Non-tech pilot slots coming to an end?

[Korgs130]

First, I'd like to say that personally, I wouldn't trade my time at USAFA for anything. If you don't like the kind of BS that you saw at the Academy, just wait until you see some of the BS that you go though when you deploy to a forward operating location in a combat zone (Afghanistan, Pakistan, Iraq etc). Flying in the military is awesome, but it is also filled with personal sacrifices. One of those sacrifices is putting up with a lot of BS.

You made a choice that may have a negitive impact on your goal. I don't think that this the end of the world. Keep working hard and stay focused. There are plenty of non Academy guys who are excellent pilots. Don't let anyone tell you that can't do it. Also, look into applying for a ANG or AFR pilot slot.

As far as you original question...the type of degree doesn't matter. My advice is to choose something at interests you (I choose History). If you're interested in the subject, you'll enjoy you're what your doing and you'll do well. I'm not saying to get an "easy" degree. Challenge yourself, but do it in something you enjoy. The important thing is that you build good study habits, a skill you'll need in UPT. Good luck!

 

[Hugh Jorgan]

I'm the first one here to tell you not to let any of the clowns on this board tell you there's anything you can't do. The point isn't whether the Acadamy is good or bad or whether there is more pu$$y to be had at a university. That's all true. In fact, I'd recommend people go the non-academy route overall. But once you've been given a foot in the door-no matter which door-to meeting your goal, you are a moron if you quit the process mid-stream. Mudkow might have found a way to sit in a hover on planeguard after quitting the academy, but he's the reason I tell people to never let anyone tell you there's something you can't do. Some folks can overcome STUPID decisions on the road to wings. Most can't. Good luck....you'll need it...that and a lot of hard work.

PS you might consider the Navy, Marines or Coast Guard, as those folks would glady consider the record of a person who "came to their senses" and realized the Air Force wasn't for them. Just a thought.

 

[JJG]

Leo,
Why don't you consider majoring in aviation? An aviation major would provide a fall back carreer as a civilian pilot plus you would get college credit to fly. A second degree possibility that is science and aviation related is a degree in meterology.

Here is my two cents? It seems you are like a path of least resistance kind of person right now. "I hated the Air Force Academy, it was too much commitment" "I don't really like ROTC" "What's the easiest major I can have and still get a pilot slot" While others are bashing you, I will give you the benefit of the doubt, and figure you are young, and don't understand how dedication and commitment often equals success. You had the best opportunity in the world with the AFA. You don't seem to understand that four years would have went by in the blink of an eye, but you will probably understand that when you get older.

I strongly suggest you take some flight training. Many folks say they want to be jet pilots, but then they find out they don't have the love of flying or the drive and determination to complete private pilot training in a Cessna 150. Find out if you have that drive right now, before the military sends you to fly school and you find out you hate flying and DOR. Plus any flight training you receive will not hurt your pilot application for ROTC.

Here is another suggestion, want a pilot slot right away?, in a program that does not care what kind of degree you have?, and with no ROTC stuff during the school year? Look into the Marine PLC program. Just two six week sessions in sunny Quantico, VA during the summer. A college buddy of mine was exactly in the same sitiuation you were in except he left the Air Force Academy because of low grades. He transferred to a regular university, entered the Marine Corps PLC program and last I heard five years ago was flying F-18's for the Marine Corps. The Marine D.I.'s in the PLC program will really test if you have the drive and determination to become a military pilot.

Final thoughts: Military flight school is more demanding than any OCS program or the Air Force Academy. You will receive about four years of college classes in seven months. You will have 0500 ramps followed by classes until 1700, then its home to study all night and start the process all over again the next day. IP's will "haze" you and embarass you in front of your peers. It gets even worse when you go to your aircraft transition. Now you will have to learn pages and pages of complex systems, operations and emergencey procedures in a few months. All this pales in comparsion to your first operational unit where you will be expected to keep up on your flying and perform a myriad of squadron duties. BTW you may be living in a tent, getting shot at, flying at night in the worst weather imaginable, and having the pressure of aerial refueling and dropping bombs on the bad guys and not your own troops. Start thinking about this kind of commitment and challange yourself to be the best.

 

[mudkow60]

Hugh...

