NEW OT RULES: Are pilots "White Collar"

[EngineOut]

http://money.cnn.com/2004/08/23/news/economy/overtime/index.htm?cnn=yes

"White-collar employees who earn more than $100,000 a year are automatically exempt from overtime pay under the new law. That wasn't the case before, although many high-income workers have been exempt for other reasons besides their income level."

Will this new rule have an effect on pilots and dispatchers?

 

[Yudso]

Doubtfull., since all of that stuff is laid out in the contract.

 

[CCDiscoB]

We're paid by the hour not by salary.

Besides, I don't know if pilots are considered white collar. I'd bet many consider us as blue collar. Hourly employees, Union, etc, etc.

 

[Rez O. Lewshun]

Pilots are as blue collar as the housekeeping staff at the hotels we stay at. When you walk out of the hotel in your crisp white shirt and politly say hi but yet internally snub the maid, keep in mind that you have more in common with her in terms of your ability to bargain for wages and improve your quality of life, than a doctor or lawyer.

This won't apply to pilots. If you have wondered why you get close to nothing in ground school its becuase you negotiated below min wage in your CBA endorsed by the RLA.

Think you are professional like a doctor or lawyer? As a pilot, can you quit your "practice" and start your own airline?

Blue Collar baby!

 

[asacap]

Rez O. Lewshun,

How come such low self-esteem? I consider pilots to be professionals. The snubbing the maid thing is all you. I've never done it nor will I ever. I don't consider myself better than anyone. By the way, is it OK for a doctor to snub the maid?

 

[satpak77]

new times now people....

I think the days of the flying public respecting "The Captain" and giving him white collar treatment went away when the public stopped wearing business attire just to fly and when they stopped considering flying on airlines "a privilege"

sh1t these days it is cheaper to fly LUV from Hobby to Love that it is to drive you own car, or take the greyhound

we are just bus drivers people, we all need to wake up and realize that. Within our own pilot profession, we of course maintain high standards of training, certification, and treat each other with professionalism....however the majority of the flying public could give a sh1t less about pay concessions from 250K to 175K or picket lines.

what is the ticket price? when we getting there? why? why not?

thats about it

 

[Rez O. Lewshun]

Rez O. Lewshun,

How come such low self-esteem? I consider pilots to be professionals. The snubbing the maid thing is all you. I've never done it nor will I ever. I don't consider myself better than anyone. By the way, is it OK for a doctor to snub the maid?

My intent didn't come across.....

We are professional, but not in a doctor/lawyer sense. Many pilots think so...

Rather we are unique. We have much in common with factory workers and others that make an hourly wage. Many pilots haven't considered this....

I take our professionalism very seriously... If we allow our image to lower....so will our pay.... It's hard to fight the tide.... but collectively.....aw nevermind....

 

[PonchoMan]

We're just equipment operators. Blue collar.

 

[DesertFalcon]

Pilots are as blue collar as the housekeeping staff at the hotels we stay at.

Blue Collar baby!

What color is the collar of the shirts pilots wear? I don't know about you but mine isn't blue. Perhaps, you company makes a fashion statement with it white shirts and a blue collar?

 

[Ted Striker]

Union contracts

Anyone with a collective bargaining agreement is exempt.

 

[lostplnetairman]

The new regulations specifically address pilots. My copy of the regs is at work so I cannot quote from it right now. Commercial pilots operating under the RLA, are (and always have been) exempt unless covered by a CBA. All other pilots, including corporate pilots, are considered as non-exempt. That means, that they are not exempt from the overtime rules of the FLSA. That means they have always been and will continue to be entitled to overtime pay. The amount depends upon the state in which you are employed. This represents no change from the prior regulations.


HrDiva

 

[prodigal]

White collar?

I used to think it was white collar until checking the oil in the hell hole ruined one of my white shirts one night. Maybe it is for the CA.
Not complaining necessairly, just an observation. Hell of a job for a guy in a white shirt

 

[CatYaaak]

We're paid by the hour not by salary.

Besides, I don't know if pilots are considered white collar. I'd bet many consider us as blue collar. Hourly employees, Union, etc, etc.

Actually, I'm paid a salary.

