Mesa files ch11 bankruptcy

[lindsaya99]

• Mesa is the number one operator in the US Airways system based on the same metrics. They have held this position for more than three years.

Give me a break. Get ACARS and then we will see how well you do.

 

[OCP]

A quick check (Delta) shows F8 next to last on A0 and A14, month to date. And that is doing a whopping 92 (approx) flights a day. It's interesting that it shows F8 near the top of D0 and near the bottom of A0 and A14. Hmmm... no ACARS?

 

[CX880]

A quick check (Delta) shows F8 next to last on A0 and A14, month to date. And that is doing a whopping 92 (approx) flights a day. It's interesting that it shows F8 near the top of D0 and near the bottom of A0 and A14. Hmmm... no ACARS?

YES. It's amazing that US airways still allow them to do it, too cheap I guess.

 

[rene]

Oh those Pesky Facts

A quick check (Delta) shows F8 next to last on A0 and A14, month to date. And that is doing a whopping 92 (approx) flights a day. It's interesting that it shows F8 near the top of D0 and near the bottom of A0 and A14. Hmmm... no ACARS?

How do these number show Freedom NEXT TO LAST?

Here are the numbers June Through December. Note that Freedom is number 1 in all three contract categories. Do you think for a minute that if Delta thought Mesa was cheating they wouldn't put an army of auditors in the field to verify?

Such BS has to stop.

TCFJune - DecemberRankComair97.23%ASA98.58%Skywest99.53%Freedom99.68%1Republic99.42%Shuttle97.77%Pinnacle 98.95%Pinnacle NW98.33%Mesaba98.27%Compass98.25%DL Mainline99.38%D-0June - DecemberComair74.25%ASA62.32%Skywest73.37%Freedom90.53%1Republic79.83%Shuttle80.50%Pinnacle 65.30%Pinnacle NW75.38%Mesaba76.57%Compass71.35%DL Mainline64.55%A-14June - DecemberComair73.50%ASA73.63%Skywest88.22%Freedom90.98%1Republic90.07%Shuttle82.80%Pinnacle 78.07%Pinnacle NW84.50%Mesaba86.53%Compass81.82%DL Mainline80.35%​

 

[BHopper88]

Again how many flights does Freedom have a day for the Delta ops? Isnt it like 70 flights a day? And what was your ontime when you were in JFK vs Comair?

How is that performance on the united side?

So are you saying Freedom is better than Mainline Delta since you blow them out of the water with on-time performance..

 

[OCP]

How do these number show Freedom NEXT TO LAST?

Here are the numbers June Through December. Note that Freedom is number 1 in all three contract categories. Do you think for a minute that if Delta thought Mesa was cheating they wouldn't put an army of auditors in the field to verify?

Such BS has to stop.

TCFJune - DecemberRankComair97.23%ASA98.58%Skywest99.53%Freedom99.68%1Republic99.42%Shuttle97.77%Pinnacle 98.95%Pinnacle NW98.33%Mesaba98.27%Compass98.25%DL Mainline99.38%D-0June - DecemberComair74.25%ASA62.32%Skywest73.37%Freedom90.53%1Republic79.83%Shuttle80.50%Pinnacle 65.30%Pinnacle NW75.38%Mesaba76.57%Compass71.35%DL Mainline64.55%A-14June - DecemberComair73.50%ASA73.63%Skywest88.22%Freedom90.98%1Republic90.07%Shuttle82.80%Pinnacle 78.07%Pinnacle NW84.50%Mesaba86.53%Compass81.82%DL Mainline80.35%​

I don't even know how to read what you put up there. What does that show? I only looked at the chart I know how to get to and it was month to date and is what I stated above.
A0 F8 is 38% 2nd to last behind RP. A14 F8 is 62.3% 2nd to last behind OH. However D0 F8 is 79.8% which is first place. Tell me how you justify that connection. Info from ourasa.com.

 

[Fltlvls]

Hey Dash, pssssst. You are full of BS. Where do I start?

