More Delta MD90s

[Browntothebone]

How about you play in the highway during rush hour, that would make a lot of people happy!

How bout you give me a smooth ride and not loose my bags when I'm forced to ride on your sorry a$$ed excuse of an airline. And keep the temp in the front rows comfy too.

 

[PeanuckleCRJ]

What is your point? What about the rest of the paying folks in the back? What about the fact that you can take over 4 times the amount of people you can lift on a CRJ-200 and go non-stop for long distances.

RA mentioned in the conference call that he is effectively parking a lot of the regional jets. I am glad he is finally getting the picture. He knew it all along. I think he knows that he can't come to labor any more and he is going to have to cut costs elsewhere,

Glad to hear we are getting MD-90s for our operation. Makes a lot more sense.

I think you missed the point I was i was illustrating a point to a couple RJ guys that referred to us getting MD-90s as "buying more gas guzzlers." Which is obviously far from the truth as I pointed out how inefficent the burn on the CRJ is per passenger as compared to a 757 or MD-90.

You and I are on the same team and same point of view...


FWIW, I've heard for now these will not be growth airplanes, but replace MD-88s and DC-9's 1 for 1. Always subject to change, of course.

 

[AAflyer]

How bout you give me a smooth ride and not loose my bags when I'm forced to ride on your sorry a$$ed excuse of an airline. And keep the temp in the front rows comfy too.

At least their airplanes can carry the passengers' bags.......


AA

 

[Speedtape]

I think you missed the point I was i was illustrating a point to a couple RJ guys that referred to us getting MD-90s as "buying more gas guzzlers." Which is obviously far from the truth as I pointed out how inefficent the burn on the CRJ is per passenger as compared to a 757 or MD-90.

You and I are on the same team and same point of view...


FWIW, I've heard for now these will not be growth airplanes, but replace MD-88s and DC-9's 1 for 1. Always subject to change, of course.

Compare an MD-90 and a 757 burn per passenger seat. Using your logic, the MD-90 should stay in the desert because the seat burn is more than a
757.

What would happen at your airline if you had nothing but 757's? What would happen if you had nothing but MD-90's?

Different airplanes in your fleet have different missions. The idea with a Global airline is to have access to as many markets as possible. Under the concept, it takes many different size airplanes to reach those markets. Regional jets are a part of the armada--and will be until there is a suitable or more efficient replacement. Feed is critical and can make the difference in profitability. Otherwise, Delta would not have began marketing agreements in the mid 1980's. USAir was the catylist in the concept of feed, and competitors soon followed.

 

[PeanuckleCRJ]

Compare an MD-90 and a 757 burn per passenger seat. Using your logic, the MD-90 should stay in the desert because the seat burn is more than a
757.

What would happen at your airline if you had nothing but 757's? What would happen if you had nothing but MD-90's?

Different airplanes in your fleet have different missions. The idea with a Global airline is to have access to as many markets as possible. Under the concept, it takes many different size airplanes to reach those markets. Regional jets are a part of the armada--and will be until there is a suitable or more efficient replacement. Feed is critical and can make the difference in profitability. Otherwise, Delta would not have began marketing agreements in the mid 1980's. USAir was the catylist in the concept of feed, and competitors soon followed.

I did, if you look back one page. It average out to about 2 pounds more per seat per hour.

I illustrated that not to say that the entire airline should be 757s... I'm not stupid, and you shouldn't be thick enough to think that I thought that. DAL has wayy too many CRJs... It's good to see us correcting that.

 

[tzskipper]

Fuel is but a part of the calculation... How are any of you going to make middle management without understanding that simple point?

Skipper

 

[Monster Buck]

Compare an MD-90 and a 757 burn per passenger seat. Using your logic, the MD-90 should stay in the desert because the seat burn is more than a
757.

What would happen at your airline if you had nothing but 757's? What would happen if you had nothing but MD-90's?

Different airplanes in your fleet have different missions. The idea with a Global airline is to have access to as many markets as possible. Under the concept, it takes many different size airplanes to reach those markets. Regional jets are a part of the armada--and will be until there is a suitable or more efficient replacement. Feed is critical and can make the difference in profitability. Otherwise, Delta would not have began marketing agreements in the mid 1980's. USAir was the catylist in the concept of feed, and competitors soon followed.

You confuse feed with crj. Feed doesn't mean only small markets. The feed comes from all size markets. Yes feed is critical to a Global airline. Cutting it out completely can be disastrous but it isn't just small aircraft that do it.

