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"No more simles and JO is smart", says AZ paper

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LearLove

Well-known member
Joined
Nov 27, 2001
Posts
4,451
http://www.eastvalleytribune.com/index.php?sty=40162

US Airways has a history of marital problems By Tom Gibbons, TribuneOnce upon time, there was an airline that painted smiles on its planes. Then after a merger, there were no more smiles. On the planes or anywhere else.The airline was Pacific Southwest Airlines, a regional carrier with routes in California and the Northwest. Pacific Southwest Airlines was acquired in the late 1980s by an eastern airline, then known as USAir and now known as US Airways. USAir didn’t have much of a presence in the West, so it seemed like a good fit. At about the same time, USAir, which was highly profitable, bought another regional carrier, Piedmont Aviation.

So here you had one of the stars of the airline industry with a chance for a national presence. It seemed like a great idea at the time.

It turned into one of those mergers that wind up in business school texts as a how-not-to example.

One of the problems was USAir decided to put all the folks from low-cost Pacific Southwest Airlines and Piedmont Aviation on the same pay scale as USAir personnel.

By 1989, the bigger, bloated USAir was losing money. By 1993, it had the highest cost structure in the industry. It was forced to abandon its Western routes.

This is offered as a cautionary tale.

Last week, we found out there may be a sequel. US Airways is looking for a merger partner. And the company has been talking to Tempe-based America West Airlines. Our hometown airline offers western routes. And some financial stability.

Of course, things are a little different now from back in the late 1980s.

In a conference call Wednesday announcing America West’s first-quarter earnings — and a surprise profit — CEO Doug Parker wouldn’t comment directly on a merger with US Airways. But he said unions, airplane-makers and regulators are more amenable to making airline mergers work.

"You end up with larger net synergy than I think you’ve ever seen before,’’ he said.

That’s one difference. Another is this: US Airways is a mess and has been for years. The company is in bankruptcy, its second trip this decade.

Airline analysts seem downright puzzled on how a merger would make sense, especially for America West. The cultures are so different. And this isn’t a case of strong financial player pairing with a weak one. America West is stronger, but that is a relative measurement.

The belief here is east Phoenix-based Mesa Air CEO Jonathan Ornstein is somehow pushing for an alliance between America West and US Airways. Mesa is in the unglamorous business of flying connecting routes to smaller cities for big airlines. But his airline, unlike most, is profitable — as an airline. Even though America West turned a profit in the first quarter, it did so because its jet fuel hedging business made up for the airline’s losses. Ornstein’s two biggest partners are America West and US Airways. Parker and Ornstein are said to be two of the smartest executives in the industry.

Maybe they see an opportunity no one else sees. Maybe they are overlooking a risk everyone else sees.Contact Tom Gibbons by email, or phone (480) 898-6815
 
Thoughts on Orstein?

"Ornstein’s two biggest partners are America West and US Airways. Parker and Ornstein are said to be two of the smartest executives in the industry."

All the MESA pilots I talk with, loath Ornstein. Parker on the other hand is on the plus side of middle of the road at HP from most guys I talk with. He has done a good job steering the ship since 9/11 and although it took a while, generally the pilot group is happy with the current contract (it could always be better). His team is doing as good a job as can be expected in this environment. I think he is about as good a CEO as you can have and I believe him when he says that he won't do anything that harms HP and its current employees. We are just beginning to plan for our next pilot negotiations and how Mr. Parker works (or stalls) will be a significant factor for his long term reputation in our pilot group. Orstein on the other hand .... I've never heard such vehemence by MESA pilots. If Orstein is behind it ... go the other way and don't even look back. The MESA group did a great job of standing up to him and the Freedom Air fiasco.
 
WOW! Ornstein one of the smartest. That is an interesting quote. Just another notion that the media is clueless. I guess you have to define smart. MK82 - I agree with your quote 100%. I still cannot figure out how a US and HP merger would be good.

LMAO!
-W-
 
As unfortunate as it is, Ornstein is one of the smartest. He runs a profitable airline and has managed to keep costs down. From the shareholders viewpoint(which is all that matters in the business world) he is doing fine.
 