First of all, please take a look at Mesa's pilot contract? http://www.mesapilots.com/ How is it inferior to any of the quality airlines you reference? As a quick test, look at the BK records and divide pilot pay by the number of pilots. Compare this number with the rest of the industry. Hint; Mesa is on the high side of the analysis. Also, while there is talk of Management cancelling PBS and removing some of the benefits, this hasn't happened yet and it isn't likely to happen. I have seen several letters from Management to the MAG - MEC and it is clear that there is a sincere interest by both parties in resolving the disputes underlying this issue.

While it may be sporty to come on here with an anonymous screen name and make up BS intended to bash Mesa, there are simply no facts to support these allegations.


Here are some publicly disclosed facts for you all to consider.

• Mesa is the number one operator in the Delta system based on CCF, TCF, and A-14. This has been true for the last six consecutive months. They also have the best inflight performance of any regional based on Delta's own data - (see court records).
• Mesa is the number one operator in the US Airways system based on the same metrics. They have held this position for more than three years.
• In the UAL system Mesa, in spite of a 5% point disadvantage basd on its city pair schedule (flying into the ATC and weather challenged Northeast cities) improved its D-0 performance by 15% pts year over year. Overall CCF at United is a very competitive 99.1% for the ful year 2009.

So in fact, contrary to common concensus, Mesa is among the BEST operators in the industry. Oh those pesky facts keep getting in the way of your perceived reality. I hate it when that happens. Here are a few more facts for you to consider.

• Delta wanted to agressively reduce capacity when fuel peaked and (per the judge - acted in "BAD FAITH" cancelling the Freedom contract.) This will cost them in the BK.
• United didn't renew with Mesa because Sky West put up $118 million and Express Jet gave them 40% of the company. These decision had nothing at all to do with Mesa's performance. Both Sky West and Express Jet acted out of desperation because Mesa's lessors were about to cave on rents. This is an an indication of bad things to come at other "Quality Regional Airlines".
• Bottom line - There are simply too many 50 seat jets in the market place and their corresponding leases and contracts our not in synch. This is the only reason for the Mesa BK and will be the reason for future regional bankruptcies. You can be certain that Mesa will simply reject the excess leases and come out even stronger and even more competitive than it is today.

I am stunned that you folks cannot see how self defeating this type of behavior is. On behalf of the 3,400 people who work hard every day at Mesa trying to earn a living in this crappy industry, I suggest that you back off and take a look in the mirror.

You are looking at your future - enjoy the view.

Nicely stated rene !!!..I would hate to be at a regional that operates only 50 seaters..Talk about having all your eggs in one basket when big brother mainline wants to cut those out obviously..To all the Mesa bashers..Enjoy the unemployment line behind everyone else !!.As some of the A-holes on here have said KARMA IS A B!TCH!!!.. :laugh:

 

[JoeMerchant]

Great idea. Totally impractical in getting started. Everyone would never agree on an integration solution.

Then "living to fight another day" is the best option...

 

[rene]

Freedom performance

I don't even know how to read what you put up there. What does that show? I only looked at the chart I know how to get to and it was month to date and is what I stated above.
A0 F8 is 38% 2nd to last behind RP. A14 F8 is 62.3% 2nd to last behind OH. However D0 F8 is 79.8% which is first place. Tell me how you justify that connection. Info from ourasa.com.

I posted a chart but unfortunately it is displayed as text. What it shows is the average performance of all carriers for the past six months and Freedom is number 1 in the metrics measured. Freedom operated 100 flights a day.

They also operate a CCF of 99% 2009 full year for UAL. These performance numbers are more than competitive. Sorry the facts don't support your Mesa bashing fantasy. What numbers are you looking at? 6 days of January with 2 bad weather days in CVG? Give us all a break and step away from the keyboard.

Incidentally, if you take the time to review the Delta court documents (which I know you will not) you will discover that Freedom outperformed Comair for every month it operated out of JFK. This is a major point of the lawsuit. This is in spite of the fact the Delta; established the schedules, the block time, did the ground handling, the bags, the catering the passengers and the fueling and deicing. Nevertheless Delta cancelled the contract and disparaged Mesa'a reputation (maybe irreparably) A good example is the incorrect perception of pilots on this board.

In any case my point is this. Mesa is not what you may think (or may want to believe) either internally or externally. Many of us love this company and are determined to see that it survives.

 

[Metro752]

Mesa is not going anywhere. They declared BK. If anything they are just going to dig in deeper now.

