NetJets Unrest Puts Warren Buffett in a Rare Pinch

[Mooneymite]

...... I sure think so because I can tell you this it can't get any worse. .....

Oh, brother!

I hope you wrote this for rhetorical effect because, things can (and probably will) get lots worse.

 

[Diesel]

Oh, brother!

I hope you wrote this for rhetorical effect because, things can (and probably will) get lots worse.

It will get worse but someone who has skin in the game would be a better fit. Like familyguy said.

 

[G4dude]

I'm not saying it would happen.

But think of how many owners would sign back up if someone like RTS came back and bought us. They would know that the experience, product, and exclusiveness would come back.

Food for thought. Sadly I don't think we'll be sold.

I suspect Warren might be the best owner, only because he feels, strangely enough, that we complement his other business holdings. I don't understand his thinking, but he is smarter than I am. Any other owner would be motivated by the profit of NJA on its own. Even Santulli.

 

[HiSpeedFlyer]

I am not saying it does not have anything to do with WB. I do not know whether it does -- but I know I did not say it. The point I was trying to make is that for months (or years) I have read so much on this site about how afraid WB is of negative publicity. The conclusion is that since he is "so scared" the union has leverage. All I am posing is "what if he is not all that scared of negative publicity??" Well -- the negative publicity "cat is now out of the bag".

IF I were you, I would consider re reading my contract and seeing if there are any caveats in case of a strike. Because that is the road Jordan and Warren are heading downward.
Jus' Sayin'.

 

[G4dude]

The sky is falling argument.

Do you think the company would be better off if WB sells us? I sure think so because I can tell you this it can't get any worse.

Whomever buys us which is doubtful it would ever happen sadly, would hopefully bring in excitement, forward thinking, and a love of aviation. Sadly all those people have left the building.

Do you really think WB selling us is a bad thing? How much worse can it get?

Is that why you are so scared to rock the boat?

I believe Warren selling us would be bad for us. His ownership of NJA serves a synergistic function with his other companies as well as a profit center in itself. A new owner would insist on return on investment as the only reason to buy us, making downward pressure on our pay more intense. That's what I think. It could get a lot worse. I worked for several other operators, and NJA is far and away better than they were. Even with our current frustrations and concerns.

 

[pilotyip]

I worked for several other operators, and NJA is far and away better than they were. Even with our current frustrations and concerns.

well said, I know many who work there who share your feelings, but they are not as outgoing as you because they don't want the hassles from 10250 crowd.

 

[Diesel]

I believe Warren selling us would be bad for us. His ownership of NJA serves a synergistic function with his other companies as well as a profit center in itself. A new owner would insist on return on investment as the only reason to buy us, making downward pressure on our pay more intense. That's what I think. It could get a lot worse. I worked for several other operators, and NJA is far and away better than they were. Even with our current frustrations and concerns.

Haha. You really haven't been listening.

The reason they want concessions from us is because we aren't making ENOUGH of a return of investment to brk. So how is that any different than someone else buying us and wanting an roi?

We are synergetic with anyone. We are just moving money from our pocket to another brk company and making our side look bad. Why is that we don't get a discount at fsi for training when every other operator in the world does.

Maybe if they gave us a discount that roi would be good enough and we wouldn't have to take pay cuts to make the numbers work better.

I do like how you think cutting benefits, pay, vacation, sick time, and 32 other points are just a "concern" at what point do you go from concerned to down right pissed? When we lose everything?

 

[Diesel]

well said, I know many who work there who share your feelings, but they are not as outgoing as you because they don't want the hassles from 10250 crowd.

Yip you'll never see 10/250 in your life so I'm not sure why you're so interested about it here.

Why haven't you gone over to the majors side yet and thrown your union hate speech there?

 

[gunfyter]

Year 10 NJA sic $81,081 (with college degree and associated 6 figure student loan debt PLUS flight training loan debt)


Walmart truck driver: $84K.

1-888-BIG RIGS

 

[G4dude]

The sky is falling argument.

Do you think the company would be better off if WB sells us? I sure think so because I can tell you this it can't get any worse.

Whomever buys us which is doubtful it would ever happen sadly, would hopefully bring in excitement, forward thinking, and a love of aviation. Sadly all those people have left the building.

