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New rest rules and commuting

Azul

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Does anybody know if these new rest rules have anything to say with commuting. Ie your commute time is also added to you duty day. I have heard that the nprm will mirror the european rules. Do they have any rules regarding commuting? Thanks
 

atpcliff

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Hi!

The new rules will say nothing about commuting.

cliff
NBO
 

Jar Jar

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Hi!

The new rules will say nothing about commuting.

cliff
NBO

exactly. because commuting and sleeping in airport crew rooms were not factors in 3407. Commuting in to a 14 hour duty day will still be legal until someone who kills more people says directly to the cvr that they had to commute due to airline instability and they got maybe 2 hours sleep the night before. The feds are going to take the easy way out instead by reminding us all to be 'professionals', that way when it happens again the blame can easily be placed on lack of professionalism instead of blaming the feds who failed to create any rules to protect the public.
 

Hutchman

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It is not in there because ALPA does not want it (because some pilots commute) and the company does not want to police it. Any rule change that does not take commuting time into account does not address the main problem and does not make the skies any safer IMO. Just more bureaucratic lip service.....
 

ACL65PILOT

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It was in the subcommittee bill, but I do not see a commuting rule come out of in this bill. It would be too large of a cost for companies to swallow.
 

Splert

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It is not in there because ALPA does not want it (because some pilots commute) and the company does not want to police it. Any rule change that does not take commuting time into account does not address the main problem and does not make the skies any safer IMO. Just more bureaucratic lip service.....

So is driving from Lake Tahoe to SFO is more restful than commuting from LAX to JFK?

If you are based in SFO where would YOU put the limit for driving to work SMF? CIC?
 

75M

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Do you guys really want the government to have to TELL you how to plan your commutes? Do you think the goverment should tell you how to commute?

Seriously, if you can't commute and get enough rest to be safe, don't commute. If you are too tired to fly, don't fly. Commute in early. Move to your base. Move to a place that would make an easier commute.

I commute, and the last thing on my mind is how to BLAME the government for not imposing commuter rules if I ball one up.

And you know what, commuting to work and not being fit to fly, yet still flying is unprofessional.
 
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Flyby1206

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enuff
Do you guys really want the government to have to TELL you how to plan your commutes? Do you think the goverment should tell you how to commute?

Seriously, if you can't commute and get enough rest to be safe, don't commute. If you are too tired to fly, don't fly. Commute in early. Move to your base. Move to a place that would make an easier commute.

I commute, and the last thing on my mind is how to BLAME the government for not imposing commuter rules if I ball one up.

And you know what, commuting to work and not being fit to fly, yet still flying is unprofessional.

Can everyone afford to move to a new base every year or two when the company closes it on a whim?

Commuting would be great if the company would positive space me on a flight to/from work. Problem solved!
 

Donald

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Do you guys really want the government to have to TELL you how to plan your commutes? Do you think the goverment should tell you how to commute?

Seriously, if you can't commute and get enough rest to be safe, don't commute. If you are too tired to fly, don't fly. Commute in early. Move to your base. Move to a place that would make an easier commute.

I commute, and the last thing on my mind is how to BLAME the government for not imposing commuter rules if I ball one up.

And you know what, commuting to work and not being fit to fly, yet still flying is unprofessional.

No I don't. You are absolutely right. Is commuting in the day of a trip any worse than getting a bad night of sleep? Do we really want the "sleep police"? We have the "thought police" already since we can't profile.
 
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Splert

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Do you guys really want the government to have to TELL you how to plan your commutes? Do you think the goverment should tell you how to commute?

Seriously, if you can't commute and get enough rest to be safe, don't commute. If you are too tired to fly, don't fly. Commute in early. Move to your base. Move to a place that would make an easier commute.

I commute, and the last thing on my mind is how to BLAME the government for not imposing commuter rules if I ball one up.

And you know what, commuting to work and not being fit to fly, yet still flying is unprofessional.
Define commuting.

Is it driving 3 hours from SAN to LAX for a late afternoon show?

What about PSP to LAX or FAT to SFO?

