need some resume examples

[350DRIVER]

First, let me ask you something 350. How much time do you think someone would have to read that cover letter? The cover letter should be no more than three paragraphs, with only 3-4 sentences per paragraph. Think about when you read a newspaper. You are scanning for information; same with a cover letter. A cover letter is designed to get them to read the resume, not convey your life story.

Second, there are many things you included on the resume that I strongly advise against. No cell phone number for the reasons that Tony stated. No personal information for EEOC reasons. Putting the availability can work for or against you, depending upon your availability.

I also disagree that the format does not matter. If it is not readable, you bet it matters. Further, if you do not have the correct format for online applications, and you try to just post a regular Word document in the form, you will see what a bad format will do on the other end that gets received by HR. I just did a whole television segment on this very topic.

You are correct that what is in the content of the resume matters. But never assume that "everyone knows what a pilot does." The first people who review resumes are most likely either HR Clerks or Computers. If you do not have the keywords in the resume, and you think the computer or the HR clerk knows what a pilot does, you are sadly mistaken. Remember, never ASSUME. (you know what that means! )

Am I a brain surgeon? Nope. But I will tell you this. I did hiring for many years, 40 hours a week (or more), 49-50 weeks per year. I have HR people come to me to have their resume done. That, to me, speaks volumes.

Everyone has their specialty; this happens to be mine. As you have seen in this thread, I have had a lot of happy people who have gotten interviews. I have done resumes for pilots that are looking for other things and also relatives of pilots who are not even in the aviation business.

I do not consider my services a "waste of money." As I have said before, if people can do their own resume and cover letter, I think that is great. I have had people come to me with documents that were fine the way they were. I do not take people's money if I feel that there does not need to be any improvement.

I recently had a gentleman who was applying for a Postal Inspector position who wanted me to look over his Federal KSA's (Knowledge, Skills and Abilities). Now, that could have meant a LOT of money for me because it takes a great deal of time to put those together. Not only did I tell him they were fine the way they were, but I did not take a DIME from him for reviewing them.

I believe very strongly in integrity in my business. If someone needs help, I will tell them; conversely, if they don't, I will tell them that also.

Kathy

Kathy,

With all due respect to you and the time that you have invested in this side of the business, I simply just disagree with you on a few minor issues. I can think of many different types of formats, resumes, cover letters, etc, etc, that I have seen used with the desired outcome being achieved. . The above example has worked extremely well for myself and quite a few others that have used it. I used to screen, review resumes with hr to bring interview applicants in (part 135) so I tend to think that I am somewhat well versed in this area, not just my opinion with no prior "experience" to back it up. I also knew some pretty senior people within Delta hr and they pretty much said the same from.

I could care less on the format they used as most of the other hr people and captains on the board, it did not matter (plain and simple) nor did it make or break that person when called in for the 2 on 1. The important factor(s) were what was on that piece of paper they call a "resume", ex> (flight times, experience, multi-engine time, turbine time, accomplishments, etc, etc.) You can put lipstick, perfume, or whatever else you so choose to put on the resume but without the areas of substance as in flight times, experience, work history, etc, it will not matter much. I have seen some very impressive resumes that were great, only problem was that the applicant really was lacking in the credentials area.


Not to be a smart a$$ but a resume no matter how nice and "proper" that it may be isn't going to do anyone a whole lot of good if they don't have the times, experience, work history, etc, to put down on that piece of paper. The resume is only as impressive as the applicant.

First, let me ask you something 350. How much time do you think someone would have to read that cover letter? The cover letter should be no more than three paragraphs, with only 3-4 sentences per paragraph. Think about when you read a newspaper. You are scanning for information; same with a cover letter. A cover letter is designed to get them to read the resume, not convey your life story.

The majority of cover letters that we received surely were not limited to 3 paragraphs or less and needless to say HR, myself, and most all others took the time to fully read the entire cover letter.


Ask 10 different people and you will get many different responses so take your pick.


many ways to get the interview, a resume format/layout is only a small factor in getting the call to come in and interview.

The cell number is a given, I and most everyone else includes it on the resume and will continue to do so for many reasons.