 

[rene]

Mesa

A quick check (Delta) shows F8 next to last on A0 and A14, month to date. And that is doing a whopping 92 (approx) flights a day. It's interesting that it shows F8 near the top of D0 and near the bottom of A0 and A14. Hmmm... no ACARS?

Wrong date Freedom is at the very top in A-14 for the July thru December period. Number 1, Numero UNO baby, simply the BEST

Stop speading false data. Why do you hate Mesa so much?

 

[Erlanger]

Lets not everyone get too excited. Remember, the cockroaches survived the meteor strike that wiped out the dinosaurs, so Mesa may linger on.

 

[Fltlvls]

Wrong date Freedom is at the very top in A-14 for the July thru December period. Number 1, Numero UNO baby, simply the BEST

Stop speading false data. Why do you hate Mesa so much?

That is problem with people on this forum is that they have never been on the inside of Mesa and how things operate.I'm not saying it was a great place to work sometimes, but the pilot group was some of the best people I have ever worked with.The information is mostly second hand or is based on assumptions from hear say.The Mesa pilots that people have spoken with are probably RSVs who will always say "this place sucks" because they are on RSV and have only been there a year or two.I guarantee the problems that exist at Mesa also exist at other regionals when you start asking questions regarding specifics on how the pilot group is being treated by management.So no sugar coating required.

 

[BHopper88]

Yea I am sure every regional has a CEO that has covered up things with a "well i guess that information was lost when we found one of our executives computers was infested with porn viruses".

I am sure all the people who work for Mesa are great, nice people, who are dedicated to their job. The times I have jumpseated on Mesa the crews were more than nice and helpful in every aspect, and if I had the option I would love to fly with them personally. But you work for a company that is KNOWN TO LIE, to investors, the courts, its partner major airlines, and its own employees... You dont have to go far, look at the Aloha/GO! case.

I guess it just must have been reserves that told the media about crews sleeping in the airplane or in the airport on standups. I am sure that happens all the time at Expressjet, SkyWest, Mesaba, etc. What about the attention of the crews falling asleep at GO? I am sure it was just bitter pilots that talked to the media about their work schedules.

Yea we all drink a little company Kool-aid from time to time, but EVERY pilot that I have talked and worked with that used to work at Mesa was glad they got a chance to ESCAPE, and then the ones that I have jumpseated with had the attitude of "there is nothing we can do, we greivence it and the company still wont follow thru. How about the original start of FREEDOM... Wasnt that one of the original whipsaws of the regional era?

The sad thing is that you actually think we have hatred for you as pilots, rampers, etc, its JO that we all cant stand. HE IS THE FACE OF MESA, He is one of the few faces that is actually bad with this industry, but you stand behind him like lemmings thinking he will get you out of this "funk" to prosperity. There is a REASON WHY YOUR COMPANY IS IN THE POSITION IT IS IN, and yes there is a lot of pride at mesa, I give you that, but to think you are at the same level as a company, that is publicly traded (or at least will be till the 14th) as a SkyWest, ExpressJet, Air Wisky, you are dreaming. How are those work rules you guys fought so hard for going with your new contract. Hell we dont have a union, and we still have better work rules and thats without a contract.

But again like you said ALL AIRLINES have inside problems, just like there really isnt a perfect family. But then again my airline (SkyWest) has a ton of money in the bank, is very good with its money and investments, even thou I might not agree with all my management decisions.

 

[topdawg]

Let's be very clear about this since you know everything. The Mesa pilots are not doing this, their MEC and ALPA is. Word on the street is that ALPA by be voted out and another screw you union comes in. Obviously, you need more education.

I would love to be proved wrong

 

[Fltlvls]

Yea I am sure every regional has a CEO that has covered up things with a "well i guess that information was lost when we found one of our executives computers was infested with porn viruses".

I am sure all the people who work for Mesa are great, nice people, who are dedicated to their job. The times I have jumpseated on Mesa the crews were more than nice and helpful in every aspect, and if I had the option I would love to fly with them personally. But you work for a company that is KNOWN TO LIE, to investors, the courts, its partner major airlines, and its own employees... You dont have to go far, look at the Aloha/GO! case.

