Nja X

[DHPFLYN]

Just womdering how many hours the average X pilot flies a year? I keep hearing it is a workhorse of the fleet. So just curious what kind of times they are flying?

Thanks

 

[Duke of Ale]

Been at NJA since early 2000 and on the X the whole time. I have 3700 hrs so far. Just a little over 400/yr.

 

[DHPFLYN]

Does the X go out of the country? How do you like the X ?

 

[CE750Driver]

About 400 a year sounds right for me. Been in it for 9 years. The X goes out of the country, but you wont be in it unless you are part of the A team or Go To team. aka... kiss asses, ass clowns, and guys who have no life and live on the road, flying broken airplanes also helps.

 

[Duke of Ale]

I've been up to Alaska, over to Hawaii (as an sic) and as far south as Panama. Plus Bermuda and most of the Caribbean. The X goes to Europe but not with me on it!

 

[CE750Driver]

Touche Duke, pretty much everyone does International not to include Europe. The A team boyz own that.

 

[Mach92]

There is nothing "typical" of X flying at NJA.

Everyone does some type of international flying on the X.

Coast to Coast 5+ hour legs are normal. It's also very normal to go MIA TEB SJC then they toss on a ferry to LAX SMO BUR something like that.

I flew 700+ one year but that was before our labor battle.

There is no such thing as a down day in the X. It can and does recover every A/C type NetJets has. Good thing is you don't sit around much

 

[ozpilot]

I've been up to Alaska, over to Hawaii (as an sic) and as far south as Panama. Plus Bermuda and most of the Caribbean. The X goes to Europe but not with me on it!

Last time I flew with the Duke - we had a dual fuel pump failure halfway to Bermuda ... be careful what you wish for

(thank goodness for electric boost pumps!)

 

[On Your Six]

Just womdering how many hours the average X pilot flies a year? I keep hearing it is a workhorse of the fleet. So just curious what kind of times they are flying?

Thanks

Are you asking because you were awarded the X or because you are merely interested in that fleet type?

I have a buddy who is an FO on the X and he really enjoys it. A bit tight up front but he is one of those guys who actually likes to stay busy vs. just sitting in the FBO for hours on end. He was offered a few different types and he is happy with his choice. That said, the type of flying the X does might not be for everyone. Multi transcon flights per tour could get tiring for some. But you will get to do a good mix of flying (some short hops and some transcons) and also get to know Aspen, Jackson Hole, Scottsdale, Van Nuys and Teterboro (yipppeee) well.

 

[DHPFLYN]

I am still waiting for a call for interview but I figure the more information I know now the better. I am like your friend and would rather be flying than sitting in a FBO for hours on end. It actually sounds great to me. If I get the chance to pick an aircraft type the X sounds great.

Thanks again for all the onformation

 

[Going2Golf]

Been at NJA since early 2000 and on the X the whole time. I have 3700 hrs so far. Just a little over 400/yr.

If youve been in the X for 7 yrs now...and only fly 400 hrs a year that would be closer to 2800 hrs.

If as you say you have 3700 hrs in the X, in 7 yrs then you are actually a little over 600 hrs a year..

Unless they do math differently in the X. 3700/6=616

 

[Duke of Ale]

I have been at NJA for 7 yrs 10 mo. 3700/7.833=472.36
OK, it is more than a little over 400 but less than 500.
Close enough.

 

[skiandsurf]

Been on the X for alomost 2 yrs. Usually stay very busy. Once in a while you have an easy (slow) week, enjoy the FBOs while you can.

 

[realityman]

Been on the X for 9.5 years. Averaging around 500 hours a year. And that's considering 4 weeks of vacation, and three separate training events every year.

As for int'l, CE750Driver is a little off base. Anyone who knows me will tell you I'm nowhere near anything like an 'A' Teamer. And yet I still do a moderate amount of Europe and Hawaii. I rarely am scheduled for more than 12 hours on the ground in Hawaii and am ALWAYS scheduled for the min turn of 14 hours in Europe. I actually hate the Europe and Hawaii trips for just that reason. But just wanted to point out that the 'good' trips don't just go to 'A'-Teamers and ass-kissers.

