more furloughs at AA?

[WyoHerkdriver]

I just read that AA is going to furlough another 125 pilots on October 1st. Has anyone else heard this? AA mainline keeps shrinking while American Eagle and American Connection continue to expand. I sure chose the wrong career.

 

[FN FAL]

They will just make room for em at Eagle. It's the wave of the future...parabolic careers.

 

[AA717driver]

Herkdriver--A friend just got the call from the STL Chief Pilot. I naively thought the bloodletting was done... You didn't pick the wrong career, you just got in it 50 years too late.

Guess that recall's another year away. TC

 

[General Lee]

Yikes.

 

[Neubyfly]

Tha brings the total to 2538

 

[Dizel8]

Sadly, Reuters confirms it as well.

I thought AA was pulling mad dogs out of the desert and recalls would happen?

 

[G4G5]

Their are a few of the unfortunate who were called posting over on the APA's web site. The number that they were quoted was 123. One of the pilots called R.E. the fleet chief, he said No recalls in 2005.

 

[Jeff Helgeson]

More pain and no gain!

I have been making lemonaide for sometime now and can't seem to give it away.

Bring it on!!!

 

[furloughfodder]

If AA didn't buy TWA none of this would be happening!

 

[storminpilot]

http://biz.yahoo.com/rb/040715/airlines_amrcorp_1.html




Reuters
American Will Furlough 123 Pilots
Thursday July 15, 7:32 pm ET

SAN FRANCISCO (Reuters) - AMR Corp. (NYSE:AMR - News), parent of American Airlines, said on Thursday it will furlough 123 pilots, effective Oct. 1, as part of its restructuring agreement.

American, the world's largest airline, previously furloughed 1,356 pilots, with the most recent round coming in March. Furloughs of other workers under the restructuring deal were completed in 2003, AMR said.

 

[CSY Mon]

Yup, saw the good news on the APA B.B.

Called the union to confirm.
Yup, done deal...

AA won't furlough for less than 1 year...Or so they say.
That means no recalls 'till 10/2005, but October being the slow season, no recalls untill spring 2006...Unless r@g-head Osama strikes again.
Hmm, why not become a lawyer or a doctor..?..Oops too late.
JetBlue pilot?...Oops the new 190 pay-rates...
Apply to SWA? Oops, got to resign the AA number to get in there.
Air Atlanta or Konnie Coletta: Oops, long commute and 40 hour days.

If AA didn't buy TWA none of this would be happening!

BUY TWA?
The D.O.H. guys thought this was a merger, surely...?
Or Kit Bond sold cheap cool-aid at the voting stand.

 

[steveg]

Sorry CSY. We forgot for a minute these guys were entitled to a job because of the strenuous interview. It's a shame TWA caused all of this, after all the aa pilot is God's gift to aviation.


In all seriousness, it sucks for the 125. Especially when mgmt and the union led people to believe the F's were done. What a great company. It's a shame people get so worked up over that he!! hole called an airline.

 

[CSY Mon]

Sorry CSY. We forgot for a minute these guys were entitled to a job because of the strenuous interview. It's a shame TWA caused all of this, after all the aa pilot is God's gift to aviation.

???

Still bitter about something are we?
Sorry ya are out of a job and that AA and APA screwed ya out of yer rightful number, or seat, or whatever the whine of the day is.
If you really wanted a senior # on AA's list, you should have applied earlier.
Can't help ya at this stage, much as ya deserve the senior AA seats, jobs, whatever...After all the TWA pilot is God's gift to avitaion...

 

[AA717driver]

Furloughfodder--If AA hadn't gotten TWA, they would have furloughed "real" AA pilots when the 727's got parked. They would be furloughing "real" AA pilots as the F100's leave the fleet. As it is, the remaining TWA airplanes virtually replace, one-for-one, the planes AA is parking.

There are less than half the required number of ex-TWA pilots on the property to staff the remaining ex-TWA planes.

If AA hadn't acquired TWA, you would be just as far or farther from recall as you are now. AND, if TWA had gotten an ATSB loan and survived, AA would have a LCC smack dab in the middle of their heartland eating away at revenues.

Anyway, it really doesn't matter. What's done is done. You're furloughed. I'm furloughed. G4G5 is furloughed. And it's not over. Good luck.TC

 

[Cleared Direct]

http://www.alliedpilots.org/Public/PublicRelations/Hotline/hotline.asp





This is Gregg Overman, APA Communications Director, with the APA Information Hotline for Thursday, July 15.