Do you really think WB selling us is a bad thing? How much worse can it get?

Is that why you are so scared to rock the boat?

Good post and good questions. My emotions want Santulli back in control. But I believe a buyer, even him, would squeeze us to extract more profit, because, unlike Warren and his synergy theory, profit would be the only reason to buy us. Therefore, I tend to think our best chance lies with Warren owning us. Not a perfect world, but the best we can get in the real world. Having said that, I REALLY would like Harry Potter to go away.

 

[G4dude]

well said, I know many who work there who share your feelings, but they are not as outgoing as you because they don't want the hassles from 10250 crowd.

Thanks. Almost all I fly with agree with me, and they marvel at my willingness to post on this message board.

 

[Diesel]

Good post and good questions. My emotions want Santulli back in control. But I believe a buyer, even him, would squeeze us to extract more profit, because, unlike Warren and his synergy theory, profit would be the only reason to buy us. Therefore, I tend to think our best chance lies with Warren owning us. Not a perfect world, but the best we can get in the real world. Having said that, I REALLY would like Harry Potter to go away.

That we can all agree on.

He has no business running a service industry at all.

He will go down in history. Not for anything good, but because of the way he ran this company into the ground.

 

[Diesel]

Thanks. Almost all I fly with agree with me, and they marvel at my willingness to post on this message board.

If everyone agrees with you why has many pilots pulled you aside and said you've been wrong on so many levels?

 

[G4dude]

If everyone agrees with you why has many pilots pulled you aside and said you've been wrong on so many levels?

Good question. In person, two guys disagree with me (gutshotdraw being one), and do so respectfully. All the other disagreement is on this board, where the more vehement union supporters spend time. I am overwhelmingly agreed with by all the others I fly with when we discuss this stuff. They just avoid the message boards, and they have told me this.

 

[Diesel]

Good question. In person, two guys disagree with me (gutshotdraw being one), and do so respectfully. All the other disagreement is on this board, where the more vehement union supporters spend time. I am overwhelmingly agreed with by all the others I fly with when we discuss this stuff. They just avoid the message boards, and they have told me this.

They avoid staying informed. It's an easy way to pretend the world isn't crashing around you. Those that are retiring are the most involved though because they understand what's at stake.

The reality is though that the majority of the pilots don't agree with you. Even the most die hard NJ supporters in the fleet are changing. They see what the company is doing especially with the latest round of underhanded tactics by the "lone wolf" .

Even when my inbox fills up with PM's about your identity I tell them he's choosing to stay anonymous, so I think a lot more tell you what you want to hear versus the numbers.

 

[G4dude]

They avoid staying informed. It's an easy way to pretend the world isn't crashing around you. Those that are retiring are the most involved though because they understand what's at stake.

The reality is though that the majority of the pilots don't agree with you. Even the most die hard NJ supporters in the fleet are changing. They see what the company is doing especially with the latest round of underhanded tactics by the "lone wolf" .

Even when my inbox fills up with PM's about your identity I tell them he's choosing to stay anonymous, so I think a lot more tell you what you want to hear versus the numbers.

My colleagues have no reason to lie to me. I am among the most laid back pilots here. We in the Guffstream have a free market view, that's all. Most of us that is.

 

[Diesel]

My colleagues have no reason to lie to me. I am among the most laid back pilots here. We in the Guffstream have a free market view, that's all. Most of us that is.

Uhhuh.

 

[imacdog]

How did that free market work out for all the nonunion NJA employees who lost their benefits when Sokol took over?

 

[Diesel]

I wonder how the Gulfstream fa's feel about that free market view when they lost their 401k matching but nobody else did. Hmmmm?

 

[ghostrider64]

My colleagues have no reason to lie to me. I am among the most laid back pilots here. We in the Guffstream have a free market view, that's all. Most of us that is.

You really need to tell this to any first year psych major.

"My coworkers have no reason to lie" maybe they just want to placate your inept attitude, path of least resistance, is in fact human nature. Please exercise your "free market" by going ahead and taking the cuts your beloved managers want, and paying the savings forward to the FOs who are fighting like hell to survive and to get a much better CBA, because all you are doing is hurting them.

Then after you've taken those cuts, again exercise your "free market" mentality by becoming a greeter at Walmart, you've earned the blue vest.