You think turning circles in the sky for 8 to 12 hours is fun, you can keep it.

And by the way, you should change you name to huge ass, because you seem like a real tool. I would love to meet you in person, and we can see how big of a member you really are.

You know where you can find me clown- as you have responded to many of my previous posts, including the one about the air show coming up in P-cola. Bring it on, pal!

 

[HoursHore]

[ Look into the Marine PLC program. [/B]

If this guy can't hack the AFA, no way He'll hack Marine OCS.

 

[Hugh Jorgan]

Hugh...

You think turning circles in the sky for 8 to 12 hours is fun, you can keep it.

And by the way, you should change you name to huge ass, because you seem like a real tool. I would love to meet you in person, and we can see how big of a member you really are.

You know where you can find me clown- as you have responded to many of my previous posts, including the one about the air show coming up in P-cola. Bring it on, pal!

Bring what on?

 

[mudkow60]

I think that you can use your powers of decuction to figure it out. If you insist on writing such negative responses, you gotta expect some sh*t back in return.

Karma- ain't it a bitch!

 

[Spur]

Geez mudkow, dont get your panties in a wad... Hugh was spot on in his posts. Maybe he offended you, but who the F! cares? If you think going to a service academy and then bailing is a good thing to have on your record you need to be offended now and then. Is it something you can overcome? Obviously you are proof that you can, or could back in the mid-late 90's, in the Navy. The AF is different. First, we didnt boot all our mid grade pilots in the early 90's during the drawdown, and as a result trained far fewer during the same time period. This was the main driving force behind the huge shortage, and subsequently the lowering of standards for entering UPT since about '96-'97. Its all but over now, and the AF can start being far more selective. This is not good news for Leo and he needs to do everything he can to regain his competitive status.

 

[Hugh Jorgan]

I think that you can use your powers of decuction to figure it out. If you insist on writing such negative responses, you gotta expect some sh*t back in return.

Karma- ain't it a bitch!

Not really sure what you mean, but I do believe our friend here made a bad choice. It doesn't do anyone any good to blow smoke up his a$$ and tell him how everything will be okay. He has dug himself inta a hole. Not one that can't be dug out of, but a hole nonetheless. We should tell him that. If we do, he can arm himself with a better shovel instead of thinking everything is roses. The fact that your situation worked out doesn't make yours or his choice any better. My choices weren't all the best, but my situation worked out great. Just because my choices didn't come back to haunt me doesn't mean I would recommend them to anyone-I wouldn't. There's a difference between direct honesty and negativity. One might detect a bit of negativity in your posts. Those of us giving him the hard truth about his choices are trying to help. Are you?

 

[LJDRVR]

Dear Leo,

Yours is an interesting dilemma. Although you probably disliked reading it, much of the advice posted here exemplifies the type of attitudes you're going to encounter as you make your way to the UPT selection board.

Use this information to your advantage. Specifically, recognize the enormity of the task that lies ahead of you. Come to grips with the personal issues that caused you to fail at the academy. Recognize that your youth and lack of discipline and drive are probably the reasons you gave up. Be prepared to tell the interviewers what a stupid, selfish thing it was for you to give up the opportunity. (If you've not yet realized this, and are tempted to discount my rantings, then give it a few years, you'll get it.)

I can't even begin to help answer your question of tech versus non-tech degree, but I think there are underlying issues that should concern you more. First off, accountability. You claim to have left the academy because of hazing, but assert that you desire to be an Air Force pilot more than anything in the world. These statements are way too contradictory. Secondly, there's more than one way to skin this "career" cat, and I for one am curious as to what your real motivations are here. Is it to fly? No matter what? Is it to serve your country? Do you simply find yourself enamored of being an AF pilot? I don't want to sound like I'm lecturing you dude, but in my opinion, (worth what you paid for it) your primary focus here needs to be service. If you don't go into this with your eyes open to the fact that the needs of the Air Force are primary and that you will be an Officer first and a pilot second, you are setting yourself up for dissapointment. In my mind the key question is: would you still serve if not able to procure a pilot spot? If the answer is an unhesitating yes, then you'll do fine. press on and work your behind off.