Kathy,

In no way was I trying to point fingers at you, I can only wish you the best of luck and hope that you continue to prosper in this business. I was merely giving my perspective, point of view, opinion to some extent which hopefully not everyone will buy into.

personal preference



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[Resume Writer]

I agree with what Tony and Dash8Driver have said.

The sentence that I found ironic was the "brief" letter. That letter was anything but brief!

Dash is right on with what goes into the paragraphs. I have a degree in Technical Writing and Journalism. If you think about the 5 W's and H of journalism, (who, what, where, when, why and how), you can write a good letter.

Who you are
What qualifications you possess
Why you would like a job with their company
When you would be available or would like to speak with them
Where or How you can be reached

There you have it. I spent thousands of dollars for those 6 words!!

Kathy

 

[350DRIVER]

I agree with what Tony and Dash8Driver have said.

The sentence that I found ironic was the "brief" letter. That letter was anything but brief!

Dash is right on with what goes into the paragraphs. I have a degree in Technical Writing and Journalism. If you think about the 5 W's and H of journalism, (who, what, where, when, why and how), you can write a good letter.

Who you are
What qualifications you possess
Why you would like a job with their company
When you would be available or would like to speak with them
Where or How you can be reached

There you have it. I spent thousands of dollars for those 6 words!!

Kathy

Different strokes for different folks...

The original poster wanted a few examples and that is exactly what he got, like it or not.


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[bobbysamd]

Writing your own resume v. Resume Writer

Everyone has their specialty; this happens to be mine. As you have seen in this thread, I have had a lot of happy people who have gotten interviews. I have done resumes for pilots that are looking for other things and also relatives of pilots who are not even in the aviation business.

I do not consider my services a "waste of money." As I have said before, if people can do their own resume and cover letter, I think that is great. I have had people come to me with documents that were fine the way they were. I do not take people's money if I feel that there does not need to be any improvement.

I can write my own resumes and cover letters and I do feel a professional in any field needs to be sufficiently competent and capable to prepare his/her own resume, but maybe doing so is like doing your own taxes with Turbo Tax as opposed to going to an accountant. I've done that as well - even prepared my taxes myself manually for twenty years (my B.S.B.A. is in Accounting). Both ways work, but which yields better results?

I essentially copped Kit's format and incorporated ideas I had seen in books and on associates' resumes. I did get interviews. Maybe if Kathy had worked up my materials, I would have had more interviews. Hindsight is 20/20, but learn from those who walked the same path before.

 

[dash8driver]

Kathy,

With all due respect to you and the time that you have invested in this side of the business, I simply just disagree with you on a few minor issues. I can think of many different types of formats, resumes, cover letters, etc, etc, that I have seen used with the desired outcome being achieved.

i dont think she means (and i dont mean) there is one magic format and thats what you have to go with. anyone will admit there are many possible formats. the idea is to use one of the many possible good formats. a good format is one thats not cluttered, easy to read, you know.. make sure the good info is easy to find.

"good format" does not include stuff like whether use a thick or thin line across the top, a choice between two perfectly good fonts (well, ya dont wanna use the dingbat font thats for sure), etc.

to some people having it presented well, etc (in a good format) is common sense.. but its not so common. there are people out there who dont see that their sloppy resume is just that, sloppy. which some employers may or may not use to determine that they dont want a sloppy person at their company.

350, you're right..he did ask for help and he's getting it. not only in examples of resume, but in commentary about the examples. this is all help for him.. i'm sure he's taking all the points everyone is making and learning what he needs to from it....like the commentary or not.

 

[TonyC]

...(well, ya dont wanna use the dingbat font thats for sure), ...

Especially those Zapf dingbats!


LOL

 

[350DRIVER]

dash,

Good points and hopefully he is able to use some of this information to help with his project. My only objective was to provide him with "examples" for use during his project work, not a "mine is better than yours" debate.

If I had to do it again I would have just pmed it to him, less problems that way.. lol


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[dash8driver]

If I had to do it again I would have just pmed it to him, less problems that way.. lol


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but it wouldnt have been nearly as fun....

 

[Resume Writer]

Not to be a smart a$$ but a resume no matter how nice and "proper" that it may be isn't going to do anyone a whole lot of good if they don't have the times, experience, work history, etc, to put down on that piece of paper. The resume is only as impressive as the applicant.