 

[CatYaaak]

Think you are professional like a doctor or lawyer? As a pilot, can you quit your "practice" and start your own airline?
QUOTE]

Well, judging from the endless posts from pilots and their "expert" opinions on what is the right way to run an airline, who should get paid how much, and how management always sucks, I should think it would be quite easy. This is America after all, and anyone can give it a go, and many have. Just ask any former Kiwi guy.

 

[Rez O. Lewshun]

Actually, I'm paid a salary.

I'd imagine you are a corporate pilot. Guys like you should vote for Bush. When your company prospers so do you... If I flew jets for Goldman Sachs I'd vote for Bush.

However, this logic doesn't apply to organized labor. Many airline pilots will vote for Bush with the logic that if my company does well, then so will I. This logic is flawed in that if, for whatever reason, you no longer work for the company (fired or quit), the company will still be there prospering. But where are you? There is no commitment to quid pro quo.... Thanks for your political vote but we no longer need you.... In addition, with no representation or bargaining rights you gotta take what you get.. (i.e. jB E-190 rates)

Organized labor wants their company to do well. They just want their fair and reasonable share in return for thier contributions to the companies success. Screw that 'choke the golden goose till we get every last egg' Dubinsky mantra...

[caution: this thread is kinda being hijacked...]

The politics of Bush want airline pilots to cycle through employment keeping wages down. Bush politics does not want you to have an airline career! They want new hires as often as they can at first year wages....

But you say Gun Control or abortion (insert your favorite issue here) is too important for me. I just can't vote for Kerry...

Is gun control or abortion more important than your house note and food on the table? That is just the basics... Don't you want your career to prosper as well?

I've heard pilots say "I don't need 300k a year. I'm cool with 150K/year. This is a bad mentaility trap to get into. If 150 is ok, then how about 140. 120? Is 100k ok? If I can negotiate 300k fairly and reasonably then let's do it.... DO you think the company will give you a fair and reasonable career/benefits without employee representation.

Pilots even say I'll just quit being a pilot and find another job if thats the case. This is trash talking but if you aren't willing to defend the profession and abortion/gun control or another issue is more important, then don't sacrifice a great career for the rest of us....

Even so, it isn't black and white. Vote for your issue; which is your airline career and when Kerry tries to push an issue you are against then oppose it. Tackle the issue not the politician!! Sure it is more work than just voting every four years, but democracy and your airline career isn't a spectator sport.....

 

[CCDiscoB]

Rez O. Lewshun

Excellent post.... a lot of food for thought. hummmmmm

 

[FN FAL]

Rez O. Lewshun,

How come such low self-esteem? I consider pilots to be professionals. The snubbing the maid thing is all you. I've never done it nor will I ever. I don't consider myself better than anyone. By the way, is it OK for a doctor to snub the maid?

the maid told me that you snubbed her with "stumpy the meat puppet".

 

[EngineOut]

So, if you're a pilot not covered by the RLA/CBA (corporate or frax), and you make over $100,000 per year, you will no longer be legally entitled to overtime pay(?)

"White-collar employees who earn more than $100,000 a year are automatically exempt from overtime pay under the new law."

Some flight departments classify their pilots as executive-level employees. That sounds "white-collar" (by definition) to me.

I suppose it will depend on the environment in which the pilot works. I can see some companies taking advantage of this.

 

[AA717driver]

So, I'm getting $85k as a corporate pilot and I go in to request overtime for the 11 hour legs with two pilots. Whaddya think the chief pilot is going to say?

BTW, Rez, I'm not voting for Kerry because I don't want some guy worth a Billion bucks controlling my life... Oh, wait, they already do. Never mind. TC

 

[lostplnetairman]

The $100,000 wage cap for non-exempt only applies to those in non-manual positions. And you have to meet one of the tests for exemption as well. So, there is really no way that a $100,000 salaried pilot not covered by the RLA would qualify for exemption. It's really intended for the marketing person who may only supervise one person, for example. Under the old rules, the executive exemption required that you supervise two or more people.

And, unless your in the country of California, overtime is paid for hours over 40 in a week, not over 8 in a day.

HRDiva