Is it time of just air travel?
 

CesnaCaptn

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I read somewhere that ICAO rules consider a commute, either driving more than 2 hours or flying.
 

75M

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Define commuting.

Is it driving 3 hours from SAN to LAX for a late afternoon show?

What about PSP to LAX or FAT to SFO?

Is it time of just air travel?
FIIK, That's why I want to keep the government out of it and leave it up to us to report fit to fly.
 

wms

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It would be impossible to police.
 

Benjamin Dover

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exactly. because commuting and sleeping in airport crew rooms were not factors in 3407. Commuting in to a 14 hour duty day will still be legal until someone who kills more people says directly to the cvr that they had to commute due to airline instability and they got maybe 2 hours sleep the night before. The feds are going to take the easy way out instead by reminding us all to be 'professionals', that way when it happens again the blame can easily be placed on lack of professionalism instead of blaming the feds who failed to create any rules to protect the public.

So, should the public be protected from guys who get up at 2 am after going to be at who knows when and then DRIVE 3 hours or more to their early a.m. check in? This happens - every day.

We don't need fed involvement in reporting for work.

And what about guys who live local and do have a short drive to work. Say they have an afternoon report time. Should the feds regulate their day at home so they are properly rested before their airline duty day that might go until midnight or later? No fishing, hunting, farming, golf, changing diapers, nooners, etc. on same day preceding airline trip, right?

Impossible cause you advocate
 

OurMoney1

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I've been saying it since this all went down. You do not want Washington legislating our productivity and you DEFINATELY don't want them weighing in on our commutes. Wake up....Washington has miles of problems, I'd prefer we police ourselves rather than leave it up to a committee of suits that dont understand our profession/QOL.
 

gator_hater

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Should the feds regulate their day at home so they are properly rested before their airline duty day that might go until midnight or later? No fishing, hunting, farming, golf, changing diapers, nooners, etc. on same day preceding airline trip, right?

Impossible cause you advocate

Drop the golf and fishing, limit the diapers I'm ok with it.
 

Ty Webb

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The thing that everyone is missing here is that, because of the antiquated RLA, combined with the post-9/11 gutting of our industry, pilots are being stretched too thin in all regards.

If you're making $200K and have 17 days off, commuting in the night before and plunking down $100. for dinner and a hotel 3 or 4 times a month is a non-event. If you're a 45 year-old father of three teenagers who is now making $60K again for the third time, with only 12 days off each month, well, not so much.

I'm sure there'll be some naive, mindless jackass responding to this post, parroting management pablum and telling me that "You knew that when you signed up" or "No one's shooting at you, and you get to sleep in a real bed each night", so let me sign off by responding in advance:

Whenmost of us "signed up" this was still a "career", not a "job". When you jackasses wake up and are willing to fight for this to be a "career" again, then we'll have plenty to talk about. Until then, keep it to yourself.

Ty
 
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Paul R. Smith

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I live fifteen minutes from the airport but I went to see pink floyd last night and it was a 3 hour drive home. Am I responsible for the fact that I may have inhaled second hand pcp? I went to bed at 2:00 and have a report at 8:30. Get out of my life already.

Flock off.
 

B-J-J Fighter

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the thing that everyone is missing here is that, because of the antiquated rla, combined with the post-9/11 gutting of our industry, pilots are being stretched too thin in all regards.

If you're making $200k and have 17 days off, commuting in the night before and plunking down $100. For dinner and a hotel 3 or 4 times a month is a non-event. If you're a 45 year-old father of three teenagers who is now making $60k again for the third time, with only 12 days off each month, well, not so much.

I'm sure there'll be some naive, mindless jackass responding to this post, parroting management pablum and telling me that "you knew that when you signed up" or "no one's shooting at you, and you get to sleep in a real bed each night", so let me sign off by responding in advance:

Whenmost of us "signed up" this was still a "career", not a "job". When you jackasses wake up and are willing to fight for this to be a "career" again, then we'll have plenty to talk about. Until then, keep it to yourself.

Ty


word.
 
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