MESA -200s for UAL...TOAST

[Speedtape]

Sorry, you are wrong. These provisions are not enforcable and have no connection whatsoever to safety standards. Many airlines have filed for BK protection very few have ever had safety issues.

Bottom line is this. IF Mesa files for BK they can restructure under the protection of the court. Depends on the type of bankruptcy filed and whether the judge ascertains whether the entity is a viable on-going concern that, should it survive, can have a reasonable chance of paying off creditors--otherwise, it's Chapter 7 Liquidation. Limited or no revenue streams = non viable entity

That same court will never allow Delta or any other customer to cancel the contract. This is a matter of law. It has already been tested is many courts. This clause is simply unenforcable.
You are pulling this one out of your arse! Most contracts contain an escape clause for mutual protection that gives contractual relief should either party become insolvent or in a financial condition that impacts the party's duties and the ability to perform those duties as prescribed in the contract. No contract or judge would legally bind a party to a boat anchor. A contract really means nothing--paper with words. It only means something when there is a dispute, major or minor, when one or the other party falls short of fullfilling it's duties, and the contractual terms and meaning is interpretated by a 3rd party.

I'm just guessing--but I would think, in this case, that the larger company has a larger artillery and or armada in the form of legal council plus DEEP pockets to wage a successful legal battle--most often called "Staying Power!"

Mesa will survive and flourish

Survive--maybe in the Bastions of China or Hawaii, but in small force. Even La CockaRoaches survive.

Flourish--to grow luxuriantly : thrive-- No Maas, Notta, Nil, or "Turn Out the Light, the Party's Over!" Even Frank Lorenzo was put out to pasture. Ba-Bye!

 

[DoinTime]

Sorry, you are wrong. These provisions are not enforcable and have no connection whatsoever to safety standards. Many airlines have filed for BK protection very few have ever had safety issues.

Bottom line is this. IF Mesa files for BK they can restructure under the protection of the court. That same court will never allow Delta or any other customer to cancel the contract. This is a matter of law. It has already been tested is many courts. This clause is simply unenforcable.

Mesa will survive and flourish

So you are saying these provisions that were explicitly written into Mesa's service agreement for this exact circumstance were just in there take up space? Hows it feel to think you are smarter on the subject of bankruptcy than all the lawyers that assembled this contract?

 

[Speedtape]

Sure they can. BK only gets you off the hook with your VENDORS and CREDITORS. It's a one-way street.
Pardna, those rules changed right after NWA and Delta filed for Bankruptcy--the coming change in laws was the causal effect of their bankruptcy. Under new laws, no one gets off the hook. The liability and duty to pay still remains for the whole amount. Now, terms may change, if the new type of Bankruptcy is ordered by the court. If they owe you a $100, they will still owe you a $100--no discounting or cancelling is allowed. Thank those changes to the Banking Industry and their Lobbyists.

It cannot force your CUSTOMERS to keep using you...especially if their contract specifically lets them off the hook if you file BK. It's a reasonable contractual provision since a BK regional airline cannot be expected to maintain safety standards.

?????whatcha mean, Verne???? Customers, in the loose sense, are never legally bound in a business relationship. Free to Come, Free to Go! However, if 2 parties enter into a contractual relationship, then that is a different situatation. But, I think I know what you be saying, and I'm down with it! Your safety standards argument is a huge issue in these matters, because it involves Government regulation, in addition to public and media perception. In this matter, from an FAA perspective, if Major Airline D contracts with Minor airline M, Minor airline M has to not only comply with it's own ceritifying requirements, but it also has to operate and meet most if not all requirements of Major Airline D, except those where differences are prescribed by regulation. Initial Certification as well On-going ceritification requirements are governed by "Fiscal Fitness Standards" that are regulated to certain high standards, and cannot be compromised without putting Certification at risk. Most of the time, when airlines start having known financial problems, they go on a "watch list" and all practices, especially Maintenance, come under more scrutinty and oversight by the FAA to make sure that Certification standards in all areas are still met.

 

[sniper]

Mesa ia not going to file and 10 more 700's are to be placed with UAL starting 9/10/10

 

[pdub20s]

Mesa ia not going to file and 10 more 700's are to be placed with UAL starting 9/10/10

Source?

 

[Broke in CVG]

Mesa ia not going to file and 10 more 700's are to be placed with UAL starting 9/10/10

Nope! They were UNABLE to obtain financing for the addition 700s.

 

[Metro752]

We need sources!

 

[Broke in CVG]

Bottom line is this. IF Mesa files for BK they can restructure under the protection of the court. That same court will never allow Delta or any other customer to cancel the contract. This is a matter of law. It has already been tested is many courts. This clause is simply unenforcable.