Having said that, there are a certain select group of individuals who always seem to get the int'l trips where they may have a few days on the ground.

So not denying the existence of the 'A'-Team, just saying that they don't do ALL the Europe and Hawaii trips.

 

[On Your Six]

Been on the X for 9.5 years. Averaging around 500 hours a year. And that's considering 4 weeks of vacation, and three separate training events every year.

As for int'l, CE750Driver is a little off base. Anyone who knows me will tell you I'm nowhere near anything like an 'A' Teamer. And yet I still do a moderate amount of Europe and Hawaii. I rarely am scheduled for more than 12 hours on the ground in Hawaii and am ALWAYS scheduled for the min turn of 14 hours in Europe. I actually hate the Europe and Hawaii trips for just that reason. But just wanted to point out that the 'good' trips don't just go to 'A'-Teamers and ass-kissers.

Having said that, there are a certain select group of individuals who always seem to get the int'l trips where they may have a few days on the ground.

So not denying the existence of the 'A'-Team, just saying that they don't do ALL the Europe and Hawaii trips.

Just curious. What has kept you on the Citation X for 9.5 years? A love for the Citation X? Not interested in flying the F2000 (and now Gulfstream)? Clearly you have to be pretty senior by now. Just curious as to why you would personally stay on that aircraft type so long when you have other choices...

 

[realityman]

Six,

I actually do like the X. But that's not what's keeping me. In a word, money.

Moving to any other plane, except the Falcon EX and the Gulfstream, would be a completely lateral move in terms of pay. However, I'm also getting IOE pay. So moving to another aircraft would actually result in a pay LOSS for me because my IOE position would not transfer to another type. With the new IBB pay, that would be a loss of $9K/year. Not willing to take that hit just for another type rating.

Only going to the two planes above would allow me to break even, or make a bit more. My bid is in for the DA-2000EX, but while I'm pretty senior, not senior enough to hold it for at least another year to year and a half (assuming we start getting 4 or 5 a year sometime soon).

 

[Flyby1206]

How is the int'l flying assigned to crews? If you are senior do you have a better chance of getting it? If you dont want an int'l trip can you pass? Which a/c doesnt do int'l? Thanks

 

[Flyby1206]

deleted

 

[208starcheck]

Six,

I actually do like the X. But that's not what's keeping me. In a word, money.

Moving to any other plane, except the Falcon EX and the Gulfstream, would be a completely lateral move in terms of pay. However, I'm also getting IOE pay. So moving to another aircraft would actually result in a pay LOSS for me because my IOE position would not transfer to another type. With the new IBB pay, that would be a loss of $9K/year. Not willing to take that hit just for another type rating.

Only going to the two planes above would allow me to break even, or make a bit more. My bid is in for the DA-2000EX, but while I'm pretty senior, not senior enough to hold it for at least another year to year and a half (assuming we start getting 4 or 5 a year sometime soon).

I believe the new pay rates make the above untrue now. It's all the same pay. You are better off keeping the IOE position.

 

[realityman]

Hmmmm. I'll have to look into it. I thought the aircraft >40000# paid more? No? If not, I may end up being the highest time X pilot EVER if I get stuck in this plane until the end of my career 29 years from now! LOL!

 

[CE750Driver]

You got me realityman! I recant. Quickturns and maybe 10 to 20 percent of all the Europe trips go to other people. 80 percent go to the same few guys. Ask D.B. how many times he has been over in the last month. More than me with my 9 years in X.
1108 has to deal with this situation, and they tell me they are working on it.

 

[realityman]

Driver,

He's definitely leading the way for the A team. I certainly do hope that 1108 is getting a handle on it. Maybe I wouldn't mind the Europe trips so much if I had a little more than 14 hours on the ground.

Heck, I've been trying for a while now to get my name off the list of captains who go to Europe and Hawaii. Guess they gotta have someone to do the min-turn trips.

 

[208starcheck]

I don't believe the 40,000 lb pay kicks in till year 15, 16, 17. You would still make more with IOE pay till year 16.

 

[bailey3083]

How comfy is that cockpit for those longhauls?

 

[Gator1999]

How comfy is that cockpit for those longhauls?

Not very... but its a great plane.

