MD90's off the table @ DAL?

[ultrarunner]

What are the differences between the MD82/83 and the 88?

The -88 upgrade was essentially a basic EFIS panel, different engine/systems instrumentation, and a systems annunciator upgraded.

Prior to the -88, all the models essentially had the old DC-9 style steam-guage panels. Unless specifically ordered or later upgraded...which many have been.

Delta -88

<http://www.airliners.net/open.file?...l &photo_nr=2&prev_id=0740924&next_id=0482582

AA -82

<http://www.airliners.net/open.file?... &photo_nr=13&prev_id=0321875&next_id=0310818

 

[igneousy2]

I think if Delta wanted more MD88's they would probably settle for MD83's, the difference between an 88 and an 83 is so small that it would be difficult to have enough to teach a 30 minute differences class - especially since most MD 83's that i've seen have the EFIS upgrades. From a numbers perspective the numbers would be identical as 88's have the same performance/capacity as 83's.

While the MD90 from a pilot perspective is not much different than an MD88, from a numbers perspective the difference is quite significant. MD90s have some extra seats and have bigger more fuel efficient engines.

 

[johnsonrod]

I think if Delta wanted more MD88's they would probably settle for MD83's, the difference between an 88 and an 83 is so small that it would be difficult to have enough to teach a 30 minute differences class - especially since most MD 83's that i've seen have the EFIS upgrades. From a numbers perspective the numbers would be identical as 88's have the same performance/capacity as 83's.

While the MD90 from a pilot perspective is not much different than an MD88, from a numbers perspective the difference is quite significant. MD90s have some extra seats and have bigger more fuel efficient engines.

If DAL wanted MD83s I think they would buy them. However, it is more of an operational flexibility and performance issue when you exclude price considerations. I don't think those MD83s operate too well out of SLC in the middle of the summer. That's the concern - MD90s provide that much more flexibility year round. That's the point.

 

[~~~^~~~]

Another point is the fuel burn. The -90 burns 15% less than the -88 and is very competitive with the 737NG on short routes where the effect of the 737's more modern wing is negated.

 

[Sedona16]

Two Delta managers spoke to guys in SLC today. They both were intimately familiar with what is being discussed at HQ. One of them is part of a team that has been making contingency plans with regards to strategies going forward. He said the MD90's aquisition is alive and well. When asked how many we are talking about he said 9. He said they are in excellent shape. He said it really comes down to Anderson deciding if the price is right and right now he thinks they should cost less that what is being offered. The board has already approved the purchase and its up to him to pull the plug. I would say they are more on the table than off at this point.

Other items mentioned. 100 seaters are still a ways out. This guy speaking said the EMB's are available second hand right now (JB is trying to get rid of some) but the airplane is a piece of junk basically. The 737-600 is not selling for a reason. The airplane he said that was the most interesting to Delta right now is the Airbus A318 but you cant get one for at least five years from Airbus and they are a hot commodity, especially in Africa for whatever reason. I know it sounds crazy talking airbus but he represented himself as part of the team that has been studying these things. To be honest I'm not sure why these two guys had this meeting. I have to think they are traveling to all the domiciles as spokespersons to improve communications to all pilots. They opened the floor for questions for about half an hour. It was interesting when a senior captain asked one of these managers would he be able to sleep on the ER flying into Eastern Europe knowing there were two new hires with less than roughly 100 hours each in type. He said he would not be worried about that as much as he would be worried about going into Africa with low time guys. At the end of the discussion the senior captain expanded his scenario with the hundred hour new hires up front with the captain sleeping in the back by suggesting a medical lockdown, where the captain was then denied cockpit access while the new guys had to fly into Europe. The manager said he would not be concerned based upon the quality of the pilots being hired right now. The whole exchange was pretty humorous.

One of the pilot managers said there will be lots of hiring next year of pilots and flight attendants. They are also looking for even more serious upgrades to the international fleet as far as comfort and ammenities to be state of the art. He admitted the business class would have been cutting edge ten years ago but not industry leading right now. Delta wants industry leading. Also mentioned working on further improving flight attendant friendliness and performance. They are sending "mystery shoppers" into cabins to see who the problem flight attendants are and talk with them about their performance if it is not creating a good customer experience. Overall though flight attendants are doing much better and their staffing will be improved to keep them more fresh and not worn out as has been the case with short staffing.

Now getting up to fifteen 757's instead of thirteen. Delta and specifically Anderson is penny pinching right now to improve an "already strong balance sheet" and be in a strong position should the industry see another downturn and mergers kick in for example. It was also mentioned American is in deep trouble going forward with debt. They service 800 million per year at this point and are carrying debt "similar to what Delta had before BK."

Thats about all I remember but thought I would chime in since these guys say the 90's are not dead. Carry on.

 

[johnsonrod]

Two Delta managers spoke to guys in SLC today. They both were intimately familiar with what is being discussed at HQ. One of them is part of a team that has been making contingency plans with regards to strategies going forward. He said the MD90's aquisition is alive and well. When asked how many we are talking about he said 9. He said they are in excellent shape. He said it really comes down to Anderson deciding if the price is right and right now he thinks they should cost less that what is being offered. The board has already approved the purchase and its up to him to pull the plug. I would say they are more on the table than off at this point.

Other items mentioned. 100 seaters are still a ways out. This guy speaking said the EMB's are available second hand right now (JB is trying to get rid of some) but the airplane is a piece of junk basically. The 737-600 is not selling for a reason. The airplane he said that was the most interesting to Delta right now is the Airbus A318 but you cant get one for at least five years from Airbus and they are a hot commodity, especially in Africa for whatever reason. I know it sounds crazy talking airbus but he represented himself as part of the team that has been studying these things. To be honest I'm not sure why these two guys had this meeting. I have to think they are traveling to all the domiciles as spokespersons to improve communications to all pilots. They opened the floor for questions for about half an hour. It was interesting when a senior captain asked one of these managers would he be able to sleep on the ER flying into Eastern Europe knowing there were two new hires with less than roughly 100 hours each in type. He said he would not be worried about that as much as he would be worried about going into Africa with low time guys. At the end of the discussion the senior captain expanded his scenario with the hundred hour new hires up front with the captain sleeping in the back by suggesting a medical lockdown, where the captain was then denied cockpit access while the new guys had to fly into Europe. The manager said he would not be concerned based upon the quality of the pilots being hired right now. The whole exchange was pretty humorous.

One of the pilot managers said there will be lots of hiring next year of pilots and flight attendants. They are also looking for even more serious upgrades to the international fleet as far as comfort and ammenities to be state of the art. He admitted the business class would have been cutting edge ten years ago but not industry leading right now. Delta wants industry leading. Also mentioned working on further improving flight attendant friendliness and performance. They are sending "mystery shoppers" into cabins to see who the problem flight attendants are and talk with them about their performance if it is not creating a good customer experience. Overall though flight attendants are doing much better and their staffing will be improved to keep them more fresh and not worn out as has been the case with short staffing.

Now getting up to fifteen 757's instead of thirteen. Delta and specifically Anderson is penny pinching right now to improve an "already strong balance sheet" and be in a strong position should the industry see another downturn and mergers kick in for example. It was also mentioned American is in deep trouble going forward with debt. They service 800 million per year at this point and are carrying debt "similar to what Delta had before BK."

Thats about all I remember but thought I would chime in since these guys say the 90's are not dead. Carry on.

So, are 787s off the table for awhile? What happened to the 100+ 787s to replace all of the 767-300s five years from now? Perhaps the only way to get them at DAL would be through a merger with NWA?????