The majority of cover letters that we received surely were not limited to 3 paragraphs or less and needless to say HR, myself, and most all others took the time to fully read the entire cover letter.


Ask 10 different people and you will get many different responses so take your pick.


The cell number is a given, I and most everyone else includes it on the resume and will continue to do so for many reasons.

Kathy,

In no way was I trying to point fingers at you, I can only wish you the best of luck and hope that you continue to prosper in this business. I was merely giving my perspective, point of view, opinion to some extent which hopefully not everyone will buy into.

personal preference



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350,

Let me address a few things that you said. First, you cannot "make a purse from a sow's ear." Of course the candidate has to be qualified. One thing that you do not know is that I spend a great deal of time with my candidates, both aviation and other, asking about their goals. If their goals are unrealistic, I tell them so. I also counsel them on the correct path to take for their specific career.

Second, I disagree about the cell phone on the resume. I teach my clients to control when and where a telephone screen happens. Several of my HR friends have said that they will not even call a cell phone. My opinion of this was backed up by Carol Kleiman, who is a syndicated columnist for the Tribune newspapers and an HR expert, when she wrote a column based upon my press release that was sent out on this very issue.

Third, I never said that a cover letter should be "less" than three paragraphs. When I was screening candidates for an aviation employer last fall, one cover letter said, and I quote:

"Here are my qualifications, call me if you are interested."

Where do you think his stuff went???

Fourth, how big was the operation that you worked at reviewing resumes? How many candidate resumes did you review?

Employers now are getting between 200-500 resumes for EVERY position they post. That does not include the "broadcast" letters they get for positions they do not post. I was just speaking at a Career Expo that had over 6500 candidates in attendance. There were 108 companies. Do the math. How much time do you think was given for the "once over" of the resumes? About 15-30 seconds. Just like in a regular hiring situation.

350, while I do not doubt that you have some experience in this field, I must defer to the research I have conducted over 18 years of being a resume writer. I am the Career Expert for 5 job boards in 5 different states, 2 more job boards in the Tech field, one in the aviation industry, and one located overseas for the hospitality industry. You do not get to that status by not knowing the hiring industry.

In addition, I write on a contract basis for Monster.com. Believe me, you do not write for Monster unless you KNOW what you are doing and are successful. If their candidates are not successful, you do not work for them very long. I have been writing for them for over two years. Recently one of my resume writing colleagues was turned down by Monster to write for them. They only take the best writers. I also write resume for candidates across the country and world for recruiters.

I know you are not trying to be disrespectful to me or my business. However, I do not do this business "part-time" or for kicks. I spent a great deal of time and money knowing everything that is going on in many industries. That is the perfectionist part of me that wants to make sure my clients have the best information possible.

Just my two cents on this topic.

Kathy

 

[paid4training]

First of all thanks for ALL the replies. I have taken all the information from each reply and also used all critiques and comments regarding this issue. This is why I believe the "creators" of this site developed and maintain this site for this purpose. To assist those who are trying to access the wisdom from the aviation community. Thanks again to everyone responding…

 

[dash8driver]

i dont think the cell # on the resume wont necessarily make or break you. it can put you in a situation you dont want to be in if you're not careful. i've usually listed it on my resumes. i listed it for a few reasons and i'm not saying they are good reasons. at one point i had to because i didnt have a land line, didnt need one. the other reason's i've chosen to list it is because i cant stand waiting.. i wanna know right away if they're calling me. i controlled the call by not answering it unless i was in a position to talk to HR, if i wasnt they left a message just like they would have if they called my house. i would then, in all my anticipation and excitement, take myself to a place that i can return the call and call them back. another reason to consider listing a cell phone is you may not want HR calling when you're not home and your drunk roommates are watching pr0n at full volume. or you may have bad roommates, intentional or unintentionally not giving you your messages for whatever reason.

 

[350DRIVER]

350,

Let me address a few things that you said. First, you cannot "make a purse from a sow's ear." Of course the candidate has to be qualified. One thing that you do not know is that I spend a great deal of time with my candidates, both aviation and other, asking about their goals. If their goals are unrealistic, I tell them so. I also counsel them on the correct path to take for their specific career.

