even took the cuts. JB and AirTran are going to be the next Peoples Express and Western Pacific. The Fracs are the JB of corporate aviation, and I'll never schlep another rich guys bag, empty their feces from the head, or eat their left over catering again.

Except for the 3 aforementioned, every other job in the aviation industry is worse than what NWA has to offer. They have the best long term outlook in the industry, and I'll bet 5 yrs from now will be THE carrier everyone wants to get on with.

I have to truly laugh when I hear indignant RJ pilots talk about how they would never apply at NWA. Please, pass all your names so we can make sure not even to waste the paper on sending you an application.

YourPilotFriend has a lot of the details correct, and I agree with a lot of his assessments of the future staffing and upgrade scenarios there. Yeah the pay sucks and will for a while. Please enjoy your much better RJ career, or driving a cab that I hear is so much better a living......

 

[canyonblue]

Also NWa may provide better job security as its cost of operations is almost less than that of SWA. By the end of this year NWA will have a lower cost of operation than any current LCC so it should stabilize a little bit.

So based on your logic, your costs will never rise above where they are now. That means pilot pay will not ever increase at Northwest. You must be a Management pilot to hope for that scenario.

 

[FlyBoeingJets]

compass will be hiring street captains as that company doesn't have any staff.

NWA has an AVERAGE CASM of 10.99 cents a mile and SWA has a SINGLE CASM of 8.05 cents a mile. Actually, when the fuel hedges run out SWA is about 30% higher in cost. The competing seat on NWA which is a domestic economy ticket actually has the same CASM as SWA. SWA sells only one seat a domestic economy ticket. NWA has domestic economy and First class;

When you average all of those together you get a cost of operation significantly higher than the CASM at SWA. However, you have to look at the CASM for the competing seat to have a valid comparison. When you look at it from that standpoint, my arguement is very valid.

They are expanding the south american routes with a need for hundreds of additional pilots ontop of the furloughees, retirees, and the rate of attrition.

So any regional airline pilot would be smart to go to NWA next year since by 2010 they will make captain.

Naysayers beware! This may be spot on. Remember how CAL looked RIGHT after 9/11? Well, it looked real bad... But recently they have been hiring like gangbusters and newhires are looking at 4 year upgrades to Narrow Body Captain. They came close to a liquidity crisis, but escaped it.

We also all thought USAir and probably UAL would be oughta business. Now both look very solid.

As bad as it has looked for NWA, and DAL, it looks they are pulling out of the dive. Just like every other major in trouble since 9/11.

Slightly off Topic--The Delta boys are now optimistic about their return (Those with higher paying jobs that won't be going back to aviation) They're chief concern is whether they will be the lead group in the merger they assume will happen. If NWA is lead it will look brilliant to have stayed. The flip side is the possibility of further fleet reductions in a merger.

As far as costs being LESS than SWA. I'm going to have to see some numbers on that. Airtran is the one to beat on costs after hedges get less helpful. Compass will put a low cost option into the mix. But mainline NWA has some work to do. Debt, training costs (too many fleet types), more employees per airplane (again due to many fleet types, hub turn times decreasing employee/aircraft utilization) and less efficient scheduling will make that a target that hasn't been met....yet. But it doesn't have to be less than SWA's. If it is close enough, it will keep NWA going and will allow growth. I don't know what that number will be but that one may be met.

Good point on the first class seats. Are they getting filled? If not they are actually dragging down the revenue, not increasing it. That said the real point is whether the RASM will stay above the CASM. I look forward to the upcoming quarterly reports.

 

[YourPilotFriend]

So based on your logic, your costs will never rise above where they are now. That means pilot pay will not ever increase at Northwest. You must be a Management pilot to hope for that scenario.

Do you know what a SWA pilot would be making if they still had a regulation RPM/CASM spread? I think the last time I sat down and figured it out it was like over $1400 an hour for the most senior captain. SWA was an absolute joke of a carrier to go to compared to the legacies of old; which doesn't say much for the legacies of now.

No, pilot pay will not increase at NWA, at least not anytime soon. To compete with and stay an LCC, employee cost structure must remain low. The variety of services offered can never create a low enough cost structure to compete with an LCC if employee costs go up. In fact employee cost is actually going to lower when the senior people jump ship. NWA has about a 9% margin at the moment, and when they emerge from bankruptcy they will stabilize their cost structure and lower fares to increase load factors. That's why everyone is throwing money at NWA without a emergence plan or settled contracts.

 

[The Regulator]

The question is....Who in their right mind still wants to work there? In the next two years most airlines will be hiring again. So why would anybody want to work under this brutal mgmt team and subject themselves to a career with such intense unrest?

I myself used to want to work for NWA, however after seeing first hand how they do business ( i use this term loosely). I want to stay as far from anything with red paint on it as I can.

Good luck to you all
Schmitty

I agree, I was hired at NWA a few months before 9/11 and never ended up going. I now thank god I never ended up at that company. I would leave aviation and go find some other line of work before I went to that disaster of a company.

I count myself lucky that I am currently flying for a major that is doing great and that treats its pilots fairly well.

 

[accinelli]

NWA will never be "THE CARRIER" to work for. Unless of course they get rid of every flight attendant they have, followed by majority of the gate agents and top it off by shutting down DTW and MEM (probably the worst hubs in the history of commercial aviation) and half of their &^*7 for brains -- pilots. Do that and then they might possibly have a chance.

 

[xjlifer]

NWA will never be "THE CARRIER" to work for. Unless of course they get rid of every flight attendant they have, followed by majority of the gate agents and top it off by shutting down DTW and MEM (probably the worst hubs in the history of commercial aviation) and half of their &^*7 for brains -- pilots. Do that and then they might possibly have a chance.

Don't sit on the fence...tell us how you really feel.