Midway to become USAir Express

[LearLove]

"This is interesting... but I don't get it... what's the point... ??? "

boscenter and others,

We at the WO get it, Chris Beebe and MGMT has now shown that they will stop at nothing to destroy the lives and careers of PDT, ALG and PSA pilots. Needless to say we are past shocked and angry we are enraged by this. We have been working for week/months now to come to an agreement w/ MGMT taking pay cuts (even though we arent the ones who need to) being furloughed and downgraded all for just a garauntee of a job whic they won't give and then they go and sign another contract carrier for J4J. I just don't know how much longer we can take it. J4J is racism among pilots. Its just not right.

 

[tintube]

"This is interesting... but I don't get it... what's the point... ??? "

Maybe Midway is the only company that has the equiptment, and crew willing to take the j4j ( if they even have a saying on it...) and be ready to step in as soon as the new TA is signed.....
It is going to take a while for the WO or contract carriers to find financing, get deliveries and train crews.....

 

[surplus1]

canadflyau,

You said:

"However if they do, ALPA will be setting a precedent, and losing the faith of many by allowing the replacement of ALPA pilots' positions with another ALPA pilot. Thus defining a preffered group of pilots within ALPA. Thus not fair and equitable to all pilots equally. They will be toeing a fine line on the definition of promoting scabbing, that is when pilots are taking the work of the current contractual pilot group and while pilots are on furlough... or for that matter even putting pilots on furlough to bring in a pilot from outside the pilot group to take a currently occupied seat to assure the 50% requirement is met."

With all due respect canadflyau, where have you been? ALPA has already set the precedent. The ALPA has already defined a preffered group of member pilots. This Midway deal is no different from what ALPA is already doing to the USAG subsidiaries, ALG/PDT/PSA, nor is it any different from what J4J will do to any ALPA carrier whose pilot group is coerced into agreeing to abrogate its seniority and its contract in favor of the U pilots. To date, only one has, so they're going to Midway because it is seen as a weakest link.

The Midway pilots have no jobs. Chances they will agree to this are better than the chances at other airlines. That's why they went that way. U management wants to get the RJ's flying as quickly as possible, U pilots are furloughed and want jobs. Apparently both are willing to step on anyone to accomplish that.

In fairness to ALPA, the ALPA President (as far as I know) did not sign LOA81. The U pilots have not yet ratified the new TA so the ALPA has not yet had a chance to sign off on it. You technically can't put the ALPA in chains, until Woerth signs it. IMO, there is only one reason why Woerth didn't sign that and that's the RJDC lawsuit.

What do I think will happen? If the U pilots ratify this time, he will sign. At that point, the ALPA will be guilty as charged.

Is this whole thing a change in ALPA's course of action? No it is not. This is no more than a public manifestation of what ALPA has been doing privately for years.

What is the difference between this action and the ALPA's endorsement of predatory scope that would remove the already existing aircraft and jobs of regional pilots? NONE. The end result is the same, i.e., regional pilots lose their jobs which are transfered directly or indirectly to mainline pilots. That's the ALPA agenda and they've been doing it for years. This is just a clear, rather that a subtle, demonstration of the impact of that agenda. It used to be carefully hidden, now the secret is out of the closet for all to see.

This is NOT scabbing, canadflyau. Please don't call it that. There is no picket line. What it is, is a clear manifestation that there exists an irreconcilable conflict of interest within the ALPA, between the major airline pilots and those that are not. Until and unless that conflict of interest is removed, it is essentially impossible for the ALPA to comply with the Duty of Fair Representation statutes.

This is going to get far worse before it gets better. It will take an order from a court to reverse or modify the ALPA's course of action. Nothing less will work. They are not listening and do not care. Either defend yourselves in court or you will be slaughtered and sacrificed on the ALPA's mainline altar.

 

[FurloughedAgain]

Furloughed pilots

Guess you guys woke somebody up. Found this at a furloughed-pilots website.

Newsflash Email
July 18, 2002

If you have not heard as of yet, Midway Airlines has agreed to become a US Airways Express carrier. Between the new contract carriers in
the Carribbean, the existing contract carriers, and the wholly-owned regionals, US Airways now codeshares with approximately 15 airlines.

From time to time when we were at mainline we would taxi past a concourse in PIT or PHL or CLT or LGA that was seemingly filled with regional jets and the captain would grumble about how at one time he flew the 737 to Champaign or South Bend or Toledo. We all know first-hand what he meant as we now see the DC9 flying that WE once did, outsourced to regional after regional. It begs the question though...

How many regional jets does US Airways own?

35? 70? 140? 465 more to come? The answer is ZERO

Most of you are very aware of this but there is still a lot of apathy
out there especially at the mainline. The fact is that US Airways
(as of right now) owns 3 regionals: Piedmont, PSA, and Allegheny. Not ONE of these regional airlines flies a single jet.