Johnnie O. is a genius. An evil genius, but a genius none the less. The Freedumb fiasco was perfectly carried out by him to get the pilots to take a bare bones contract. He has zero ethics and morals, but the guy is a genius in business. Every other regional's management team is now repeating what he did: Mesaba with Big Sky, Chit-taco with Republic, Pinnacle is currently working on a new certificate that will probably be flown by non-union pilots. The scumbag just outsmarted us and everyone else is following in his footsteps.
 
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PCL_128 said:
Johnnie O. is a genius. An evil genius, but a genius none the less. The Freedumb fiasca was perfectly carried out by him to get the pilots to take a bare bones contract. He has zero ethics and morals, but the guy is a genius in business. Every other regional's management team is now repeating what he did: Mesaba with Big Sky, Chit-taco with Republic, Pinnacle is currently working on a new certificate that will probably be flown by non-union pilots. The scumbag just outsmarted us and everyone else is following in his footsteps.

I agree-funny how folks who don't like someone call them an idiot.
 
[color=black said:
The MESA group did a great job of standing up to him and the Freedom Air fiasco.[/color]

I hope that is a sarcastic remark. If you really believe that then I may tend to think that one of thoes MK82s was dropped on your head.
 
JO is a smart guy, but I think he burned his bridges at US Airways. GECAS runs US Airways and JO with the help of Dave Seigel robbed GECAS's money. Siegal is now the CEO of Sky Chefs. JO could loose his contract with US Airways and AWA. The Mesa assets that are leased from GECAS could easily be tranferred to a more profitable, better managed airline that is under the direct control of GECAS. It's a shame for the employees of Mesa that JO spends most of his energy on political intrigue rather than airline management.

As for this article, any poster on this forum could have written a more informed analysis of the proposed merger. This reporter is a hack. He neeeds to go back to covering local school board meetings.
 
PCL_128- Since you are so anti-RJDC I would like to know your background, private thru commercial, leading to your present job. What schools did you attend, etc. Thanks, cheers, Wil
 
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wil said:
PCL_128- Since you are so anti-RJDC I would like to know your background private to commercial. What schools did you attend, etc. I would like to know your background before
I read a post that you are a GIA grad. In my view they are the bottom feeders of the industry, renting the right seat. I can't believe that you would be against honest regional pilots who paid their dues getting fair representation.
So, please help clear the confusion and tell me your background. Thanks

Well, my background's been discussed several times on this board, but here it is:

-Started private about 10 years ago at small FBO outside Atlanta
-Moved to Orlando and finished private and some instrument at Comair Academy
-Finished the rest of the ratings at GIA and did the FO program
-Got hired at Pinch-Nickel where I still am today

If you want to know how I feel about the RJDC, just check a few RJDC threads. I think we have at least one going right now even.
 
If you bought the right seat at GIA how can you be against regional pilots getting a fair shake? Are you trying to kiss up to the majors? I can't believe GIA gets much respect from the majors. Fly, or in the case of GIA, buy safe-

PS- what are you doing on the majors board? Think you can buy your way in?
 
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wil said:
If you bought the right seat at GIA how can you be against regional pilots getting a fair shake? Are you trying to kiss up to the majors? I can't believe GIA gets much respect from the majors. Fly, or in the case of GIA, buy safe-

Regionals do get a fair shake already. We don't need a ridiculous lawsuit that will create numerous problems.

Honestly, do you really believe the guys at the majors give a flip about GIA? There are GIA pilots at every major airline in the country. That being said, I'm not really a fan of GIA. I went there because I didn't know any better at the time. That's the case for most GIA pilots. Live and learn.

PS- what are you doing on the majors board? Think you can buy your way in?

No intention of buying my way in to anything Wil. Unlike the idiots at the RJDC that thought they could win a DOH seniority grab with a lawsuit, I actually plan to get my job at a major someday the old fashioned way. You know, actually interview and get the job.
 
