NetJets pilot negotiations update

[CatYaaak]

Actually, I'm glad a potential customer noticed we are over 2 years past the contract ammendable date. Maybe he'll talk to some of his buddies that are NetJet owners and they'll let Santulli know their concerns.

I wouldn't hold out any hope that many, if any, owners will do the Teamsters lobbying for you.

 

[Majik]

I wouldn't hold out any hope that many, if any, owners will do the Teamsters lobbying for you.

You may be right, that many may not care if their service stands a chance at getting interrupted for a while. Probably wouldn't even mind flying commercial, paying for charter or postponing their travel while they wait for the pilots to come back to work. I wonder if they would have to continue paying management fees while they wait. They are generally a patient and understanding group. You may be right, that they are probably not the type that would pick up a phone and voice their concerns to Santulli.

Or, you may be wrong... Maybe more than a handful might voice their concerns if they became aware that there may be a problem looming in the future. I like to "Hope for the best but expect the worse". Maybe I'll be pleasantly surprised that way.

 

[CatYaaak]

Or maybe

You may be right, that many may not care if their service stands a chance at getting interrupted for a while. Probably wouldn't even mind flying commercial, paying for charter or postponing their travel while they wait for the pilots to come back to work. I wonder if they would have to continue paying management fees while they wait. They are generally a patient and understanding group. You may be right, that they are probably not the type that would pick up a phone and voice their concerns to Santulli.

Or, you may be wrong... Maybe more than a handful might voice their concerns if they became aware that there may be a problem looming in the future. I like to "Hope for the best but expect the worse". Maybe I'll be pleasantly surprised that way.

Oh, they will care about an "interruption of service" all right, no doubt about it. And someone will pick up the phone; probably the General Counsel of thier company, demanding that their contract be fulfilled. Except as a matter of passing interest, do you really think they're going to care WHY an airplane doesn't show up on the ramp? Maybe, they will come to the conclusion that contracting with a company using Teamsters = labor problems (like so many other companies), unpredictability, hassles for them, and choose not to renew their contracts when the time comes. And contract renewal time always comes, memories are long, and you don't become the kind of sucessful business that needs, and can afford, access to their own private jet/s without being willing and able to change with a changing climate.

They're smart enough to know NetJets isn't the only game in town, that they have other options. Maybe they'll choose a non-union fractional or buy their own airplanes/hire their own pilots that they can always depend on to be there. If they fly a lot (over appx. 400 hrs/year) it's less expensive to have their own flight department anyway, and they never go on strike. I'm sure you'll keep a few actors and golfers around though, but don't count on those owners running serious businesses or companies that use you as supplemental uplift sticking around.

If your "product" becomes as unreliable as the airlines because of protracted labor disputes, they'll treat you as such....and vote with their feet just like they were doing when they bought into your program in the first place. They were sold Reliability and Convenience, but they surely aren't a captive audience like your flip-flop, lowest fare-seeking, no-other-option airline crowd who always come back if the ticket price is right no matter how much they've been screwed in the past.

I hope you get your raises, etc., but IMO (an opinon based on 14 years of corporate and fractional flying) the act of going on strike (becoming unreliable) would be counterproductive because of the nature of your customer base. Without those who ultimately pay the bills and your salary, even the gravy-est of Gravy Train contracts "won" from Management won't mean squat for very long. If you do go strike, I'd suggest holding out for a non-furlough clause too. Good luck.

 

[Majik]

Re: Or maybe

Oh, they will care about an "interruption of service" all right, no doubt about it. And someone will pick up the phone; probably the General Counsel of thier company, demanding that their contract be fulfilled.

CatYaaak,
Now that sounds exactly like what I was talking about. I heard that in June 2001 the owners received a 6% increase in management fees (to pay anticipated increases in pilot salaries). Problem was, those increases never got passed to the pilots. Note: A 5% increase in management fees would double current pilot salaries.
Now if I were an owner, and you raised my fees and told me the reason was because you needed to pay the pilots more, then, when my service looks like it might be interrupted and I discover that one of the biggest reasons was because the CEO never spent the money for the reason he stated, then I might be miffed and pick up the phone and make my disappointment known.

Santulli has to weigh all of the things you mentioned in the remainder of your last post. He can either increase pilot salaries with the money he's previously collected from the owners, or, he can take a chance that a potential disruption in owner services will not damage current customer relations and future sales. Does he want to see a strike? Heck no. Does he want to give up a big pot of "extra" money he's been holding on to for over 2 1/2 years. Probably not but it may be a better choice than the alternative. I think Santulli is a smart man and will make the best decision for the long-term benefit of the company and it's pilots.

 

[CE750Driver]

Re: Or maybe

Maybe they'll choose a non-union fractional or buy their own airplanes/hire their own pilots that they can always depend on to be there. If they fly a lot (over appx. 400 hrs/year) it's less expensive to have their own flight department anyway, and they never go on strike. I'm sure you'll keep a few actors and golfers around though, but don't count on those owners running serious businesses or companies that use you as supplemental uplift sticking around.

Uhhhhhh, yeah, and thats why Netjets sells more shares, and more importantly has the highest retention in the idustry, even being more expensive, and Union........ As you make that sound bad.

Could be.

By the way, this will never get to a strike.

 

[Webslinger]

Netjets

I left Netjets in 2000 because of the money! Good company and good people to fly with- excellent training also. Except I got tired of Santulli working our asses off while ripping off his own customers- All the while Teamsters not doing crap for us. So you have a choice as I did. Do something about it or leave.
Just my $.02cents. Fly safe Gents.

 

[Lrjet55]

Webslinger, good move.

Good people, good company and good training dont help you pay the bills.

Where you at now?

 

[Lrjet55]

I've heard the same thing and its a good rumor. Hopefully true.

 

[buttercup]

SWA pay wages my ass!! When you fly with guys that are just happy to be flying jets all day and you hear b.s. like," I'd be fine with a 20% pay increase or I don't think it's realistic to have 100% retro" I'll believe it when I see it.. The sad thing is most NetJets Pilots don't quite understand how much leverage they have!!

 

[marqmarq]

another .02

about the schedule.... the 7/7 was used very efficiently by EJM when the 'float' existed. All 'line holders' had a 7/7 sched and all others had the flex which had 7 day tours and a minimum of a 5 day off period and a maximum of 17 days in any month (and they usually worked less days overall than line holders). It seemed to work out well for everyone, the only drawback for our flex people was that they did not know schedule for the following month until the 20th of the month before, but they were able to request certain days off the schedulers tried to work with them on that.

 

[Lrjet55]

Its all the company working over the union. Do you really think any family man would actuially choose to be gone 7 days a time. Hell no. This 7/7 schedule is one of the most contentious items in the new contract. The company is making the union think it doesnt want it when in fact the company is just trying to make sure we dont ask for anything else.
Our union keeps telling us that the company is motivated to complete the contract yet they will always tell you that the company negotiators often show up completely unprepared. The company is in full control of the negotiation process, not the other way around. Its like throwing a ball with a dog, the dog will just go back for more, and more and more... eventually the dog will get tired but what will it do nothing, fall asleep. Were just getting the run around.
The sad part is if this contract actually came through, IMHO, this job could be just as good as a major. There are alot of factors to weigh and the money, no commuting, flying, etc. could make NJA a great career. As it stands now its just a steping stone like the regionals, except with rediculous mins for hire, and Santulli will probably try to keep it this way. I honestly hope I get to eat my words but lets not all hold our breath.