I often hear stories about mainline pilots riding on a Dash-8
jumpseat and asking, "So when are you guys getting jets?" -- and the heated response is almost always, "When are you going to LET us?".

Management has successfully whipsawed mainline vs. regional and wholly-owned vs. contract carrier for literally years. Today the mainline pilot group is absolutely hated by their regional
counterparts -- and they dont seem to care. The fact is that all of
these pilots work for US Airways GROUP, but simply for different
divisions. You see the superiority displayed by some "bad apples"
from mainline when they toss a jumpseat form into a Dornier cockpit and say, "I'm taking a seat in the back!" without so much as a respectful request to the captain. It's just not right.

Late last night Midway airlines once again closed its doors and laid off its entire employee group. Within hours there was a press
release from US Airways welcoming them to the 'family'... but this
welcome into our disfunctional little group comes at a price. The
Midway folks will bear the burden of becoming a US Airways contract carrier (partially wholly-owned).

I'm not sure who was slapped harder across the face. The hard
working pilots of the wholly-owned regional airlines who have been supporting this company for years only to see their aircraft and their airlines eliminated in favor of low-cost contract carriers?
The Midway pilots who struggled to build their airline and make it a success who will now have to defer their own recalls as we "affected pilots" steal their seats?

The wholly-owned pilots are angry -- and I believe they have every right to be. Indeed the definition of the word "scab" has become blurred. It is a word that is tossed around when describing any number of pilots who, thanks to the higher-ups in Crystal City, are "taking our flying". (our = whoever makes the statement that day whether it be a mainline pilot looking at an RJ, a wholly-owned pilot looking at a contract carrier, or a Midway pilot wondering where his job went.) This is truly a sad day for ALPA. They're in a jam, and I am not sure there is any way out without sacrificing the integrity of the organization.

I would like you to read a few of the comments made by wholly-owned pilots on one message board or another. The groups are at odds and this too is a failing of the MEC. They have allowed the whipsaw to take place over and over again. They are so worried about themselves and THEIR career that they fail to build a long-range plan. They failed all of us. When this pilot group, as a part of LOA79, voted to negotiate a bidirectional flowthough and the union stopped those negotiations THEY FAILED US. The apathy, the misunderstanding, and the "whats in it for me?" attitude has directly impacted not only OUR career expectations, but those at the wholly-owneds as well. The following is from Flightinfo.com. I believe it to be an accurate representation of the feelings of many of the wholly-owned pilots.

Pilot #1 writes: "I don't see how or why Midway pilots would agree to this with their pilots still on the street.

However if they do, ALPA will be setting a precedent, and losing the faith of many by allowing the replacement of ALPA pilots' positions with another ALPA pilot. Thus defining a preffered group of pilots within ALPA. Thus not fair and equitable to all pilots equally. They will be toeing a fine line on the definition of promoting scabbing, that is when pilots are taking the work of the current contractual pilot group and while pilots are on furlough... or for that matter even putting pilots on furlough to bring in a pilot from outside the pilot group to take a currently occupied seat to assure the 50% requirement is met."

Pilot #2 writes: "Good for MIdway? Are you kidding? Have you ever worked for a USAirways wholly owned??"

Pilot #3 writes: We at the WO get it, Chris Beebe and MGMT has now shown that they will stop at nothing to destroy the lives and careers of PDT, ALG and PSA pilots. Needless to say we are past shocked and angry we are enraged by this. We have been working for week/months now to come to an agreement w/ MGMT taking pay cuts (even though we arent the ones who need to) being furloughed and downgraded all for just a garauntee of a job which they won't give and then they go and sign another contract carrier for J4J. I just don't know how much longer we can take it. J4J is racism among pilots. Its just not right."

I dont write this to start yet another battle of "well its my flying!
no its not its MY flying". I post it to raise a little awareness not
so much within our little group of permanent furloughees -- but to
the few mainline pilots who read this. US Airways Group has 4
airline subsidiaries. US Airways, Piedmont, Allegheny, and PSA. No
ONE is more important than any other. These groups should be unified and constantly working with each other to enhance the mainline, expand all their career expectations, and keep as much of the flying as possible within the group. It seems to me that there is an elitist attitude out there that needs to stop. Had they worked together years ago there would have been a strong, bidirectional flowthrough that would have minimized the impact to your careers. Instead management has seen that each pilot group will vigorously defend their own, and by creating 15 contract carriers, they are able to breed a civil war among pilots.

Mainline pilots, when next you taxi by a Dash-8 try and remember that it could be a furloughee. Try giving your brother a nod and wave. Its not much -- but it's a start.

<getting off my soapbox to put my USToo sticker on my
flightkit>

 

[surplus1]

Whomever wrote the messages you posted for us did a great job.

