NTSB also looking at pilot compensation!

[Andy Neill]

....but then we would have newhires flying at an airline to airline transport pilot standards.....hmmmmm

 

[Superpilot92]

....but then we would have newhires flying at an airline to airline transport pilot standards.....hmmmmm

Scary huh!! !

 

[blesko]

Or as NEDude suggested, as long as they meet the ATP experience requirements, the airline could issue them an ATP at the completion of newhire training.

great idea, but the airline can't do that as the ATP is a PIC evaluated checkride. As the new hire is going through an SIC eval, this does not meet the requirements of the checkride.

 

[NEDude]

Again, the point is raising the bar. You are increasing the steps and time required to go from being a guy with some money and a dream to being in the cockpit of an airliner with passengers. A lot can happen between 250 hours and 1500 hours. Not only is experienced gained, but that time will also "weed out" a lot more people who maybe don't have the aptitude for this.

No plan will be full proof. But you need to start somewhere, and requiring airline pilots to show they can fly to airline transport pilot standards and have airline transport pilot flight time, is a good place to start.

 

[NEDude]

great idea, but the airline can't do that as the ATP is a PIC evaluated checkride. As the new hire is going through an SIC eval, this does not meet the requirements of the checkride.

It could be incorporated into the new-hire training program. Or the airline could require a person have it before they come to work. Either way it doesn't matter. We are talking about raising the bar here, the point is that it will be harder to make it into the cockpit of an airliner.

 

[Cardinal]

great idea, but the airline can't do that as the ATP is a PIC evaluated checkride. As the new hire is going through an SIC eval, this does not meet the requirements of the checkride.

So throw them in whatever seat and give them a type ride. All the better. Maybe then I'd have FO's who could tell me what a pack does, and how the cabin is pressurized...just for starters.

 

[StarHustler]

Are you serious?

Yes, as a matter of fact, I'm DEAD serious.

 

[LazyLightnin']

wow! A thread on fi with productive , intelligent posts! I like.


What, does mesa not suck anymore?

 

[exagony]

that'll put Mesa outta bx though - just had to throw a Mesa jab because this thread has gone way to long with out one!!

 

[Volasl]

As a former check airman at a regional the best student I trained had less that 400 hours on day one of IOE. The worst had over 2500 hours of flight time and an ATP.

Total time is not always the best indicator. Its the quality of the flight time. I do believe a mininum should exist which would hopefully raise the bar with pay. Econ 101 fewer ATP's equal higher demand for their services. Works with oil right?

 

[DX Rick]

The media, NTSB and public will care about this for about 2 more weeks. Once the hearings are over with, they will care less, once again.
If the passengers keep their round trip airfare for $99, that's all they really care about.

 

[jetjock6]

The media, NTSB and public will care about this for about 2 more weeks. Once the hearings are over with, they will care less, once again.
If the passengers keep their round trip airfare for $99, that's all they really care about.

Unfortunately, I think you are correct. Passengers will pound their chest and demand change right up to the point that it cost them money. As consumers, we are our own worst enemy.

 

[LazyLightnin']

The media, NTSB and public will care about this for about 2 more weeks. Once the hearings are over with, they will care less, once again.
If the passengers keep their round trip airfare for $99, that's all they really care about.

Yup. Or until the media finds another story to exploit.

 

[AC560]

Not with 250 hours, it isn't.

Your right then it is two weekends, 1 Bic pen, and $2500.

The problem really boils down to DPE's. As long as a guy can go out and give a bunch a check rides everyday for $400 people who shouldn't have a license to live will be licensed to fly.

Eliminate the DPE program, hire an abudance of FAA check airmen, and make every checkride (91/135/121) with an FAA examiner.

 

[flyer172r]

I got my first airline job with 800 hours, got through training no problem, then had no idea what I was doing when I got on the line. I think an ATP for all part 121 pilots is a solid idea. It won't fix everything, but it's a good start and a worthwhile requirement.

 

[GSXR600]

The media, NTSB and public will care about this for about 2 more weeks. Once the hearings are over with, they will care less, once again.
If the passengers keep their round trip airfare for $99, that's all they really care about.

Agreed 100%.

 

[Rez O. Lewshun]

Going for ATP standards will help, but how much.... dedicated pilots will have to 'pay their dues' in part 91 and part 135 operators till they get enough time. Contracts of coersion will start increase. Less dedicated pilots will drop out....

In the meantime, the MPL scheme is still coming towards reality. This will solidfy the puppy farms..

It seems that the economics of pay is the biggest motivator. More competiton for jobs, will attract the best qualified. How will govt or industry basically tell airlines to pay more, when airlines retort... the market is king and says we don't have too...

So the training will change either on paper or actually and the pay won't.

 

[jonjuan]

The media, NTSB and public will care about this for about 2 more weeks. Once the hearings are over with, they will care less, once again.
If the passengers keep their round trip airfare for $99, that's all they really care about.

WTF? When did JetBlue raise it's RT fares from $69? BS, I say...

 

[EdAtTheAirport]

I like the idea of doubling the hour requirement for the ATP to 3000 hours, and requiring any FO for a 121 passenger carrier to meet the requirements of 135.243 c (135 IFR, i.e., 1200 hours).

You guys are correct that this would "weed out" the trust fund babies who aren't serious about this profession, and would have an enormous effect on wages. Everybody here should be writing a letter to their Congress person THIS WEEK! LIKE TODAY!!! Git on it!

 

[Erlanger]

You can always sell paint at Home Depot and make more money.

from the article below;

Before passengers fret crews' salaries, they might question how much they are willing to pay. The two are connected, say airline executives and pilots. "People will spend three hours on the Internet to save $8," says Arne Haak, vice-president for finance at AirTran Airways. "You know this! You do it yourself."

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/30809955/