Second, I disagree about the cell phone on the resume. I teach my clients to control when and where a telephone screen happens. Several of my HR friends have said that they will not even call a cell phone. My opinion of this was backed up by Carol Kleiman, who is a syndicated columnist for the Tribune newspapers and an HR expert, when she wrote a column based upon my press release that was sent out on this very issue.

Third, I never said that a cover letter should be "less" than three paragraphs. When I was screening candidates for an aviation employer last fall, one cover letter said, and I quote:

"Here are my qualifications, call me if you are interested."

Where do you think his stuff went???

Fourth, how big was the operation that you worked at reviewing resumes? How many candidate resumes did you review?

Employers now are getting between 200-500 resumes for EVERY position they post. That does not include the "broadcast" letters they get for positions they do not post. I was just speaking at a Career Expo that had over 6500 candidates in attendance. There were 108 companies. Do the math. How much time do you think was given for the "once over" of the resumes? About 15-30 seconds. Just like in a regular hiring situation.

350, while I do not doubt that you have some experience in this field, I must defer to the research I have conducted over 18 years of being a resume writer. I am the Career Expert for 5 job boards in 5 different states, 2 more job boards in the Tech field, one in the aviation industry, and one located overseas for the hospitality industry. You do not get to that status by not knowing the hiring industry.

In addition, I write on a contract basis for Monster.com. Believe me, you do not write for Monster unless you KNOW what you are doing and are successful. If their candidates are not successful, you do not work for them very long. I have been writing for them for over two years. Recently one of my resume writing colleagues was turned down by Monster to write for them. They only take the best writers. I also write resume for candidates across the country and world for recruiters.

I know you are not trying to be disrespectful to me or my business. However, I do not do this business "part-time" or for kicks. I spent a great deal of time and money knowing everything that is going on in many industries. That is the perfectionist part of me that wants to make sure my clients have the best information possible.

Just my two cents on this topic.

Kathy

Kathy,

I have looked at your site *which I thought was impressive*, read fan mail on this site pertaining to you, etc, so once again I was in no way, shape, or form attacking you or your business. I personally can only wish you the best of both worlds and hope that your business continues to grow, prosper and does well for you. As I previously stated in the other reply, if I had to do it over again I surely wouldn't have even taken the bite on this thread. He wanted examples and that is what I provided him with. You have your "professional" opinions which I can respect. I just think many things come into play when tailoring a resume as I am sure you are quite aware of.

The department that I was a part of was not overly large, however I did review many resumes and cover letters and my opinions are not only formed by my own experiences but also from those who have been in this business a lot longer than I have been in it for. A lot comes down to personal preference and making sure that the resume is tailored to showcase the applicant's strong points and minimizing the showing of the applicant's weaknesses. Do I have as much experience as you do with regards to this side of the profession?. I think it is safe to say "no", these are just my opinions, nothing more and nothing less.


good luck,

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[350DRIVER]

i dont think the cell # on the resume wont necessarily make or break you. it can put you in a situation you dont want to be in if you're not careful. i've usually listed it on my resumes. i listed it for a few reasons and i'm not saying they are good reasons. at one point i had to because i didnt have a land line, didnt need one. the other reason's i've chosen to list it is because i cant stand waiting.. i wanna know right away if they're calling me. i controlled the call by not answering it unless i was in a position to talk to HR, if i wasnt they left a message just like they would have if they called my house. i would then, in all my anticipation and excitement, take myself to a place that i can return the call and call them back. another reason to consider listing a cell phone is you may not want HR calling when you're not home and your drunk roommates are watching pr0n at full volume. or you may have bad roommates, intentional or unintentionally not giving you your messages for whatever reason.

I agree.. I do not personally think this issue will make or break you either. I have always listed the cell number and will continue to do so for the very simple reason of making sure that I am "always" available to accept those important calls that may come when I am not near my home line. It is easier to have a backup plan in place due to the simple fact that when hr wants to set an interview up they usually want to speak to someone rather quickly to set the interview up and to see if you are still interested in the invitation. I cannot recall how many times this process has taken place via a cell phone conversation versus actually being at home during the time when they called. You cannot be stuck at home and on stby 24/7 awaiting that phone call that may or may not come. Once again, this is my personal preference and in no way should be viewed as a "must". Either way will probably work as long as you are able to retrieve home messages in a timely manner.