He obviously reads this board so, whomever you are, I salute you!

 

[LearLove]

"US Airways Group has 4
airline subsidiaries. US Airways, Piedmont, Allegheny, and PSA. No
ONE is more important than any other. These groups should be unified and constantly working with each other to enhance the mainline, expand all their career expectations, and keep as much of the flying as possible within the group."

AMEN TO THAT!!!!!!!!!!

 

[Checks]

How can a company which is close to Chapter 11 and asking Uncle Sam for loan guarentees even be considering buying another airline?

This airline business sure doesnt follow the rules of business that I learned. Very confusing!!!

 

[eaglefly]

ALPA national again preying on the weak for the benefit of mainline. ALPA disgusts me. They want my money for ALPA PAC to help them protect against baseball arbitration. PACK SAND ! I say let scope fall ! Regionals will explode with 90 seaters and since there will be no more collective bargaining, we can dump that band Enron/Worldcom crooks. They never made any effort to improve regional carriers anyway. Keep it up ALPA, dig your grave deeper and deeper.

 

[tarp]

Free enterprise, competition, capitalism, financial management.

Gentlemen - the roller coaster is coming to end of the track and the free ride is over - not saying that it was an especially enjoyable experience.

USAirways is just "playing the game". This is high stakes poker. CHQ said "no" to J4J if I read all the news correctly. The WO's don't want this shoved down their throat. The Mesa guys are talking about it, but their undercurrent is to say "no".

So then you look down the road to RDU and see an airline company that's going flat on its back after the 9/11 money runs out. What if you buy them out? They will do anything for a buck or to save a job right now. J4J sounds perfect to Midway mgmt. They stay afloat and they make their new customer very happy.

The USAirways message to all of the WO's and partners is this: "play ball or get cut out". CHQ says no but is buffered by the new Delta Connection contract. But they arent going to feel too good if USAirways says "sorry, we no longer need your services - Midway will be getting your lines." Mesa will get the message and play ball. So now USAirways has J4J working and turns to the WO's: "Are you guys going to play ball or do we cut you out (they ask)?"

It's a good hand with a bluff and a call to boot. I applaude USAirways business accumen but this stuff is hard to take when you are a union member. With the old contract with US Airways ALPA, the company in Crystal City had no wiggle room to stay in business - they were hosed - couldn't get smaller jets to compete with everyone else - they need this J4J contract to work so that they can get labor costs and fleet costs down.

As to us and our look to ALPA. Well as an old business man, I figured their game out a long time ago. My local MEC has one charter and one charter only - maximize the number of dues paying members. Period. They are almost a business. They need income and it is completely derived by increasing the size of the membership. Ergo, anything which creates more jobs is a plus. There is no loyalty to seniority. There is no loyalty to major vs. RJ. There is no real requirement for them to look out for your best interest (other than they have to create just enough incentive to "keep" you as a member - i.e. not voting them out).

J4J creates jobs. It gets people off of furlough, it keeps USAirways from going under, it creates all those "other" seat positions that will sit in the 300 RJ's that still have to be delivered.

I'm sure in the larger plan, US Airways still has a place for one "prop" carrier. Heck, somebody has to provide service for Hagerstown, MD and Cumberland, MD. Are you going to run a 50 seat RJ in there? No. The same for hundreds of small communities. So you keep one of the WO's (let's say ALG) with their Dash fleet and you spread them out to all the "small" towns and cities. (US Airways practically has a monopoly on that stuff anyway.) Then you have your 300 RJ's and the rest of the Airbus and 767 fleet. Nice blueprint if you can just keep those pesky pilots from creating a single group that would raise salaries.

This is business at it's best (but also it's worst). The organism which is a corporation wants to live and grow. It does this by lowering expenses and raising income - the best business model is to deliver a "quality" product for the lowest cost to produce at a perceived premium or "luxury" price. A corporation lives to maximize the wealth of a stockholder. Employees are an expense and always will be.

So don't be surprised by what you see. It's just the business model at work. Your response should be to remind your union that their charter is not necessarily to keep making more dollars by inviting in more members but to represent the members in COLLECTIVE bargaining for the good of all. Their job should be to maximize YOUR wealth by fighting for strong contracts and protecting your jobs. This will take cooperation by all pilots under the same union.

I've watched Philly teachers get every thing they want every September by simply working together and not showing up for the first day of class. I watched as the trash collectors in Quebec told the citizens just exactly what they wanted. Ever look to England and what exactly an english coal miner gets in the way of compensation? We need to start studying strong unions and then become one.

You may fire away. I'm just the messenger, though. Business is business and employees can either represent themselves or elect to have collective bargaining. This is how the world turns.

 

[canon]

help

So what do I do if one of the WO's offers me a job in a DO-328? Is it a definite one way short trip, or is there any chance?