 

[knightflyer]

OMG..This thread has become useless and redundant. Is this possible or is it one in the same.:erm: :crying:

 

[ACL65PILOT]

Yes, there will be RJ's in the Dal system for many moons to come. Fact is that DAL also has been killed by these little jets They will always have some for the reasons that Speed tape so eloquently stated, but to run our route system, the need for the RJ just got knocked down a few rungs.

They 76 seats jets will be here for a long time to come, as will most of the 70's.The 50's will be made in to beer cans as quickly as Coors is willing to take them.

 

[IXLR8]

Oh Brother....

How bout you give me a smooth ride and not loose my bags when I'm forced to ride on your sorry a$$ed excuse of an airline. And keep the temp in the front rows comfy too.

Really?...loose?...

 

[Scope out RJ's]

How bout you give me a smooth ride and not loose my bags when I'm forced to ride on your sorry a$$ed excuse of an airline. And keep the temp in the front rows comfy too.

Mr. Brown on your bone:
Making sure your bags are loose is your responsibility!
And when you deplane, make sure all your loose luggage is with you, LOSER!

Lucky for you, UPS doesn't have reading and comprehension minimums!

 

[Speedtape]

You confuse feed with crj. Feed doesn't mean only small markets. The feed comes from all size markets. Yes feed is critical to a Global airline. Cutting it out completely can be disastrous but it isn't just small aircraft that do it.

Feed should be looked at in totality or in the macro, not the micro. Feed flows both ways--largest to smallest and smallest to largest.

However, all parts are the sum of the whole. Extensive market access is key to accomodate a successful Global marketing strategy, that provides a superior competitive advantage. As they use to say--Anywhere to Everywhere, whether it be from Fayetville, Arkansas to Shanghai, or Moscow to DC.

There are too many 50 seat RJs! Who made that decision? It was a good idea when the economy was at full steam. There may be too many of other aircraft sizes also--for now. Downsizing or streamlining is part of any downturn in the economy. AA eliminated DC-10's in a downturn and Delta eliminated their L-1011's. The trick is not being so aggressive so as to not to be able capture opportunity in the recovery, or more importantly, well positioned to seize opportunity when competitors fail. It seems that the latter is the reason, for now, that there will be no furloughs.

With over $5 billion in liquididty, there is staying power. Without divine intervention or government bailout, there is at least one airline, maybe 2, that will not be around for Ground Hog Day. Right now, it's all about cash flow and liquidity! Cash is King.

If the assumptions are correct, there will be plenty of opportunity on the West Coast. LAX base growth is right around the corner.

 

[Browntothebone]

Mr. Brown on your bone:
Making sure your bags are loose is your responsibility!
And when you deplane, make sure all your loose luggage is with you, LOSER!

Lucky for you, UPS doesn't have reading and comprehension minimums!

Mission accomplished. Thank you for playing. Have a nice day!

 

[FBN0223]

.The 50's will be made in to beer cans as quickly as Coors is willing to take them.

The 50 seat CRJs are certainly a waste of aluminum. These unprofitable Ken & Barbie "fun" jets can't go away fast enough. I'm switching from bottles to cans for awhile in celebration as the demise of the CRJ 50 continues.

 

[PeanuckleCRJ]

Downsizing or streamlining is part of any downturn in the economy. AA eliminated DC-10's in a downturn and Delta eliminated their L-1011's.

Not quite... the L-1011's were replaced by the 767-400.

 

[Scope out RJ's]

Mission accomplished. Thank you for playing. Have a nice day!

You're welcome. Now get back to the playground, schoolboy!

 

[michael707767]

Not quite... the L-1011's were replaced by the 767-400.

SOME L-1011s were replaced by 764s. It was not even close to a one for one replacement.

 

[ACL65PILOT]

Michael, very true. We have not had a 1 for 1 replacement in a very long time.

 

[ACL65PILOT]

Feed should be looked at in totality or in the macro, not the micro. Feed flows both ways--largest to smallest and smallest to largest.

However, all parts are the sum of the whole. Extensive market access is key to accommodate a successful Global marketing strategy, that provides a superior competitive advantage. As they use to say--Anywhere to Everywhere, whether it be from Fayetteville, Arkansas to Shanghai, or Moscow to DC.

There are too many 50 seat RJs! Who made that decision? It was a good idea when the economy was at full steam. There may be too many of other aircraft sizes also--for now. Downsizing or streamlining is part of any downturn in the economy. AA eliminated DC-10's in a downturn and Delta eliminated their L-1011's. The trick is not being so aggressive so as to not to be able capture opportunity in the recovery, or more importantly, well positioned to seize opportunity when competitors fail. It seems that the latter is the reason, for now, that there will be no furloughs.

