MESABA TA - Let's make one thing clear

[mesaba2425]

And to think that I used to get bashed for warning the pilots not to drink the Kool-Aid that their ALPA reps were serving. Live and learn I guess.

 

[JetPilot_Mike]

Comair 50 seat 5 year Captain = $65.51

Maybe CoEx.....

 

[saabtrash]

Our payrates, at least for captains, go above pinnacle after the first year of the TA, not by much, but they do. Another thing is our work rules, which I'm sorry to say are much better...and you know it. Is that an insult? No, it is fact, and I hope you can attain them in your next contract, along with a good pay raise. I agree that Mesaba guys bash pinnacle for their payrates too much, and wrongly in most cases. But that is what happens when you are uninformed. However, I hate to say it but you are uninformed when you say our TA is PURE garbage. There are a lot of improvments in it. It will probably get voted in by a narrow margine, that is my prediction. I for one will probably still vote no. With that being said, if it does get voted in, we are still way above Mesa, and will sit in the middle of the pack, are we raising the bar? In some areas yes, in others no. Are we lowering it? I don't think so. We got industry leading Saab pay, so so pay for the avro, and definitely **CENSORED****CENSORED****CENSORED****CENSORED**ty pay for jet fo's. When it comes down to it, like I have asked before, what do you want us to do? Do you really expect us to go on strike for a few months to raise the pay on an aircraft that we don't have? Put yourselves in our shoes for a minute before you make your final decision. And flt ops, you said before you know who I am, if you have a problem, come chat with me.

 

[NEWSOUTH]

Our payrates, at least for captains, go above pinnacle after the first year of the TA, not by much, but they do. Another thing is our work rules, which I'm sorry to say are much better...and you know it. Is that an insult? No, it is fact, and I hope you can attain them in your next contract, along with a good pay raise.





Your CRJ rates do not go above and never did.
You Sir, are the one who is misinformed. Your work rules are not much better than ours. Sorry, but I disagree.

The real difference in the two companies are clear to me. My Mesaba freinds, who were hired 4 months before I was hired at PCL, are still sitting reserve as FO on the SAAB. Meanwhile I am have been a jet captain for two years holding a line with 1500 PIC JET. I am getting ready to move on to better places and let you guys figure it out. That is the real jewel of PCL. Not to mention we have nothing to be ashamed of when compared to Mesaba's old or new contract. Only the good Lord blessed me with a call from PCL HR before Mesaba called me or I would be in your shoes (Cuga's).

 

[Rez O. Lewshun]

Before voting on any TA....go to a roadshow and hear the MECs explanation of why.

Very typical of guys to talk trash before an explanation... then they get briefed and then they starting thinking....

Understanding is knowing and not necessarily agreeing. (stick that in your Zen machine!)

(spell check plz!!)

 

[saabtrash]

Newsouth, I'm going off of what I have seen. Here are YOUR rates, off of the ALPA website, if you don't agree, take it up with alpa national. Here are our rates on the TA, you are right, we make less than you for the first year, that goes for both captain and fo, but that is also on a jet that we won't have the first year of the deal. So here are the rates for DOS +1, and then I jumped to DOS +4, because I didn't feel like typing all day. Once again, I'm not saying it's great, but I also don't like it when I see things on here that I know aren't true. So here we go:
Here are pinnacles rates as of May '04:
PCL 44/50 seat jet CA/FO
1. 55.07 20.73
2. 56.76 24.39
3. 58.51 30.09
4. 60.31 33.28
5. 62.14 34.31
6. 63.96 35.06
7. 65.52 35.64
8. 67.42 36.23
9. 69.62
10. 71.62
11. 73.68
12. 75.80
13. 77.96
14. 80.21
15. 82.37

Here are Mesaba's, DOS +1 year:
MSA 40-59 seat jet CA/FO
Date of signing +1 year
1. 55.42 23.54
2. 57.09 28.22
3. 58.81 30.99
4. 60.57 33.75
5. 62.37 34.76
6. 64.26 35.80
7. 66.19 36.87
8. 68.17 37.98
9. 70.21
10. 72.32
11. 74.48
12. 76.71
13. 79.02
14. 81.40
15. 83.83
16. 86.35
17. 88.94
18. 91.61
Here is pinnacle's again (repeated for easier viewing):
PCL 44/50 seat jet CA/FO
1. 55.07 20.73
2. 56.76 24.39
3. 58.51 30.09
4. 60.31 33.28
5. 62.14 34.31
6. 63.96 35.06
7. 65.52 35.64
8. 67.42 36.23
9. 69.62
10. 71.62
11. 73.68
12. 75.80
13. 77.96
14. 80.21
15. 82.37

Here is Mesaba DOS +4 years:
MSA 40-59 seat jet CA/FO
Date of signing +4 years
1. 61.14 25.97
2. 62.98 31.14
3. 64.88 34.19
4. 66.82 37.24
5. 68.81 38.35
6. 70.89 39.50
7. 73.02 40.68
8. 75.20 41.91
9. 77.45
10. 79.78
11. 82.17
12. 84.63
13. 87.18
14. 89.80
15. 92.49
16. 95.27
17. 98.13
18. 101.06

So yes, Newsouth, you are partially right, you will be paid more than us for an aircraft which we do not have for the first year of this TA, then both captain and FO is higher at XJ. Is it enough, I don't think so. But I'm just stating the facts. It appears that you are uninformed. Also, what, the beauty of pinnacle is to get your pic time and move on? Where are you going to go? I thought the whole point about raising the bar at the regionals was to improve our quality of life, because it isn't as easy to move on anymore. That statement is the exact reason why we don't get paid what we are worth, too many of us view regional jobs as a stepping stone to something more tolerable. So what should we do at XJ then? Should we follow that same notion, sell out and take all of your jets away, simply so we can become captains and go somewhere else? I don't think so.

 

[NEWSOUTH]

No Man, you are showing my 3 year pay as if I had to wait until I had 4 years.

3 yr. CA pay is 60.31 this is 3-4 year pay
I make at 3 years until I become 4 years. At four years I make what you have listed at 5 years.
You have done this for the whole graph.

Quick moving the numbers around brother.

YOU ARE MISINFORMED

Our pay is higher from start to finish now and before.

 

[NEWSOUTH]

You have not only reduced our rates by one year, you have given yourself 2% increase on you sighning rates. Come on man.

 

[NEWSOUTH]

Pinnacle(5/1) Mesaba TA(49-59seats)

0-1 55.07 54.33
1-2 56.76 55.97
2-3 58.51 57.66
3-4 60.31 59.38
4-5 62.14 61.15
5-6 63.96 63.00
6-7 65.52 64.89
7-8 67.42 66.83
8-9 69.62 68.83
9-10 71.62 70.90 14-15 82.37 82.19

And you got a raise to get that.

58.17 is your current 3 yr avro pay.

 

[saabtrash]

I wasn't using avro pay, I was using our rate for crj's. I have no frickin clue how you are getting those numbers, I'm looking at them with my own eyes, and you make no sense.