FURLOUGH ANNOUNCEMENT: APA was disappointed to learn that 123 more pilots will be furloughed by the airline effective October 1. Although the furlough is a delayed result of the master seniority shuffle last year and not entirely unexpected, it is always a painful matter when our pilots are laid off from their jobs.

Since 9/11 2,470 pilots have been furloughed, including 1,356 furloughs as a function of the restructuring agreement in the spring of 2003. The final furlough associated with the restructuring agreement was to have been 350 pilots. This furlough was delayed eight months as American considered summer flying increases, fall schedule changes, and whether pilots would be recalled within the next year.

The decision to furlough less than 350 was based on projected flying increases and the company’s current outlook for pilot requirements. APA is working with management to exercise contractual provisions that will help mitigate the numbers further. Although 123 pilots will be receiving furlough notices, 24 pilots are already on either military or personal leaves of absence. Their status will change from leave status to furloughed status resulting in the net effect of 99 additional currently active pilots leaving the payroll.

The “Furlough Stand in Stead” provision in the contract offers any pilot the opportunity to take a voluntary furlough in place of a pilot scheduled for involuntary furlough. Information about the Furlough Stand in Stead is available under Contract 2003 “letters” on the APA Web Site at the following address (click on this link or copy and paste it into your Web browser):

http://www.alliedpilots.org/Members/Contract/2003/LOA_Stand_Instead.pdf

The Spring issue of Flightline magazine contains a great deal of information for furloughed pilots including furlough pay, vacation pay, recall, non-rev travel, Supplement W Flowback, medical, loans and insurance. It also contains a pull-out reference card of contact numbers and e-mail addresses. All pilots included in this furlough announcement will be eligible for Supplement W Flowback to American Eagle CJ Captain seats. You can access a pdf version of the Flightline issue on the APA Web Site at (click on this link or copy and paste it into your Web browser):

http://www.alliedpilots.org/Members/National/Publications/flightline/flightline.asp

PENSION FUNDING: In other news, United Airlines elected to miss a $72.4 million payment to its pension funds due today. In a filing with the Securities and Exchange Commission, United management said that putting off the payment “enables United to best manage its resources and preserve its options going forward.” Many airline industry analysts have speculated that United may choose to default on pension obligations to make the airline more attractive to investors.

This development at United may lead some of you to wonder about funding levels of AMR’s Defined Benefit plans. APA’s Pension Committee notes that AMR has contributed all funding required through the April 2004 quarterly contribution to its Defined Benefit plans. Pension and Investments, an industry trade magazine, reported that AMR earned approximately 25 percent on its Defined Benefit investments, versus an assumed nine percent rate of return, which further improves funding levels of all AMR Defined Benefit plans.

That’s it for today. Thank you for calling.

 

[AA717driver]

CSY--I wouldn't worry about resigning your AA number if you got hired by SWA. It doesn't seem to be worth much these days.

Wonder who's been drinking kool-aid... TC

 

[75M]

TC,

You're my idol...BTW, it breaks my heart to see 8 SNBs furloughed for every one TWA pilot at this point. As far as applying with AMR sooner, I couldn't check the box on the application that read AArogant AAshole.

To all the junior pukes at AA who screamed and shouted to staple the red guys, congratulations, you got what you wanted. Now you're not gonna be furloughed until many of the good jobs have already been taken (like mine). If you're lucky enough to keep your job with AA, enjoy jerking gear for the rest of our life. From what I've seen of your operation, it's all your qualified to do.

The two happiest days of my life were when I got hired by TWA and when I finished my last trip at AA.

 

[nitrogen]

<<<

TC,

The two happiest days of my life were when I got hired by TWA and when I finished my last trip at AA.

>>>

Interestingly enough, the second part of this sentence was a pretty happy day for AA as well. So you have that in common.

 

[Draginass]

It's all part of the softening up process. AA's got a compliant union leadership and now they're really scaring the pants of pilots with more and more furloughs, parking the F-100s, etc. Next stage is another round of brinksmanship with bankruptsy, only this time it's going to be pensions, probably killing the A fund, and getting 100 seat payrates in-line with JetBlue. Next will be getting 100 seat jets with the expectation of recalls . . . . only what'll happen is MD-80 will start to be parked and those crews transferred to the 100 seat rates.

Time to seriously think about walking away from the vocation.