With over $5 billion in liquidity, there is staying power. Without divine intervention or government bailout, there is at least one airline, maybe 2, that will not be around for Ground Hog Day. Right now, it's all about cash flow and liquidity! Cash is King.

If the assumptions are correct, there will be plenty of opportunity on the West Coast. LAX base growth is right around the corner.

LAX will have some growth but we have a very nice code share agreement with ALK for a lot of it. We will be doing a little more flying there in the near term. In the long term you are correct. IMHO I think that we will be one if not the biggest operator out of LAX in the next five years.

As for feed. You are correct, and that is the way that our company sees it. The RJ has a place. The 50 seat RJ is good for places where they can charge a ton for a ticket. (ALB, BQK et al) The 76 seat jet is a good filler for our 130+ seat jets. It is just a filler though, not replacement.

As you see us go to a different philosophy in how we "net" our passengers from CONUS you will see the need for RJ's totally change. (Less not more) As we see more and more cities served by DAL et al, you will see less frequency to many markets, but the gauge will be larger. It is not that they do not want to offer more service, it is a constraint issue. We need the slots all over this country and what better way to serve more of this great country than to have more cities served by larger jets.

There will always be a DCI, I do not think that anyone can say other wise. The scope of DCI and their scope will change. That is better for this profession. You will see many of these contracts lapse when they come for renewal. Some may get renewed, but they will not look anything like they do today.

This management team is in to getting the most bang for their buck. The way they want to do this is as I described above. There will always be a place for RJs's, just not the place they had today.

To address the ability and desire to move quickly as we see one or two fail and two merge, they are definitely doing this. We are seeing DAL carry a decent amount of pilots for that very reason. We are also keeping our parked aircraft mission ready. The ones that are coming up for their heavy checks, have been parked and as we see the need for these jets rise,they will put them in to their check and have them ready very quickly. Some of that will be happening in the very near term. Some are ready to go. Fact is that our managers are very astute in decision, and when, not if one fails we will be moving quicker than you have seen anyone move.

 

[NuGuy]

LAX will have some growth but we have a very nice code share agreement with ALK for a lot of it. We will be doing a little more flying there in the near term. In the long term you are correct. IMHO I think that we will be one if not the biggest operator out of LAX in the next five years.

As for feed. You are correct, and that is the way that our company sees it. The RJ has a place. The 50 seat RJ is good for places where they can charge a ton for a ticket. (ALB, BQK et al) The 76 seat jet is a good filler for our 130+ seat jets. It is just a filler though, not replacement.

As you see us go to a different philosophy in how we "net" our passengers from CONUS you will see the need for RJ's totally change. (Less not more) As we see more and more cities served by DAL et al, you will see less frequency to many markets, but the gauge will be larger. It is not that they do not want to offer more service, it is a constraint issue. We need the slots all over this country and what better way to serve more of this great country than to have more cities served by larger jets.

There will always be a DCI, I do not think that anyone can say other wise. The scope of DCI and their scope will change. That is better for this profession. You will see many of these contracts lapse when they come for renewal. Some may get renewed, but they will not look anything like they do today.

This management team is in to getting the most bang for their buck. The way they want to do this is as I described above. There will always be a place for RJs's, just not the place they had today.

To address the ability and desire to move quickly as we see one or two fail and two merge, they are definitely doing this. We are seeing DAL carry a decent amount of pilots for that very reason. We are also keeping our parked aircraft mission ready. The ones that are coming up for their heavy checks, have been parked and as we see the need for these jets rise,they will put them in to their check and have them ready very quickly. Some of that will be happening in the very near term. Some are ready to go. Fact is that our managers are very astute in decision, and when, not if one fails we will be moving quicker than you have seen anyone move.

Heyas ACL,

Right you are. Additionally, if the rumored to rest rules come to pass, the marginal RJ operators will fold, as fee-for-departure contracts will NOT be re-negotiated to allow for the higher costs that the rest rules will impose.

Many of the operators will simply go TU, relieving the need of Mama DAL to terminate their contracts. At the remaining carriers, the costs will go up to the point where it is simply more economical to run the lift at the mainline.

The rest rules will also likely require the majors to hire, and there is zero in the pipeline. This will put additional cost pressure on the remaining regionals.

Interesting times ahead...

Nu