To the original discussion at hand, I'll agree with PCL_128 and I'mbatman. JO is a genius. Incredible smart and shrewd businessman. Excellent public speaker. Comes off as a 'nice guy' in the eyes of the media. Reality though, is he's not even the scum of the earth. He's the stuff that the scum of the earth wipes off the bottom of their feet. He's the sticky stain on the porn theater floor of life. I worked for Mesa, from last January to this January, (1 year), and saw first hand what a piece of $HIT he is, how he runs his company, and what he thinks of his workforce. He brilliantly used the Freedumb incident to FORCE the Mesa pilot group into a piece of crap contract, (what we referred to as the craptract). Forget about the pay for a second.....and just look at the working conditions. 8 days off on reserve. 10 for a line holder. No block or better. Lowest perdiem in the industry. No duty rigs. No limits on Junior Manning. No move days. Substandard hotel conditions. I talked to my buddies still there, and they're forced to stay at an ASU dorm, 4 to a room, during training, RPC's etc.

This stuff is all thanks to JO. He is a piece of scum that screws his labor out of as much as he can, and stuffs it in his pocket. He is the poster boy for corporate CEO greed and corruption. Talk to any Mesa pilot right now, and ask them about contract compliance. The company BLATANTLY violates their contract, every single day, has been doing so for about 2 years, and doesn't care. They just keep doing it.

JO is scum. I wouldn't pi$$ on him if he was on fire. I'd pour gasoline on him and laugh. If he's got something to do with the AWA and USAir merger, I feel sorry for everyone involved. Be sure to stock up on Vasoline. I promise you that you'll need it.
 
If this deal with USAir/ AWA should see the light of day,I sure hope that GECAS
takes back all the assets they have sunk into Mesa over the years and redistributes them to Piedmont and PSA ,the 2 wholly owned regionals still operating as USAirways Express. Why any airline would want to cast his lot with JO and that loser outfit of his,while owning 2 half way decent regional airlines outright is beyond me.


PHXFLYR:cool:
 
PCL_128 said:
Well, my background's been discussed several times on this board, but here it is:

-Started private about 10 years ago at small FBO outside Atlanta
-Moved to Orlando and finished private and some instrument at Comair Academy
-Finished the rest of the ratings at GIA and did the FO program
-Got hired at Pinch-Nickel where I still am today

If you want to know how I feel about the RJDC, just check a few RJDC threads. I think we have at least one going right now even.

As I've said before

SHUT UP DORK
 
Regarding the point of the original discussion. I seriously cannot figure out who would benefit from an HP/USairways merger. Unless USair can shed debt and come out of BK clean, I can't see it benefitting either party.

Aaaah...enter JO and the other regionals. Hmmm...My personal opinion of Mr. Ornstein will not be discussed on a public forum. But let's say his method is that of evil genius. He played the Freedom/Mesa deal just like the winning coach of any superbowl team. He designed a strategy and stuck to it. and it worked.

It was a no-win situation for the pilot group at Mesa. You guys are right, there are many others trying to run the airline version of the (Freedom) west coast offense. If JO is involved in any future HP/USair dealings, hang on to your you know what (and your pay and work rules). Good luck to all the professional airline pilots involved in this never ending drama.

Hey PHX flyer, take it easy on the pilot group. I don't think they are losers. They are more like pow's in a nazi prison camp.
 
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Yeah,maybe so,but it's kind of hard to keep that in mind when you see one of them walking through the terminal in uniform with rollaboard suit case in tow and a bulging nap sack strapped over his back. Hell, it looked like he was wearing an "EF-in" parachute! Real sharp image. Wonder what the passengers thought looking at him walk by....:rolleyes:



PHXFLYR:cool:
 
PHXFLYR said:
Yeah,maybe so,but it's kind of hard to keep that in mind when you see one of them walking through the terminal in uniform with rollaboard suit case in tow and a bulging nap sack strapped over his back. Hell, it looked like he was wearing an "EF-in" parachute! Real sharp image. Wonder what the passengers thought looking at him walk by....:rolleyes:



PHXFLYR:cool:

Funny thing is, he'll soon be sitting in the left seat of a jet at Mesa as you read your "Fulough Gazette" if JO gets his way. What comes around goes around.

BTW, if you'd like, the next time I'm through PHX, I'd be more than happy to snap a pictures of a few of your "professional" AWA brothers and post 'em here. I'd guarantee they would be as endearing as the backpack wearing Mesa dude. In fact, camera's packed-I'll be in PHX this weekend-we'll see what we can come up with.
 
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