Not Paying Union Dues

[merlindrvr88]

When?

Then when the union negitiates a better contract at your airline, I hope you'll gladly demur on accepting any increase in compensation/QOL.

Name the last time that happened?????

 

[PCL_128]

Name the last time that happened?????

You can't possibly be that dense. FedEx just signed an excellent contract with the help of ALPA. UPS just signed a great contract also with representation provided by the IPA with assistance from ALPA. That's two new contracts signed within the last 6 months that were vast improvements over the previous CBAs. Does that answer your question, smart guy?

 

[Rez O. Lewshun]

There are too many "professional" pilots that expect the profession to serve them.... The mentality of "how can I make this profession better" doesn't exist in thier minds....

 

[CopilotDoug]

You can't possibly be that dense. FedEx just signed an excellent contract with the help of ALPA. UPS just signed a great contract also with representation provided by the IPA with assistance from ALPA. That's two new contracts signed within the last 6 months that were vast improvements over the previous CBAs. Does that answer your question, smart guy?

While that's all fine and well for UPS and FedEx (who couldn't be more different than the airlines), what about the Regionals/majors where the Majority of airline pilots are going to be spending their careers? The fact of the matter is that ALPA is not as influential as they'd have you believe. It is my contention that ALPA is nothing more than a greedy business in it for the money. Their dues sytem should be modified so that pilots only have to pay dues if they receive a pay raise. No raise, tough sh!t ALPA.

 

[Rez O. Lewshun]

While that's all fine and well for UPS and FedEx (who couldn't be more different than the airlines), what about the Regionals/majors where the Majority of airline pilots are going to be spending their careers? The fact of the matter is that ALPA is not as influential as they'd have you believe. It is my contention that ALPA is nothing more than a greedy business in it for the money. Their dues sytem should be modified so that pilots only have to pay dues if they receive a pay raise. No raise, tough sh!t ALPA.

have you considered your expectations of what ALPA is, is not realisitic?

What did you think of the ALPA negotiated UAL2000 and DAL2001 contracts?

Your last comments about dues is like civil taxes for Police and Fire. As crime and fire plaque your town, you state.. until you get this crime and fire under control we aren't going to give you operating cash....

If ALPA, specifically is a greedy business, where is all of their money going? (if you are determined to say salaries then plaese do a search on this message board and get informed before you do.... education is a good thing.)

 

[GogglesPisano]

Name the last time that happened?????

The latest FedEx, SWA, and UPS contracts. World got a pay raise, too (after a strike.)

 

[CopilotDoug]

have you considered your expectations of what ALPA is, is not realisitic?

What did you think of the ALPA negotiated UAL2000 and DAL2001 contracts?

If your going to credit those contracts to ALPA you better also credit the aftermath to ALPA as well. ALPA's "success" at an airline is tied to the financial success of said airline, nothing more, nothing less (see FedEx, UPS, SWA ((which also happens to be SWAPA)) )

Your last comments about dues is like civil taxes for Police and Fire. As crime and fire plaque your town, you state.. until you get this crime and fire under control we aren't going to give you operating cash....

The reason for ALPA being born was Safety. That issue has been addressed, and continual refinements are being made. Tell me what "Crimes and Fires" are plaguing airlines today that necessitate ALPA's existence? Skywest doesn't seem to need ALPA and they're doing pretty well.

If ALPA, specifically is a greedy business, where is all of their money going? (if you are determined to say salaries then plaese do a search on this message board and get informed before you do.... education is a good thing.)

Well Martha Stewart, I know you're going to tell me it's NOT going to salaries. It's probably going to the ALPA stickers and Mousepads which are being handed out at groundschools. I'd like you to justify why Woerth receives over half a million dollars in annual compensation? Where does that salary money come from again?

 

[PCL_128]

ALPA's "success" at an airline is tied to the financial success of said airline)

Sorry, but I've gotta call bull$hit on that one. Do you really think that the pilots of DAL and UAL would have received such vast improvements in pay and benefits in contract '00 and '01 if it weren't for ALPA. Do you think UAL an DAL management would have simply given it to them out of the goodness of their hearts (hint: they don't have any)? If it weren't for ALPA fighting for the pilots at those airlines, then the billions in profits wouldn't have ever filtered down to the employees. It would have gone into even bigger bonuses for the executives, stock buy-back plans, more consultants to dream up faulty merger plans, etc... Management will never give you anything unless you fight for it, no matter how much financial success the company is enjoying.

The reason for ALPA being born was Safety. That issue has been addressed, and continual refinements are being made. Tell me what "Crimes and Fires" are plaguing airlines today that necessitate ALPA's existence?

Are you even a pilot? Pilot pushing is alive and well in this industry. I represent pilots every week that management has tried to pressure into flying unsafe airplanes, flying fatigued, flying sick, etc... Without ALPA representation and protection, pilots would still be getting fired for these things. The reason it doesn't happen on a large scale at Skywest is because management is extremely motivated to keep ALPA off of the property. They know that they'll never be able to get away with their 1% pay raises after a union shows up.

I'd like you to justify why Woerth receives over half a million dollars in annual compensation?

Get a clue. Captain Woerth never received a salary that even approached that much money. His salary was approximately $350k. The rest of the money you see listed on the anti-union sites comes from expenses. In other words, they're counting his meals, hotel rooms, taxi rides, etc... as income. How much more would your salary be if I included all of your hotel stays, training expenses, etc... in the mix? Just your benefits add an additional 30% on top of your salary. Do you consider that to be income? I didn't think so.

 

[CopilotDoug]

Sorry, but I've gotta call bull$hit on that one.

And how many industry leading contracts since then has ALPA wrestled out of management? What are ALPA's thoughts on the record setting givebacks?

Are you even a pilot? Pilot pushing is alive and well in this industry. I represent pilots every week that management has tried to pressure into flying unsafe airplanes, flying fatigued, flying sick, etc... Without ALPA representation and protection, pilots would still be getting fired for these things.

I've seen, up-close, 4 cases of ALPA style representation which I believe to be indicative of ALPA representation across the board. I need no further proof that ALPA is a bloated and inefficient union. And in one of those cases, resolution was found in the form of an AOPA attorney because the ALPA attorney "didn't have the time."

The reason it doesn't happen on a large scale at Skywest is because management is extremely motivated to keep ALPA off of the property. They know that they'll never be able to get away with their 1% pay raises after a union shows up.

I think the pilots are are the ones motivated to keep ALPA off property. And wisely so.

Get a clue. Captain Woerth never received a salary that even approached that much money. His salary was approximately $350k. The rest of the money you see listed on the anti-union sites comes from expenses. In other words, they're counting his meals, hotel rooms, taxi rides, etc... as income. How much more would your salary be if I included all of your hotel stays, training expenses, etc... in the mix? Just your benefits add an additional 30% on top of your salary. Do you consider that to be income? I didn't think so.

Did you read what I said? I used the term COMPENSATION and not SALARY for the very reasons you pointed out. My salary would be a whole lot more than 30 extra percent if I received the expenses he did. After all, he's sticking up for the pilots. I bet he stays in Super 8 motels, eats Ramen noodles at every meal, and takes the taxi cab with the really bad transmission too, just so he can stay in touch with the real pilot's lifestyle. I can't believe you'd elect such a pompous and pretentious a$$hole like him who couldn't be further out of touch with the reality of a pilot's lifestyle. You keep drinking that ALPA kool-aid, further sweetened by the same old B.S. feel good rhetoric.

 

[PCL_128]

I don't know why I even waste my time talking with such morons.