It is a tad difficult to monitor this if you are on an extended trip away from home for any period of time.

It was always my belief that you should always be able to accept those important calls whether it be via a cell phone or a land line.


take your pick.

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[TonyC]

It was always my belief that you should always be able to accept those important calls whether it be via a cell phone or a land line.

I can hear it now. In the stall at the men's room at the airport, a cellphone rings. 350 begins the initial phone screening for the airline of his choice while... never mind, we don't need that picture.

 

[FlyChicaga]

About the cell phone number on the resume: In my opinion, I would put it there. I got the call to interview with ExpressJet at 2:00 PM the day before I left for a 5-day trip with my previous company. At my home number. I returned late on a Saturday evening, had Sunday off, and interviewed on a Monday. I had plenty of things I needed to get done to prepare for the interview in those six days which I needed normal business hours (8-5 M-F) to accomplish. If I would have found out on a Saturday about the interview call then I would have missed the opportunity. Delaying the interview may have put me back two or more classes which is over 30 numbers in seniority.

I say put your cell phone number if you currently work in a position that keeps you away from home more often than not. You never know when getting that voicemail or call earlier than not will make the difference. But, a warning: If you are putting your cell phone number down as your primary contact, ensure that you have a very clear, concise, and professional voicemail message.

Edit: One more thing. If you are hoping for a call from your No. 1 airline's HR department, do NOT answer the phone in a bathroom, do NOT answer the phone in a bar, and DO NOT pull a Paris Hilton!!!

 

[350DRIVER]

I can hear it now. In the stall at the men's room at the airport, a cellphone rings. 350 begins the initial phone screening for the airline of his choice while... never mind, we don't need that picture.

worse yet...

the truck driver in stall one (that you didn't see come in) that had beans and cabbage the previous night just sat down on the seat after a long 3 hour drive.


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[Lori Clark]

Just a quick note to address the issues of discriminating factors on the resume. It is important to know here that every airline views this differently. Not that they view discrimination differently, but how they treat a resume which reveals discriminating content. For example, a friend of mine who was with UAL (as a pilot recruiter & interviewer) was not allowed to review resumes which listed birthdates - they were immediately "filed".

I don't know of a lot of airlines who are quite that harsh, but it can happen. Most airlines get around that particular law (with regard to reviewing documentation that shows birthdate - i.e., airman certs) because you must be between certain ages to legally operate a Part 121 aircraft. That is why you are not required to "white out" your birthdate on your documentation before presenting it to the interviewers. Although I know some airlines still practice the white out method.

Bottom line - leave out any personal information other than affiliations. You just don't know what their policy is. And please, please, please never include a picture!

On the note of cell phones - I commonly called cell phones to invite to interview, ground school or congratulate the applicant on their new employment status. I personally vote to include it. But like the others have said, be sure you control when/where you answer it. Oh, and how you answer it too... I placed a call to one applicant who answered with "Talk to me". I laughed about it because after all it was a Friday night, but I imagine there are some folks who wouldn't have thought it funny at all.

Best,

Lori

 

[TonyC]

Hey Lori,

Welcome to FlightInfo ... All opinions are appreciated (in one form or another )



I took a few minutes to peruse your website. It looks like you're in the business of helping pilots get jobs. Rumor has it there are a few pilots that frequent these forums! What a coincidence!


Your bio page... there's a sentence that goes like this:

"Lori and her team has interviewed thousands of pilots and reviewed many, many thousands of resumes and applications. "

Shouldn't that be "Lori and her team have interviewed..."?




Do you have any openings for proofreaders???


Good luck !


(Are you in the PHX area, too???)

 

[Lori Clark]

Just might have to hire me a proof reader!

I never proclaimed to be perfect...LOL Yes, I am in PHX too!


Lori

 

[NickASA]

I had just finished 15 minutes of crying to my best friend about getting an airline job when you called Lori. Good luck with your new business.