MESA TA passes 78%

[bahjaus]

Sleepy said:

"It is pretty clear that the MESA pilots have decided to advance their careers by being the lowest cost regional carrier. They will do this at the expense of Skywest, AWA, ACA, and all of the AAA WO's. That is a business decision they made, and that is the way this business works."

My Comment:

Please tell me how is it any different than SWA pilots signing a long-term contract back in 94 (I yhink it was 10 years long) with pay rates for 737 way below DAL, UAL and AMR; so their company can grow fatser and get more market share.

 

[BeechScrub]

I keep reading all of these colorful statements from pilots at other regionals and I can't help but wonder, what is it do you think we owe you anyway? You don't work for our company and you don't have to live under our contract.

These are the worst economic times in the history of the airlines, all three of our codeshares are either bankrupt or have govenment money in their pockets, and the current administration wouldn't even entertain the thought of an airline strike. We have an MEC that consists of a bunch of white-trash boneheads and a management that was whipsawing 3 pilot groups. Had the Mesa pilots not accepted the TA, they probably would be out of a job in the very near future. I don't know about you, but I've been furloughed before, it sucks and I have a family to feed.

Now I'm hearing talk about how we should have shut the company down. Mesa Air Group employs about 3500 people, only about 1400 of them are pilots. You mean to tell me that we should go tell the rest of the employees that we're going to shut this company down because we would not accept an aggreement that has modest improvements in every section.

You can hate us all you want, but we don't owe any other pilot group anything. The jumpseat works two ways.

 

[CitationLover]

throw the flag....common sense is here

bahjaus,

stop bringing sense to a nonsense conversation. how dare you?


thunderchief,

if you want to trade insults fine. you need to get your profile right. it should say butt plugger.

 

[sleepy]

Sleepy said:

"It is pretty clear that the MESA pilots have decided to advance their careers by being the lowest cost regional carrier. They will do this at the expense of Skywest, AWA, ACA, and all of the AAA WO's. That is a business decision they made, and that is the way this business works."

My Comment:

Please tell me how is it any different than SWA pilots signing a long-term contract back in 94 (I yhink it was 10 years long) with pay rates for 737 way below DAL, UAL and AMR; so their company can grow fatser and get more market share.

It is no different, that was my point.

 

[cocknbull]

CitationLover

Get your head out of your @ss. You sound as if taking pride in your job and having enough self worth to fight for a good wage is some liberal ideology. BS...... I am a die hard Republican, but I have enogh self respect for myself to realize that what I do is worth more than $22,000 a year. ACA and it's pilots are top notch. For you to even hint that you take satisfaction in another pilots hardship makes me sick.

Piss off you twit

 

[RJPilott]

However when SWA pilots signed their contract, they still made more than any FA and were able to live a decent life. You guys would have been better off getting an FA job at another carrier. I think jB and SWA FA's get paid more than you and have MUCH better QOL....

 

[Beantown]

It is no different, that was my point.

That's funny. I did a search of your posts and I didn't see any completely trashing SW? I also did a site search and can't find any threads that were outright trashing southwest for doing exactly what you say Mesa is doing. Why the difference? Maybe b/c even though SW has a long term contract that was designed to low ball the entire industry you would love to go there? -Bean

 

[DruDown]

Amongst all of the hostility here, most of you have made a good point - "we will all have to work harder to get a better deal." Yes, work hard! Have we all forgotten our work ethic. If your company slides you the Mesa TA, slide them back a proposal that explains how and why the company can and should give you a better deal. Put a little elbow grease in your negotiations, don't just hollar "we want this because that's what they got!"

Negotiate and argue the facts at YOUR company, not the facts at Mesa. Show your management how you can still be competative and make more money. Do the research, crunch the numbers, and offer a viable, comprehensive, factual argument. ENOUGH with the pointing fingers!