 

[flyipilot]

I have been at NJ for almost 1.5 years and when I started I was offered a choice of a few planes out of LAX. I came from the 121 world and knew nothing about any corportate planes. An X to me was just an alphabet letter. I am now glad I chose that plane and love it more than the A-319 I flew at FlyI. It is a bit tight up front but watching the map display flow quickly by as you travel along at .91 is quite fun! Makes the trans-con flights not that bad. I have had a few busy weeks but, it makes the day go bay very fast. I have not had a tour where we did not have at least 1 or 2 days with a good rest. A few min turns and very very crazy early shows but, then they balance with a few long lay overs. Just last tour flew early from TEB to SMO and then done at 1130a for the day. Walked to the beach and had a great time! The rest of the tour was a bit more busy but, that is ok with me. I love the way this planes handles at slow speeds as well as fast. It has quite a spectrum and I am impressed with Cessna for building it. Some small pluses for its size are: heated wing (no boots like the G-200), leading edge slats, N/W steering wheel, APU, dual hydralics w/PTU, (heard some smaller jets use one system), and of course very powerful engines..

Saying all that..If you are coming here and get a choice of a/c and the "X" is one of them..take it! According to Flight Safety, it has one of the highest fail rates and is one of the more difficult to learn (a tad unforgiving on V1 cuts with a nice X-wind)...but, it is an incredible plane and very fun! You will not be sorry!

 

[On Your Six]

I have been at NJ for almost 1.5 years and when I started I was offered a choice of a few planes out of LAX. I came from the 121 world and knew nothing about any corportate planes. An X to me was just an alphabet letter. I am now glad I chose that plane and love it more than the A-319 I flew at FlyI. It is a bit tight up front but watching the map display flow quickly by as you travel along at .91 is quite fun! Makes the trans-con flights not that bad. I have had a few busy weeks but, it makes the day go bay very fast. I have not had a tour where we did not have at least 1 or 2 days with a good rest. A few min turns and very very crazy early shows but, then they balance with a few long lay overs. Just last tour flew early from TEB to SMO and then done at 1130a for the day. Walked to the beach and had a great time! The rest of the tour was a bit more busy but, that is ok with me. I love the way this planes handles at slow speeds as well as fast. It has quite a spectrum and I am impressed with Cessna for building it. Some small pluses for its size are: heated wing (no boots like the G-200), leading edge slats, N/W steering wheel, APU, dual hydralics w/PTU, (heard some smaller jets use one system), and of course very powerful engines..

Saying all that..If you are coming here and get a choice of a/c and the "X" is one of them..take it! According to Flight Safety, it has one of the highest fail rates and is one of the more difficult to learn (a tad unforgiving on V1 cuts with a nice X-wind)...but, it is an incredible plane and very fun! You will not be sorry!

Great post. I am a big fan of the C750 too - it has great ramp presence. I think it comes down to whether a person wants to be busy or less-busy during a tour. Some people prefer to sit and don't want to fly much (then choose the Beechjet or Ultra/Encore). Some people think staying busy helps the week fly by faster (X, XLS or Falcon with Sovereign and G200 getting busier).

The XL/XLS fleet is also very busy (the biggest fleet at NJA if I am not mistaken) but you will fly shorter legs. This might be preferrable for those pilots with flat a$$es who can't sit for more than 2 hours at a time (I am developing into that type of person). If you want more short hops, choose the XL/XLS if you have the choice.

 

[Dr Pepper]

To the original poster, I have never heard a single H-800/900 pilot complain about their fleet. Also, the Falcon Classic offers an SIC a relaxing job.
The X is a good plane, but is not the greatest thing since sliced bread.

 

[av8tor4239]

you all sound like you have SJS... It is a freaking airplane get over it....it either pays the bills or does not pay the bills... if it did not pay the bills you would fly something with less " ramp presence" WTF is that?

 

[johnsonrod]

you all sound like you have SJS... It is a freaking airplane get over it....it either pays the bills or does not pay the bills... if it did not pay the bills you would fly something with less " ramp presence" WTF is that?

Perhaps you should look for a new career. It's nice that some people still enjoy aviation and are enthused by it. I take it you are a glass half-empty kind of guy....