New CS Rumors

[On Your Six]

Explain to me how exactly it is not competitive. Find me another Fractional that is competitive in pay and benefits that is currently providing full weekends to all the pilots.

I know some NJA pilots who don't start on weekends - it depends upon seniority and fleet. I suppose you are correct in that some pilots will fly on weekends at NJA. Regardless, it goes against your management's explicit statement that pilot QOL is important to them. Not having complete weekends may be more efficient for them but it is a lame policy. Again, they should really change the pilot-related promotional video that talks about preserving weekends for pilots as quickly as possible (so as to not mislead applicants)...

 

[7777]

If 5% or less of the pilots have to start and stop weekends (depending if others with more seniority don't want to) that still leaves 95% or more of the pilots that would not have to start/stop on weekends. I think the video would still be very accurate.

What I am really enjoying about this whole debate is how nice it is going to be if I get a post military job working at CS. If having to start/stop a tour on a weekend for a year is 'tough' duty, sign my ass up! I can't wait.

Are you feeling me CS?

 

[dime line]

If 5% or less of the pilots have to start and stop weekends (depending if others with more seniority don't want to) that still leaves 95% or more of the pilots that would not have to start/stop on weekends. I think the video would still be very accurate.

What I am really enjoying about this whole debate is how nice it is going to be if I get a post military job working at CS. If having to start/stop a tour on a weekend for a year is 'tough' duty, sign my ass up! I can't wait.

Are you feeling me CS?

Nice, do some work on civ aviation before you leave!

 

[7777]

We actually operate out of a civilian airfield and see what the 135 and 91 guys are doing. My old commander (now retired) is flying 91 stuff now. I see their flights, talk to them daily. I guess if you are saying it is 'rough' because you have to work weekends for awhile, then I am up for that tough life as long as the other benefits of being an employee with CS still apply.

I do like my coffee black though.

 

[flagshipper]

7777, I will admit CS is a top 10 aviation job and the best job I have ever had. I just see this very often and I hate to single you guys out but it always seems to be military guys who have little to no experience in the 91/135 world. They are completely one sided and refuse to find fault in their "dream" civvy job. I am just asking you to be objective and don't put all your eggs in one basket. Also with the CJ1s out the door we are a little overstaffed and recruiting said there will only be about 15-20 newhires the rest of the year so your odds are better at some other fracs.Of course this could all change depending on when you retire.

The weekend start thing is not a big issue because as stated it would only affect a few pilots who have low relative seniority. What the real problem is all this will be implemented without ANY input from the pilot group. They have not asked us in the least what kind of alternative schedules we would like or what start days people prefer. NJ found through a survey that 15 percent of pilots prefer weekend starts so that is their contractual limit of sunday starts. Crazy thought. Ask the pilots!!

7777, As for your question what makes NJ better and why I am interested. 91k flying is by far the hardest flying I have ever done. I believe the number one priority for a frac is support. Pay is about the same at CS and NJ now but can you put a price on your ticket???? NJ has a dispatch department, provides meals so you aren't scrounging for food, transmits information in a timely effecient manner. These sound like small things but when your butt is on the line you have a little more support at NJ than the $8/hr flight followers we have at CS. You ask any captain at CS and that will be their biggest overall concern.

Well enough of my complaining oh and thank you for your service in the armed forces. Military pilots are the best in the world and I mean that. I hope it all works out for you.

 

[7777]

Flagshipper,

Nice post. I realize I don't have 91 or 135 experience at all. I do have plenty of friends doing it (one is a former commander) and they all do it out of the airfield we work out of. I hear, talk, watch all that goes on. I know the difference between good and bad support from flight operations as well as maintenance. I have had plenty of time to decide what I want and to be honest, it is CS. Wether I get it or not is another matter but for everything I want, they have it.

I personally don't want someone else filing my flight plans, planning my routes around weather, giving me my alternates, planning my meals, ect.. I have NEVER had anyone do that for me. I have been doing it myself for my whole flying career. Some who have never been in the military don't understand how we have operated or operate. Pilots, particularly the PIC is in charge of EVERYTHING from arranging our own hotels, meals, rental cars, diplomatic clearances, customs, ect.. I have been carrying the same lunch box with me in the airplane for 20+ years. We are doing it all and I LOVE IT. CS has you file your own flight plans, and seem to give the pilots some relative autonomy in their flight decision making...that is right down my alley. I guess I don't want someone sitting at a desk telling me where and how I am going to fly my mission. That, in my book is for me to decide, plan and execute.

Things I expect? I expect camraderie (spelling?) out of my fellow employees. I expect to have a GREAT time on the road with my PIC/Captain. I expect to learn from my PIC/Captain. I expect to be rewarded/appreciated for my hard work, by everyone and they will receive the same respect from me, ect..

I look forward to someday working for CS. I do not look forward to my last day in the military, even if I win Powerball or any other lotto. I LOVE IT! My decision to leave is going to strictly be a monetary one for getting my kids through college. My wife and I already have decided we would go back in if we found the civilian side is not what we wanted. I would NOT hesitate.

Anyways, that is where I am coming from. I know there are going to be plenty of guys/gals I fly with who will not understand my background and I will remain silent and nod my head when they complain about how rough they have it.

I hope one day you can get the job you really want. To be honest, I don't think there is any such thing as the perfect job.

Best of luck to you Flagshipper.

BTW, I love your honesty.

 

[Diesel]

I personally don't want someone else filing my flight plans, planning my routes around weather, giving me my alternates, planning my meals, ect.. I have NEVER had anyone do that for me. I have been doing it myself for my whole flying career. Some who have never been in the military don't understand how we have operated or operate.

Wait till you're humping 5 legs a day. You'll be glad you have the support to do the work for you.

 

[Mooneymite]

Dispatcher is your friend!

Wait till you're humping 5 legs a day. You'll be glad you have the support to do the work for you.

Amen!

Professional dispatchers can keep you out of trouble. They have access to the best flight planning tools and provide a "second opinion" when things get rushed.

They know what all those obscure NOTAM abreviations mean and look at the performance/weather long before you even know you're going to be flying the leg.

Not enjoying the benefits of a professional dispatcher would be analogous to the captain that doesn't understand the value of a co-pilot. It's all about CRM!

 

[Sparse]

The weekend start thing is not a big issue because as stated it would only affect a few pilots who have low relative seniority.

It's not a big issue unless you are one of those who will get the weekend start, when you came to work for this company planning on having every other weekend off and holidays off every other year. If you are one of those, it's a big issue.

What the real problem is all this will be implemented without ANY input from the pilot group. They have not asked us in the least what kind of alternative schedules we would like or what start days people prefer.

You are absolutely correct. I suggest letting them know how you feel now. Write, call, email, your ACP and JD.

 

[SKYLAWYER]

It's not a big issue unless you are one of those who will get the weekend start, when you came to work for this company planning on having every other weekend off and holidays off every other year. If you are one of those, it's a big issue.

What about the guys who came to work here planning on making 40K to start, lower 401K matches, training during off weeks, no written duty day rules, lower overtime pay, no OT unless you got home after 2 am on your last, should they be mad also? All of these things changed from the company they all signed up for. Lets go back to the way this was before and in exchange everyone can have weekends off again. Negotiations and marriage are all about compromise. You gained the abundance of items above for having a small number of crews work weekends for a limited time until their seniority can hold another schedule.