 

[lowecur]

It's all part of the softening up process. AA's got a compliant union leadership and now they're really scaring the pants of pilots with more and more furloughs, parking the F-100s, etc. Next stage is another round of brinksmanship with bankruptsy, only this time it's going to be pensions, probably killing the A fund, and getting 100 seat payrates in-line with JetBlue. Next will be getting 100 seat jets with the expectation of recalls . . . . only what'll happen is MD-80 will start to be parked and those crews transferred to the 100 seat rates.

Exactly. I would have liked to seen a more forthright approach, but maybe the membership would have flat out rejected it. I see AA stock has been steadily declining, which is an indication that Wall Street expects the same.

 

[CSY Mon]

CSY--I wouldn't worry about resigning your AA number if you got hired by SWA. It doesn't seem to be worth much these days.

Wonder who's been drinking kool-aid... TC

Yeah, ya are right, the bottom 2500 AA #,s won't even buy a cup of coffe.
As for Kool-aid: Ya won't find much in my cup, not a big fan of AMR or APA for obvious reasons.
Being the optimist, I am keeping my number however...Would trade it for a SWA #, but too lazy to commute.

75M

I couldn't check the box on the application that read AArogant AAshole.

Ya seem to be a natural, and that got ya hired with Teeway anyway.

when I finished my last trip at AA

Ya will be missed...Not

 

[Draginass]

If any AA furloughees are waiting for recall thinking that at least the pension will still be there, forget it . . . . that's going to be history real soon . . . . along with the current 100 seat rates. Starting to think that turning down the flow-back slot was a mistake.

Only good news is maybe the Republicans can be sent packing in November. Can't see how it can get any worse under Dems.

 

[trip]

Send the republicans packing WTF? Yea thats the answer, lets put 2 trial lawyers in office!! ALPA endorsed of course--what a joke.

 

[amcnd]

I don't think turning down the flow back slot was a mistake( forever reserve). As managment at Eagle is coming at our reserve system with a axe. The funny thing is we still have pilots at Eagle (that have AA numbers)that have turned down Jetblue/SWA thinking that they will flow through soon. I tell them at the earlist 2010 and then even then they are lookin at going into a 100 seat aircraft getting payed in the low $30 hour range (for the first 4-5 years) with no definded retierment. Maybe jsut the same Eagle 401K. I guess only time will tell.

 

[G4G5]

It's all part of the softening up process. AA's got a compliant union leadership and now they're really scaring the pants of pilots with more and more furloughs, parking the F-100s, etc. Next stage is another round of brinksmanship with bankruptsy, only this time it's going to be pensions, probably killing the A fund, and getting 100 seat payrates in-line with JetBlue. Next will be getting 100 seat jets with the expectation of recalls . . . . only what'll happen is MD-80 will start to be parked and those crews transferred to the 100 seat rates.

Time to seriously think about walking away from the vocation.

Not with 3500+ pilots retiring in the next 10 years.

 

[CSY Mon]

Starting to think that turning down the flow-back slot was a mistake.

I turned down the flow-back option as well:
Too lazy to commute to, and sit reserve in ORD for $4K a month.
Don't think it was a mistake.

There are other jobs out there, even if 75M and the red guys have already taken the good ones.

good jobs have already been taken (like mine).

 

[Goodstick]

Just flew with a couple of flowbacks the other day. They were both on 6 day trips. The new guy..just finished IOE was pretty shocked at his first trip. The other flowback who had been at Eagle for about six months was talking about getting out of Aviation all together and pretty much hated everything about Eagle, AMR, and life in general. Said that he doesn't have a social life anymore because of Eagle and that some of the FO's refuse to even talk to him among other things. I couldn't help but feel bad for the guy because our reserve system is horrible. And our management is really trying to make it far worse by taking away proffering. Good luck and may the tide change with dems in the white house.

 

[CSY Mon]

some of the FO's refuse to even talk to him among other things.

They will probably be talking more, when they flow through to AA...

 

[BoeingBoy]

On the other hand...Eagle is hiring 76/month right now while AA furloughs...so there will be plenty of flow-back spots...maybe I should re-apply as a newhire, so when I get furloughed I can be senior to myself.

 

[Goodstick]

I can't stop staring at that avatar boeingboy....But on a more serious tone as far as flowing thru to AA...even in good times it wasn't happening for the senior guys. As far as those FO's Flowbacks are flying with flowing thru...thats laughable.