I enlisted at the age of 19, thinking I would somehow go to OCS later and fly. (At the time I was just a slob in love with airplanes who lacked the discipline and grades to go to college) An interesting thing happened though, I LOVED the service! I was mentored by some very sharp NCO's and even though the only thing I ever wanted to do was fly, I spent 9 years on enlisted active duty before I seperated and started flying for a living. I don't regret having chosen the route I did for a minute. I was lucky enough to spend four years in a high-profile, presidential support special duty assignment that was hands-down the neatest thing next to aviation I ever did. It was like being on the olympic team. Now I get paid to fly jets for a living. What a scam. I guess what I'm trying to say here is that regardless of what happens to you hopefully you'll get the opportunity to serve in some fashion. Do everything you can to get that pilot slot, but PLEASE, don't miss out on the chance to serve your country if you don't get a shot at UPT.

You can have your cake and eat it to. Don't lose out on the opportunity to serve your country.

BTW Leo, read JJG's post twice. Best advice you'll get

Best of luck,

 

[Hugh Jorgan]

BTW Leo, read JJG's post twice. Best advice you'll get

Best of luck,

And read LJDRVR's 3 times...it's even better.

 

[rainman_02]

Since I've conversed with Leo on several occasions, and he knows where I stand on USAFA, ROTC, OTS, UPT and any other acronym I can throw out there (I don't think I mentioned SETOS or the like to him)...

I submit this much:

1) He punched early enough on that I sincerely doubt that it will even matter when he comes up on his UPT selection board (pending PPQ still and such).

2) He really didn't like it there. Period dot. I don't think he should have left, because I wouldn't have left (and didn't). But, I think he made the right choice, because only he can make that choice. My hazing comment was an allusion to this, I wasn't hazed yet he was...because my concept of hazing is different than his. My choices were different than his were.

3) I think his best course of action is to shut up and suck it up. He left, and he only digs himself a bigger hole if he keeps looking in the past and talking about what could have been. I think he stands an even chance of an UPT slot as any other current ROTC cadet...because it's still four years away. And, if that doesn't work, go on the five-year program and get an UPT slot like a guy in my UPT class did.

 

[Leo R.]

Hey guys, thanks for the advice. Yes, I didn't like reading it, but there were some good points made. I'm going for a tech degree, and I'm going to work my a$$ off. I'm going to show the board that I AM committed. Thanks again.

Very Respectfully,
Leo R.

 

[Falconjet]

Don't worry about the board

Don't try to prove to the board that you are committed, the person you need to convince is yourself. That might take some time but you can do it if you work hard enough and long enough. Good luck.

 

[oski]

this is to regard to mr. leo. I am sure u had good reasons to forfeit all the benefits and rights that came with the time being there at the academy. Trust me, when u have second thoughts about something it's best to go with them. Sometimes u might find something better. Don't worry about the rest and their opinions u just do what u gotta do to get ahead.

 

[smellthejeta]

Hey guys, thanks for the advice. Yes, I didn't like reading it, but there were some good points made. I'm going for a tech degree, and I'm going to work my a$$ off. I'm going to show the board that I AM committed. Thanks again.

Very Respectfully,
Leo R.

Leo, if you want my advice about college, and in this order:

Forget about the service for 30 seconds. Pick something you want to study, pick something that will be a decent backup, and third, NOW pick something the service likes.

I tried to go OTS and I can't do it. It has nothing to do with college and it has nothing to do with my GPA, and it has nothing to do with my ASVAB, AFOQT, and PCSM scores. But guess what! I can now tell you all of the things in the USAF I am not qualified to do. I am not qualified to be a pilot, navigator, 13B (air battle manager), air traffic controller, or loadmaster. Donno about KC135 boom operator, I didn't ask.

BTW, I scored 99 ASVAB, 89 Pilot, 91 Nav, 90 Quant, 64 V, 88 AA, 97 PCSM and majored in computer science. You guys wanna guess why I can't do any of that good stuff?

Anyway, I ended up speaking to a couple of ANG units, and there's a he11 of an opportunity with them. I'm most likely going to the MD ANG to study meteorology. Enlistment bonuses for critically manned field are very good, and I couldn't turn it down. The bonuses help because E3 pay isn't that much.