The more the pilot groups point fingers, place blame and argue with ourselves, the more leverage each management will have. You don't like what he Mesa guys signed, FINE, but guess what you don't have to live with it, they do. You're afraid your managment will only accept a similar deal, OK, don't let them, you fight the battle, you go on strike, you potentially lose your job. You think running the company into the ground and being out of work is better than a mediocre contract - sounds like your priorities are a little misarragned.

Let's not forget, the Mesa guys still have their jobs, have brought Freedumb into the union, have made some improvements from the previous contract and have created jobs for furloughed pilots from US. While it's not tremendous, it is a step in the right direction. And let's remember, an airline is a business, in which the goal is to generate revenue and create a profit. We are simply the labor that provides a means for the company to accomplish those goals. You're not happy about being just labor, fine, move into management!

In the end, you only have your MEC to hold accountable for what your company accepts. Your MEC speaks and for you - NOT the Mesa pilot group! If you're not happy with the outcome of YOUR negotiations at YOUR company, blame YOUR MEC and YOUR management!

Deny the jumpseat to all the Mesa pilots? Are you kidding me! Are we in elementary school still! Don't you get it, with this kind of behavior you're playing right into the hands of every management - you're weaking the union even more by creating more division within it. You want better at your job, you fight for it at your company, but stop all of the childish figner pointing, blame placing, and game playing. Everyone cries about "professionalism," well now is the time to be professional, accept that the Mesa TA has been ratified, let the Mesa pilots deal with the consequences of their actions, and fight intelligently at YOUR OWN COMPANY if you don't want a similar deal.

 

[Beantown]

Re: Compared to 7 year old Skyway contract

THUNDERCHIEF wrote

"We get 10 days off, regardless of month length...."

[/B][/QUOTE] You must not get it. B/c the Mesa contract is based on 13 month bid you can basically add one day to the guaranteed days off. That makes line holders at 11 days off. Not great but better then your 10

"The 19 seat pay rate we agreed to in 1997 is just PENNIES below what you guys agreed to last week....."

I'm sure you right. The fact is that the 1900's at Mesa are losing money hand over fist under the current (old now) contract. They are bringing down the profits of the whole company significantly. JO offered the N.C. much HIGHER jet rates if they would allow a "B" scale for the Props. How are you supposed to ask for huge pay increases on an aircraft type that is losing Millions every quarter? JO said that if they stuck to this he was going to shutdown AMW. This would have resulted in hundreds of furloughs. Lets face it, the 1900 is on its way out of the scheduled airline business. At least at the larger regionals.

"The 32 seat jet compared to the big turboprop pay, we make about $5 more an hour....."

You shouldn't compare jets to props. How are you 32 seat jet rates compared with ACA?


"The sh!ttly thing is we're in negotiations RIGHT NOW, next week when we're with the National Mediation Board, staring our soul-less management in the face. Guess what their gonna slide across the table. THE MESA TA!!!"

I'm sure they will. You will then slide it back to them and say that you are a different airline dealing with a different set of circumstances. Explain to them that they have no leverage to immediately transfer assists, causing a mass furlough of our pilots. Tell them they need to negotiate based on your situation at Skyway! Opps, with the way things are going with Midwest express that may not be your best option. Your better off blaming the Mesa pilots for you problems.

"How can we ask for anything when a company 10 times our size, agrees to less pay, less days off, longer days than we have
RIGHT NOW!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!"

See above

-Beantown

 

[Thunderchief]

Bean wrote:

I'm sure you right. The fact is that the 1900's at Mesa are losing money hand over fist under the current (old now) contract. They are bringing down the profits of the whole company significantly. JO offered the N.C. much HIGHER jet rates if they would allow a "B" scale for the Props. How are you supposed to ask for huge pay increases on an aircraft type that is losing Millions every quarter? JO said that if they stuck to this he was going to shutdown AMW. This would have resulted in hundreds of furloughs. Lets face it, the 1900 is on its way out of the scheduled airline business. At least at the larger regionals.

The fact is here at Skyway, the Beeches are making money...

I'm not blaming anyone Bean, I'm just saying it sucks and makes our job a little harder...

-Thunderchief