New bid at CAL

[Andy]

Guys, UAL has zero furloughees that were tossed out while still on the 777/400. In fact, most furloughees were A320 or 300 drivers by the time they got "surplused". Very few furloughees went directly from the 767 to the unemployment line. That means the most senior furloughed pilot with a Summer 1999 hire date was making about $86 and change with a couple of 767 guys making about $101.

Remember this, the top 1100 or so furloughees on the street from UAL have been furloughed twice and have NOT been accrueing longevity for pay purposes.

Saying "it blows" is a dramatic understatement.

SCR

Dude, there were a lot of senior pilots who took the voluntary furlough. When I retired from the AF Reserve last fall (collecting Active Duty retirement), I took one of the J4J positions at Skywest. One of the UAL guys in the class used to be a 777FO with well more than 12 yrs on property. I resigned from Skywest a few days into training but there were a lot that stuck it out.

As for me, I was furloughed off of the 75/76 (was on mil lv) in May 2009 at 3rd year pay (waaay too much furlough time; was hired Jun 2000). Yeah, I'll do bottom reserve out of EWR for $88/hr.
But I'm getting old and I get fatigued a lot easier than all you young bucks. And since I don't need the money (my retirement check is more than enough + wife still active duty), I have no problems informing schedulers that I'm too fatigued to fly on any occasion that they try to push me. I lose pay over it? Not a threat; we're banking money every month without me working.

 

[pilotgolfer]

Its good to see your arrogance didn't wear off, Andy. How did your hedge fund work out for you?

 

[Andy]

Its good to see your arrogance didn't wear off, Andy. How did your hedge fund work out for you?

It worked out very well; I shut it down after making enough to live on for the rest of my life. Probably not what you wanted to hear - I assume you were looking for a schadenfreude moment.

 

[SoCentralRain]

Dude, there were a lot of senior pilots who took the voluntary furlough. When I retired from the AF Reserve last fall (collecting Active Duty retirement), I took one of the J4J positions at Skywest. One of the UAL guys in the class used to be a 777FO with well more than 12 yrs on property. I resigned from Skywest a few days into training but there were a lot that stuck it out.

As for me, I was furloughed off of the 75/76 (was on mil lv) in May 2009 at 3rd year pay (waaay too much furlough time; was hired Jun 2000). Yeah, I'll do bottom reserve out of EWR for $88/hr.
But I'm getting old and I get fatigued a lot easier than all you young bucks. And since I don't need the money (my retirement check is more than enough + wife still active duty), I have no problems informing schedulers that I'm too fatigued to fly on any occasion that they try to push me. I lose pay over it? Not a threat; we're banking money every month without me working.

Andy, what I should have said in my original post was involuntarily furloughed pilots off of the 400/777. Yes, I know, there were plenty of people in the 75/76 when they got the involuntary boot. You were one of them.

I actually didn't know of any 400/777 guys that took the voluntary furlough. In fact, there's at least one -400 Captain that took it--maybe more. I find quite satisfying the irony/humor in the idea of him returning w/CAL as a 737 FO making $190/hr to tell their crew desk to pound sand when they try to work him like a 29 year old new hire.

SCR

 

[Andy]

Andy, what I should have said in my original post was involuntarily furloughed pilots off of the 400/777. Yes, I know, there were plenty of people in the 75/76 when they got the involuntary boot. You were one of them.

I actually didn't know of any 400/777 guys that took the voluntary furlough. In fact, there's at least one -400 Captain that took it--maybe more. I find quite satisfying the irony/humor in the idea of him returning w/CAL as a 737 FO making $190/hr to tell their crew desk to pound sand when they try to work him like a 29 year old new hire.

SCR

Ah, gotcha. Sorry for the misinterpretation.
I went ahead and looked at some old SSC minutes (Dec 09 report, after completion of all furloughs). It showed that there were 190 pilots who accepted voluntary furlough and would not have been furloughed. I'm sure that more than a few of them will end up coming back, as two years is a good amount of time off to do whatever you want to do. The ex-777 pilot I met a Skywest had taken VLOA to get in a new company working on alternative aircraft propulsion systems - unfortunately the grants fell through and quite frankly, it sounded a bit moonbatish.

I also anticipate a higher recall acceptance rate this time around for several reasons:
1) The economy is still bad.
2) The furlough time isn't as long as last time (I spent 5 yrs furloughed last time - will probably be four years for me this time around).
3) With mandatory age 65 retirements kicking in Dec 2012, the combined company will be losing quite a few pilots every month.
Last time, ~2/3 of the pilots came back. I'd be surprised if the number is under 80% this time around.

I remember one senior pilot who took a voluntary furlough in '08 to devote more time to being a realtor in Vegas. Ouch! I expect him to be jumping on the first recall opportunity.
I've been working on a startup business with a friend in the last year but the margins are brutally thin in this economy; as an owner, you end up working for less than minimum wage once you factor in all of the hours you put in. It's been fun and a great learning experience but I'm in the process of turning everything over to my friend.

 

[Skippy]

This will be interesting to throw 200 United pilots into the reserve fray with crappy workrules. Sick calls will go through the roof a month after the first guy hits IOE.

BINGO! just wait til the cal side gets a dose of UAL entitlement and pissed offness!

i got ur double pump right here

 

[Andy]

BINGO! just wait til the cal side gets a dose of UAL entitlement and pissed offness!

i got ur double pump right here

Skippy, do you think entitlement is the correct word? I'm not going to fly a plane when I'm likely to fall asleep shortly after leveloff. Sure, cruise flight doesn't have a high accident potential, but if you're that tired, how safe are you during critical phases of flight?

As for pissed offness, you have a valid point. I've worked past most of that, although I pin a good portion of my anger toward alpo and the UAL pilots who voted to increase flying hours while I was on furlough. I actually look forward to working with CAL crewmembers; they seem to do take care of their junior employees much better than UAL.

 

[luckytohaveajob]

I actually look forward to working with CAL crewmembers; they seem to do take care of their junior employees much better than UAL.

we will see

 

[densoo]

I actually look forward to working with CAL crewmembers; they seem to do take care of their junior employees much better than UAL.

As strange as it is to say, this may be true, simply based on the fact that all the junior UAL pilots, and them some, aren't getting a UAL paycheck right now.