I guess it just must have been reserves that told the media about crews sleeping in the airplane or in the airport on standups. I am sure that happens all the time at Expressjet, SkyWest, Mesaba, etc. What about the attention of the crews falling asleep at GO? I am sure it was just bitter pilots that talked to the media about their work schedules.

Yea we all drink a little company Kool-aid from time to time, but EVERY pilot that I have talked and worked with that used to work at Mesa was glad they got a chance to ESCAPE, and then the ones that I have jumpseated with had the attitude of "there is nothing we can do, we greivence it and the company still wont follow thru. How about the original start of FREEDOM... Wasnt that one of the original whipsaws of the regional era?

The sad thing is that you actually think we have hatred for you as pilots, rampers, etc, its JO that we all cant stand. HE IS THE FACE OF MESA, He is one of the few faces that is actually bad with this industry, but you stand behind him like lemmings thinking he will get you out of this "funk" to prosperity. There is a REASON WHY YOUR COMPANY IS IN THE POSITION IT IS IN, and yes there is a lot of pride at mesa, I give you that, but to think you are at the same level as a company, that is publicly traded (or at least will be till the 14th) as a SkyWest, ExpressJet, Air Wisky, you are dreaming. How are those work rules you guys fought so hard for going with your new contract. Hell we dont have a union, and we still have better work rules and thats without a contract.

But again like you said ALL AIRLINES have inside problems, just like there really isnt a perfect family. But then again my airline (SkyWest) has a ton of money in the bank, is very good with its money and investments, even thou I might not agree with all my management decisions.

Careful what you say about Skyworst have a ton of money in the bank. Several other airlines had a lot of money in the bank also.As far as Freedom A is concerned, at least they are no longer operating as a non union carrier.So you can thank the Mesa pilots for taking it in the shorts in return for not getting a good contract in order to stop Freedom.Ask Trans States about how that is working for them by not capturing scope and stopping their management by not being able to create an alter ego airline ever again such as GOJets. As for little jabs about the crew falling asleep .Once again you haven't read the facts.The Captain was finally diagnosed with acute sleep apnea that went undiagnosed.You are the typical uneducated dumb a$$ that is not even educated about Freedom, how long ago was that?.Has your management ever lied to you about anything?..I bet they have.I agree that if you ask anyone in this industry about JO they will not say anything nice about him, even the Mesa pilots.As for Mesa saying "just grieve it", yeah that's true, it's happened, some of what pilots can and can't do under ALPA is governed by the RLA and rules set by ALPA national...I would love to see you tell your management"Fck you I'm not doing that" You would see yourself in the unemployment line in the blink of an eye since you have no representation by a union.As with Skyworst, ExpressJet and AirWhiskey ALL of you have "paid to play" if you can't read by the previous post about that.I can't wait for Delta and US Airways to tell you guys "Thanks for the cash,now go pound sand we are pulling your 50 seaters " . As for crews sleeping in airplanes and airports,that was their choice, they are provided hotel rooms during a stand up.You are considered to be "on duty" the entire time from start to finish on a stand up since there is no required rest needed.
Your little accusations are unjustified and not accurate given you do not have a clue about the facts, as I have filled in some of the gaps in your "story." As far as little stuff like being de- listed ..sooooo what!!!! ..I really don't see how anything you have posted about Mesa are relavant to anything regarding their BK and how they got there.Nice job in making yourself look stupid.:laugh:

 

[mesaserf]

Wow.. After reading this entire thread I finally under understand something. That is how the Germans were able to recruit other Jews to police the ghettos it WW2.

 

[NoJoy]

Wow.. After reading this entire thread I finally under understand something. That is how the Germans were able to recruit other Jews to police the ghettos it WW2.

Post of the day

 

[WalterSobchak]

Nice job in making yourself look stupid.:laugh:

...says the guy who seems unable to form an actual sentence, use proper punctuation, or even put a space between individual thoughts.

 

[i fly boxes]

Wrong date Freedom is at the very top in A-14 for the July thru December period. Number 1, Numero UNO baby, simply the BEST

Stop speading false data. Why do you hate Mesa so much?

Thats false, we all know that Pinnacle is Simply the Best - it says so in our slogan! False advertising man!