Mesa will survive and flourish

I can tell you for a fact that you are absolutely 100% wrong. The day that Mesa files, the Delta contract will be canceled and there is absolutely NO legal recourse Mesa has to prevent this.

 

[dowhite2]

They were only required by Oct 31st to provide UAL expected delivery dates of the additional 700s. Who is to say that hasn't happened?

 

[Broke in CVG]

They were only required by Oct 31st to provide UAL expected delivery dates of the additional 700s. Who is to say that hasn't happened?

It didn't they couldn't get the financing.

 

[dowhite2]

U 100% about that? I'm hearing rumblings to the contrary

 

[Junkflyer]

Go! passenger count drops 13.6%

Mesa Air Group's go! said a decline in visitors to Hawaii contributed to the interisland carrier transporting fewer passengers in October than a year earlier. The airline saw its passenger count fall 13.6 percent to 54,867 from 63,482.
The 3-year-old carrier also said its load factor, or percentage of seats filled, declined to 65 percent from 70.8 percent following the near-term requirement to accommodate an initial overflow of customers following the merger with Mokulele Airlines.
Revenue passenger miles decreased 17.5 percent to 7.8 million from 9.4 million, and available seat miles shrunk 10.1 percent to 12 million from 13.3 million.

 

[brokedash]

According to last weeks press release, MAGs deal with AAR allows MAG to discontinue all payments for parts and service on a fleet type if MAG stops flying that type. What does this mean? Possibly that JO is working to return all the ERJs to Brazil and transfer the 200s coming off UA to F8 to do the DL flying.

It would save MAG $ in acft mx related expenses/crew training and keep income coming in to pay the plane leases. Of course this scheme is subject to certian variables happening.

 

[Broke in CVG]

U 100% about that? I'm hearing rumblings to the contrary

100% certain.

 

[rene]

I guess we'll find out?

I can tell you for a fact that you are absolutely 100% wrong. The day that Mesa files, the Delta contract will be canceled and there is absolutely NO legal recourse Mesa has to prevent this.

I can tell you for a fact that you are absolutley 100% wrong. So if/when Mesa files and Delta cannot cancel. We will know. PM me if you want to point some money on it?

 

[Broke in CVG]

I can tell you for a fact that you are absolutley 100% wrong. So if/when Mesa files and Delta cannot cancel. We will know. PM me if you want to point some money on it?

Ah... no you are wrong. What you are talking about is an Executory Contract. Put simply, it's a contract between a debtor and another party under which both sides still have important performance remaining. The U.S. Supreme Court defined the term as a contract in which ""performance is due to some extent on both sides" N.L.R.B. v. Bildisco & Bildisco, 465 U.S. 513 (1984). In the Ninth Circuit, a contract is executory if the obligations of both parties "are so far unperformed that the failure of either party to complete performance would constitute a material breach excusing the performance of the other."

The contract between Mesa and Delta is not an Executory Contract. In addition, the contract stipulates provisions for the repudiation of the contract in certain cases, one of which is if either party files for Bankruptcy.

Sorry Charlie, but you are 100% wrong.

Since obviously you are idiot, maybe you can read it directly from
Mesa's 10k (top of page 8)

At the end of the term of the Amended DCA, Delta has the right to extend the agreement for additional one year successive terms on the same terms and conditions. Delta may terminate the Amended DCA at any time, with or without cause, upon twelve months prior written notice, provided such notice shall not be given prior to the earlier of (i) the sixth anniversary of the in-service date of the 30th aircraft added to the Delta Connection fleet by the Company, or (ii) November 2012. The Expansion DCA terminates on the tenth anniversary of the in-service date of the first aircraft. At the end of the term, the Expansion DCA will automatically renew for successive one-year terms on the same terms and conditions unless Delta provides us 180 days prior written notice of its intention to not renew such agreement.

The agreements may be subject to early termination under various circumstances including:
• If either Delta or we file for bankruptcy, reorganization or similar action or if either Delta or we make an assignment for the benefit of creditors;
• If either Delta or we commit a material breach of the code-share agreement, subject to 30 days notice and cure rights; or • Upon the occurrence of an event of force majeure that continues for a period of 30 or more consecutive days. In addition, Delta may immediately terminate the agreements upon the occurrence of one or more of the following events: • If there is a change of control of Freedom or Mesa;
• If there is a merger involving Freedom or Mesa; • If we fail to maintain a specified completion rate with respect to the flights we operate for Delta during a specified period; or • If our level of safety is not reasonably satisfactory to Delta.